Page 1 of 2 12 Last
  1. #1
    Bring the Noise
    dontcallmeradio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    South
    Posts
    1,143

    careless driving citation

    Today I got a "Careless Driving" citation Statute 316.1925.1 Because the woman in front of me slammed on her breaks and I rear-ended her. I also slammed on my breaks but slid into her, we were both doing maybe 15 mph. We were at a stoplight that was red and it turned green so we proceeded forward but I guess the guy in front of her stopped so she slammed on her breaks to miss him then I slammed on my breaks and slid into her, I pushed her into him because she was pretty much on his bumper to start with. None of the 3 veh's had much if any damage, neither of them got cited. I read the statute and I don't understand how I can be given "CARELESS DRIVING" because i was in the rear.. for trying to stop when she slammed on her breaks.. Is this worth disputing? and if so HOW? its $168 bucks.

    FLORIDA STATUE 316.1925.1
    1) Any person operating a vehicle upon the streets or highways within the state shall drive the same in a careful and prudent manner, having regard for the width, grade, curves, corners, traffic, and all other attendant circumstances, so as not to endanger the life, limb, or property of any person. Failure to drive in such manner shall constitute careless driving and a violation of this section.

    2) Any person who violates this section shall be cited for a moving violation, punishable as provided in chapter 318.

    The Trooper was a real nice guy, and the fine isnt a big deal. I was just wondering if I should dispute it in court because I severly dislike points / traffic school. Does this sound like the correct charge for this infraction?
    Last edited by dontcallmeradio; 03-26-2010 at 01:35 AM.

  2. #2
    NOT banned
    crass cop's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    the great midwest
    Posts
    4,174
    I would have cited you for "following too closely" or "inattentive driving"...........due to you being too close, you hit her. Even if she slams on her brakes, if youre a correct distance away then you will have time to stop and avoid striking the other vehicle.
    If you dont think the statute applies to your situation then go to court...BUT I would think the repsonding officer thought that due to you being too close or driving too fast that you disregarded the "due regard...to traffic"

    Its an accident, not an "on purpose"...it happens...just be glad nobody was injured. You will be fine
    "Lighten da' cargo...Fer' a chick wid' big boobs...cause I like boobs, big boobs...."
    Da Admiral Sully

    "To the open-carry nut-rider, a firearm is his persona, a soap-box, and his reason for being. By strapping one on, he proclaims to the world, 'even though I didn't get hugs as a kid, somebody's going to By Golly pay attention to me now'."
    slamdunc

  3. #3
    Relocation Expert
    madchiken's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    US
    Posts
    2,597
    Because you failed to yield and crashed into a stopped vehicle and/or were following too closely. It is your responsibility to be able to stop if the vehicle in front of you stops.

  4. #4
    Bring the Noise
    dontcallmeradio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    South
    Posts
    1,143
    Quote Originally Posted by crass cop View Post
    I would have cited you for "following too closely" or "inattentive driving"...........due to you being too close, you hit her. Even if she slams on her brakes, if youre a correct distance away then you will have time to stop and avoid striking the other vehicle.
    If you dont think the statute applies to your situation then go to court...BUT I would think the repsonding officer thought that due to you being too close or driving too fast that you disregarded the "due regard...to traffic"

    Its an accident, not an "on purpose"...it happens...just be glad nobody was injured. You will be fine
    Thank you for your response

    But my question back is.. Does it make a difference since we were stopped at a stop light and immediatley after we took off it occrd? I dont stop at a light with 3 cars inbetween us.

  5. #5
    It's Complicated
    Iowa #1603's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    15,830
    Quote Originally Posted by dontcallmeradio View Post

    Does it make a difference since we were stopped at a stop light and immediatley after we took off it occrd? I dont stop at a light with 3 cars inbetween us.
    Nope.

    Let the driver in front get far enough ahead of you so that YOU can stop should that driver have to stop.

    Iowa has the "following to closely" or "failure to stop in an assured clear distance" statutes that would cover this type of violation.

    The bottom line is if you hit someone from the rear--------------YOU are almost always at fault.
    "Arguing with idiots is like playing chess with a pigeon - no matter how good you are, the pigeon will still crap all over the board and strut around like it won anyway."



    I don't know it all, I know a little about a lot and a lot about a little---slamdunc


    I have discussed religion and politics over morning coffee with men who have killed people, you don't scare me.

  6. #6
    Bring the Noise
    dontcallmeradio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    South
    Posts
    1,143
    Quote Originally Posted by Iowa #1603 View Post
    YOU are almost always at fault.
    yea I kinda figured that.. Was just trying to see if he put the wrong statute charge.. Im pretty sure thats a 3 or 4 point moving violation Fail.. O well live and learn. Thanks for your responses guys.

  7. #7
    Forum Member
    MetalBeldo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Northern IL
    Posts
    125
    2 second rule, once the car infront of you passes a sign, tree, mailbox ect ect it should take you a minimum of 2 full seconds to come to the same object. This will leave approx one car length inbetween you and the vehicle infront of you.

  8. #8
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Georgia
    Posts
    25
    Although I've issued citations for "Following too Closely" in similar situations, I suspect that you were given a citation for "Careless Driving" because a collision occurred.

    Quote Originally Posted by dontcallmeradio View Post
    Any person...shall drive...so as not to endanger the life, limb, or property of any person
    When the collision occurred, that element was violated. That might have caused the trooper to feel that charge was more appropriate.

  9. #9
    Retired Sergeant - CHP
    SgtCHP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Left Coast
    Posts
    6,252
    Note to the OP:

    If you are following a vehicle at a SAFE distance, irrespective of the speed, when that vehicle stops rapidly and without any warning, you WILL NOT rearend that vehicle. You will have plenty of time to stop without incident.

    There is NO excuse to relieve you of your responsibility to follow at a distance to permit you to stop safely.
    Be courteous to all, but intimate with few, and let those few be well tried before you give them your confidence!

    [George Washington (1732 - 1799)]


  10. #10
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    435
    I write ten tickets for Careless Driving a week for just such an accident. I have NEVER lost one in court. The officer doesn't have to prove that you did anything intentionally.

    In Colorado, all I have to prove is that you drove in a careless and imprudent manner without due regard for the width, grade, curve, corners, traffic, ............and all other attendant circumstances.

    The last part would get you, a car stopped ahead of you is an "attendant circumstance".
    I have the heart of a child..................................No really, it is in a jar on my desk.

  11. #11
    LE Cheetah
    nuthead's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    SC
    Posts
    2,196
    Quote Originally Posted by dontcallmeradio View Post
    yea I kinda figured that.. Was just trying to see if he put the wrong statute charge.. Im pretty sure thats a 3 or 4 point moving violation Fail.. O well live and learn. Thanks for your responses guys.
    Careless driving here carries only 2 points. But it's a charge that will raise insurance rates almost immediately.
    “We don't disagree, you are wrong. Until you have a clue what you are talking about we can't disagree.” - cgh6366

  12. #12
    LE Cheetah
    nuthead's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    SC
    Posts
    2,196
    Quote Originally Posted by PRESSHRD5COPIES View Post
    a car stopped ahead of you is an "attendant circumstance".
    If nobody was in the car, would it then be an "unattendant circumstance"? I joke, I joke.
    “We don't disagree, you are wrong. Until you have a clue what you are talking about we can't disagree.” - cgh6366

  13. #13
    Forum Member
    Irishluck31's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    2,288
    Yes you should dispute the citation. I am sure that Trooper has a family and could use the easy OT.
    It takes a Wolf.......

  14. #14
    nom de plume

    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Nevada
    Posts
    1,652
    15mph and you skidded. Need better tires or leave more space.
    Any views or opinions presented by this prenomen are solely those of a burlesque author and do not necessarily represent those of a LEA or caementum couturier.

    nom de plume

    This is the internet- take all information with a grain of salt. Such could be valid and true or could be typed just for playing devils advocate.

  15. #15
    Cant keep it under 100...
    Unit453's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    1,410
    It is not the wrong citation. Careless is a combination of two different violations or a "catch all" for something like this. Its used all the time.

    Example:

    I'm going down a 4 lane, divided highway. Speed limit is 60. I'm doing 65. To my right, a female blasts through a stop sign and pulls out right directly in front of me. Had I not slammed on my brakes, I would've rear ended her. I stop her. I wrote her for careless operation vs running a stop sign and failure to yield.

    But like I said, its a catch all. Troopers here use it all the time. You might want to ask LeanG about this. He's an FHP Trooper. I dont work much traffic so...

  16. #16
    Salty Dog

    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    California Central Coast
    Posts
    6,950
    Minimum of two seconds following distance, no matter if it's on the freeway or at a stop sign.
    Government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem. - Ronald Reagan

    I don't think It'll happen in the US because we don't trust our government. We are a country of skeptics, raised by skeptics, founded by skeptics. - Amaroq

  17. #17
    Band-aid jockey
    mikeymedic's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Colorado Mountains
    Posts
    4,164
    It was a Trooper that wrote the citation? Trust me those guys know the traffic code like the back of their hand. You will lose in court against a Trooper. Hell, I would lose in court against a Trooper.

  18. #18
    NOT banned
    crass cop's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    the great midwest
    Posts
    4,174
    Quote Originally Posted by dontcallmeradio View Post
    Thank you for your response

    But my question back is.. Does it make a difference since we were stopped at a stop light and immediatley after we took off it occrd? I dont stop at a light with 3 cars inbetween us.
    I know what youre saying, but look at it like this....even though youre not 3 car lengths back at a red light, when it turns green, all the cars dont floor it at the same time and keep that distance of a few feet. As posted, you gotta let the car ahead of you move before you do to get the distance between you.
    Again, know it sucks. I would pay it and be glad there was no major damage.
    "Lighten da' cargo...Fer' a chick wid' big boobs...cause I like boobs, big boobs...."
    Da Admiral Sully

    "To the open-carry nut-rider, a firearm is his persona, a soap-box, and his reason for being. By strapping one on, he proclaims to the world, 'even though I didn't get hugs as a kid, somebody's going to By Golly pay attention to me now'."
    slamdunc

  19. #19
    Bring the Noise
    dontcallmeradio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    South
    Posts
    1,143
    Quote Originally Posted by crass cop View Post
    I know what youre saying, but look at it like this....even though youre not 3 car lengths back at a red light, when it turns green, all the cars dont floor it at the same time and keep that distance of a few feet. As posted, you gotta let the car ahead of you move before you do to get the distance between you.
    Again, know it sucks. I would pay it and be glad there was no major damage.
    Yea thats what I'm gunna do. Thanks for all the advice!

  20. #20
    LE Cheetah
    nuthead's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    SC
    Posts
    2,196
    Quote Originally Posted by mikeymedic View Post
    It was a Trooper that wrote the citation? Trust me those guys know the traffic code like the back of their hand. You will lose in court against a Trooper. Hell, I would lose in court against a Trooper.
    +1.

    We have a retired trooper that lives close by...I pick his brain every chance I get and he can STILL rattle off obscure statues (by number) and recite the code from memory. So far, he's never been wrong about anything he's told me (I always write down the section numbers he says and read them for myself). It's simply amazing.
    “We don't disagree, you are wrong. Until you have a clue what you are talking about we can't disagree.” - cgh6366

  21. #21
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Riverview, FL
    Posts
    92
    Quote Originally Posted by dontcallmeradio View Post
    Today I got a "Careless Driving" citation Statute 316.1925.1 Because the woman in front of me slammed on her breaks and I rear-ended her. I also slammed on my breaks but slid into her, we were both doing maybe 15 mph. We were at a stoplight that was red and it turned green so we proceeded forward but I guess the guy in front of her stopped so she slammed on her breaks to miss him then I slammed on my breaks and slid into her, I pushed her into him because she was pretty much on his bumper to start with. None of the 3 veh's had much if any damage, neither of them got cited. I read the statute and I don't understand how I can be given "CARELESS DRIVING" because i was in the rear.. for trying to stop when she slammed on her breaks.. Is this worth disputing? and if so HOW? its $168 bucks.

    FLORIDA STATUE 316.1925.1
    1) Any person operating a vehicle upon the streets or highways within the state shall drive the same in a careful and prudent manner, having regard for the width, grade, curves, corners, traffic, and all other attendant circumstances, so as not to endanger the life, limb, or property of any person. Failure to drive in such manner shall constitute careless driving and a violation of this section.

    2) Any person who violates this section shall be cited for a moving violation, punishable as provided in chapter 318.

    The Trooper was a real nice guy, and the fine isnt a big deal. I was just wondering if I should dispute it in court because I severly dislike points / traffic school. Does this sound like the correct charge for this infraction?
    I would have used the careless driving citation as well. The issue is this: as an officer you most likely didn't witness the accident. I cannot say whether or not you ran the stop sign, were following too close or whatever...but I can assume because a crash occurred that you committed some careless act. The issue comes down to you being behind someone else and you having the duty to evade a crash just like she has that duty in front of her.

    It is sort of like when you make a left turn no matter what it is your fault if you hit someone or someone hits you, with the exception of a left turn arrow.

  22. #22
    Bring the Noise
    dontcallmeradio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    South
    Posts
    1,143
    Quote Originally Posted by TacoMac View Post
    Clarification Question: Have any of you officers, in a case like this, ever seen a car moving 15mph hit the brakes hard enough to lock the wheels up and slide, and then still have the power to hit a car of about 3800 lbs. in weight and be able to knock that car far enough to hit yet another car?

    I'm trying to work out the physics on the original posters specifics and I simply can't get it to work out at 15mph. Any help on your experience would be appreciated.
    15mph was my estimate sir, I wasnt looking at my speedometer. If I was staring at the speedometer then this post wouldnt have been posted and I would have realized why it was a careless driving citation. I thank you for posting without the intent on answering my questions or staying on subject.

  23. #23
    I work for peanuts.
    S.O.444's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    989
    It's "Failure to Control Speed" in Texas, but is basically the same thing. If you rear-end someone for just about any reason, odds are you will be shown at fault and risk the chance of getting a citation for failure to control speed. It is your responsibility as a driver to ensure that there is adequate room for your vehicle to stop before striking any other driver in front of you at any given speed.

  24. #24
    PSP Ret.

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    423
    In PA either "Following too Closely" or "Careless Driving" could apply. I used to let the offending driver chose the section. During the interview I'd ask, "Why weren't you able to stop before hitting the other car, were you following too closely or just not paying attention?" I really didin't care which charge they "chose". The points and the fine were the same for each of them.
    When Society makes war on its police, it better be prepared to make friends of its criminals.

  25. #25
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Inet393
    Posts
    1,743
    User Banned
    Last edited by Nobody; 04-22-2010 at 02:10 PM.

Page 1 of 2 12 Last

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Log in

Click here to log in or register