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    dme
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    Voice stress test

    I have taken the cvsa twice now for two different dept. Both times the det. told me that I was not being completly honest. The "dishonesty" was for different questions. Is it normal for the det. to pick a questions and grill you on that one to see if there is anything there?

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    Quote Originally Posted by dme View Post
    I have taken the cvsa twice now for two different dept. Both times the det. told me that I was not being completly honest. The "dishonesty" was for different questions. Is it normal for the det. to pick a questions and grill you on that one to see if there is anything there?
    Are you admitting you were dishonest?

    1. Stop Lying.
    2. Yes it is thier job to "grill" you if they think you are lying.
    3. Stop Lying.

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    dme
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    I was telling the truth both times.

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    Explain: "The "dishonesty" was for different questions"

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    CVSA is like the polygraph, I.e. it's an investigative tool. If you didn't lie, you have nothing to worry about.

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    ^^^^yeap^^^^
    The tool is not infallible. If you didn't lie, and it doesn't contradict your BI, then don't worry about what a machine says.

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    dme
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    [QUOTE=Michigan;2351557]Explain: "The "dishonesty" was for different questions"[/QUOTE

    What the machine was saying was dishonest. The first time the computer said that there was dishonesty on one questions, the second time it was on a different question.

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    Stop lying. Geez. They can use it if they want to. Hiring is entirely up to them. Why should they waste time on someone who hits "dishonest".

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    To the OP. First of all, I'm neither a Polygraph or Voice Stress Examiner. Having said that, I feel safe in advising you neither instrument can tell if you're lying or not. They are both investigative tools, and both have their share of detractors. They are, however, pretty much a fact of life in the LE hiring process. The Examiner for either instrument is not the one who does the hiring, but merely passes on his/her findings to those higher up in the hiring chain. When all the smoke clears and the dust settles, you know your background better than anyone on this forum. If you're being truthful, continue to do so. If you're not, then you're probably already history. On the same note, never, under any circumstances, admit to conduct for which you're not guilty. Good luck in all your efforts.

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    I appreciate all the input. I will keep pluggin along and telling the truth.

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    Medevial ages.....still using gadgets to see if someone is lying....remember in history all the "ways" of determining if someone was telling the truth, how's about the witch hunting of Salem...etc....

    Do some serious research on line and you can find out info youwant to know about "truth detection"

    Let's do this: All you out there ask around for the next few weeks to see if someone you know lied while taking a truth verification exam.....you would be surprised how many have in fact done so, yet are still hired on board.

    With that all out in the open, be honest at all times!!

    Just my 2 cents worth

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    All forms of lie detectors are based off what your body "normaly" does when you lie. If your telling the truth "witch to allot of people in the field your not 110%" and it still says your lying then you seem to not have much control of your stress factors in your body. They want people who can handle stress very well. Part of the reason they use polys and voice stress indicators is to see how well you handle stress. Now I am no professional, but it seems the only logical reason why one would be tripped if you are in fact being completely honest.
    "Men are like steel, they lose thier temper they lose thier worth." Chuck Norris.

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    Quote Originally Posted by THaselton View Post
    All forms of lie detectors are based off what your body "normaly" does when you lie. If your telling the truth "witch to allot of people in the field your not 110%" and it still says your lying then you seem to not have much control of your stress factors in your body. They want people who can handle stress very well. Part of the reason they use polys and voice stress indicators is to see how well you handle stress. Now I am no professional, but it seems the only logical reason why one would be tripped if you are in fact being completely honest.
    I've done the polys before and its just a matter of who the inquisitor is to be honest with you. My guy was pretty good and straightforward with me not a whole lot of bluffing stuff, anyone can fail if the guy running it wants to make you look deceptive he can. Its a machine, NOTHING can read the truth but God. This reads they bodys functions not truth or lies. So deception is not really deception but the body functions that could be associated with deception. Garbage.

    I have friends that have passed at some depts and failed at others, imagine that. They are garbage but part of the process(the polys not the guys ). Wish congress had to use one, only problem is there would not be any reps left for us.

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    Quote Originally Posted by THaselton View Post
    All forms of lie detectors are based off what your body "normaly" does when you lie. If your telling the truth "witch to allot of people in the field your not 110%" and it still says your lying then you seem to not have much control of your stress factors in your body. They want people who can handle stress very well. Part of the reason they use polys and voice stress indicators is to see how well you handle stress. Now I am no professional, but it seems the only logical reason why one would be tripped if you are in fact being completely honest.
    I do agree that all forms of lie detectors only detect a physiological response and a baseline must be established prior to getting to the meat of the test. The reason for the response is presumed to be deception nothing else. ANY strong experience can result in the physiological response. If you were raped when you were young, you will probably show a response to sex questions. If you were abused when you were young you might show a response to those type questions. If you just had a prized $40K widget stolen, you would most likely show a response to theft questions. The presumption is that since you showed a response you committed the crimes, not that you were the victim. As is taught in interview 101 each person has a trigger. It is up to the interviewer to determine that trigger. The lie detection technology does not take history into consideration and if one of your triggers happens to be something that you are being tested for it can show deception when, in fact, none is present.
    But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object, evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new guards for their future security.

    For the intelectually challenged: If the government screws the people enough, it is the right and responsibility of the people to revolt and form a new government.

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    The CVSA is junk "science" at its finest.

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    I'm confused. So basically what I am reading and comprehending, is that it's pretty much a toss up if you pass or not? And if you are the victim/witness to something (theft, murder, rape etc), you could trigger the machine into saying you committed those things?
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    Quote Originally Posted by LS1Blue View Post
    I'm confused. So basically what I am reading and comprehending, is that it's pretty much a toss up if you pass or not? And if you are the victim/witness to something (theft, murder, rape etc), you could trigger the machine into saying you committed those things?
    That's pretty much accurate. It can go even farther, in that if you were raised to have high guilt complex you could hit positive for even the most minor things. On the other hand you could pass if you were raised to not feel guilty about anything.
    But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object, evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new guards for their future security.

    For the intelectually challenged: If the government screws the people enough, it is the right and responsibility of the people to revolt and form a new government.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kc12 View Post
    That's pretty much accurate. It can go even farther, in that if you were raised to have high guilt complex you could hit positive for even the most minor things. On the other hand you could pass if you were raised to not feel guilty about anything.
    Wow. I am more confused than I was before.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LS1Blue View Post
    Wow. I am more confused than I was before.
    If you were raised to have a guilty conscious you will be more likely to show deception, even though anything you have done is irrelevant. Often a person will be told not to include taking minor things from work like a pen, paper clips, or printing something at work for personal use, etc. If you were raised to have a guilty conscious you will show positive on deception for those items. Since the tests only measure a physical response and you feel like you did something wrong you will show a response, if you answer no to a question asking if you had ever stolen something from work. If you were raised to not have a guilty conscious then you would be less likely to show deception even if you took cases of paper clips or pens from work. Does that clear it up a bit?
    But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object, evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new guards for their future security.

    For the intelectually challenged: If the government screws the people enough, it is the right and responsibility of the people to revolt and form a new government.

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    just try not to let your voice sound like you're going through puberty again and you will be fine...
    It's not the will to win that matters...everyone has that. It's the will to prepare to win that matters.
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    Quote Originally Posted by kc12 View Post
    If you were raised to have a guilty conscious you will be more likely to show deception, even though anything you have done is irrelevant. Often a person will be told not to include taking minor things from work like a pen, paper clips, or printing something at work for personal use, etc. If you were raised to have a guilty conscious you will show positive on deception for those items. Since the tests only measure a physical response and you feel like you did something wrong you will show a response, if you answer no to a question asking if you had ever stolen something from work. If you were raised to not have a guilty conscious then you would be less likely to show deception even if you took cases of paper clips or pens from work. Does that clear it up a bit?
    I see. So it really is not detection per say correct? It just registers I'm guessing high or low voice tones and it's up to the interpreter to figure if the person is lying or not. It wont say "LIE" in big red letters, but the interpreter, through extensive training is keen on finding out the lie or truth? And with the Guilty or Not guilty conscious, it determines on how you feel, whether you are lying or not?
    Last edited by LS1Blue; 06-04-2010 at 06:08 PM.
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    that is why this method is flawed
    Last edited by bigdog904; 06-27-2010 at 09:44 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bigdog904 View Post
    ding ding, if you believe you are telling the truth even if it is a big fat lie it will not detect it. If you are telling the truth but are real nervous or unsure of your answer or intimidated you can very well show up as "deceptive". This is a handicap on the L/E community yet it is still used.
    Gotcha. Now it makes sense why a lot of people say they are nervous, going into the test. I never understood why, because if you tell the truth you will pass, so you should be as cool as the other side of the pillow. But after understanding this, I can understand the nervousness.
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