Like Tree7Likes

Thread: Federal Air Marshals Hiring Process

  1. #2126
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    161
    Quote Originally Posted by INTHEAIRCOP View Post
    I have not been on the panel in years. But from what I hear it is all up to the 3 people on the panel if you get hired here. So you have to sell yourself. It does not matter if you have a PHD and was a NAVY SEAL. I do not agree with this at all! But what I was saying about the MIA office is just what a buddy of mine told me and I do not have a clue. I am sorry guys if you did not get picked up. The hiring process here is all jacked up if you ask me. If I was in the pool with you guys I seriously doubt I would pass either.
    Oh, okay...so I guess in a few years then FAMs will be full of a bunch of b*ll-sh*t artists rather than qualified, dedicated individuals. Add the FAMs high turnover rate plus normal attrition to that and in 2-3 years we'll be back in the same spot...If not sooner.

  2. #2127
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    161
    Quote Originally Posted by INTHEAIRCOP View Post
    I do know for a fact that FAMs family members are being hired
    Hey INTHEAIR, are you looking to adopt a son? - I'm educated and paid off my student loans with my Bar Mitzvah money!
    Last edited by paul354; 05-01-2010 at 08:58 PM. Reason: added more.

  3. #2128
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    DC
    Posts
    139
    Quote Originally Posted by INTHEAIRCOP View Post
    I have not been on the panel in years. But from what I hear it is all up to the 3 people on the panel if you get hired here. So you have to sell yourself. It does not matter if you have a PHD and was a NAVY SEAL. I do not agree with this at all! But what I was saying about the MIA office is just what a buddy of mine told me and I do not have a clue. I am sorry guys if you did not get picked up. The hiring process here is all jacked up if you ask me. If I was in the pool with you guys I seriously doubt I would pass either.
    I for one, don't have an issue with their new standards. That comes with the new demand of the position. I just wish they (FAMS) would glance over the apps before they fire off interview dates to people they already know they would have no interest in.

    Actually, the three panel guys are only a fraction of it. You need to pass them, the SAC and the selection panel in DC.

  4. #2129
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    503
    Quote Originally Posted by Armed Greeter View Post
    That is rather sad seeing as that has nothing to do with the panel and to waste someone's time and money to give them a token interview that they have 0 chance of passing is less than ethical. I don't doubt the credibility of your post, as have heard similiar chatter. It just dissapoints me that people are invited to the panel with no chance of getting a job. I think they need to include that type of stuff in the competencies qustionaire so people are weeded out more effectively.
    I agree, I think there should be an extra step to weed out applicants that have zero chance at getting passed the panel, or don't have what the FAMS want. I don't regret taking part in the FAM process it was a good learning experience, though I did pay a price. FAMS only had 1 date I could come in for the interview, same week I started a new job. Needless to say my decision to do the interview did cost me a job. But I'm glad I did the interview.

    An extra step in the process, might avoid wasting not only the FO's time but the applicants.

    Also, having a degree or military experience was a requirement for applying for this job wasn't it? You had to qualify on education or LEO/military experience. At least thats what I remember. I meet the education requirement.
    Last edited by ht2121; 05-01-2010 at 09:13 PM.

  5. #2130
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    u.s.
    Posts
    527
    Quote Originally Posted by paul354 View Post
    Oh, okay...so I guess in a few years then FAMs will be full of a bunch of b*ll-sh*t artists rather than qualified, dedicated individuals. Add the FAMs high turnover rate plus normal attrition to that and in 2-3 years we'll be back in the same spot...If not sooner.

    Your preaching to the choir brother.

  6. #2131
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    u.s.
    Posts
    527
    Quote Originally Posted by paul354 View Post
    Hey INTHEAIR, are you looking to adopt a son? - I'm educated and paid off my student loans with my Bar Mitzvah money!
    If you have a hot 21 year old or older single sister than yes I will adopt you.

  7. #2132
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    161
    Quote Originally Posted by INTHEAIRCOP View Post
    If you have a hot 21 year old or older single sister than yes I will adopt you.
    I don't have any sisters, BUT, you can have my girlfriend.

  8. #2133
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    u.s.
    Posts
    527
    In the year 2022 there will be a mass exodus. More than 75 percent of the current FAMs were all hired during the 2002 push. I hope the FAMs are preparing for this 2022 FAM problem. There is no way in heck I am staying past 2022!

  9. #2134
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    US
    Posts
    239
    Question to those that just got final offers, i just passed medical and i am hoping to receive "the call" soon. I know the thought is always just take what they give you as far as a date of entry. I see some people are getting about a months notice (late may to report) and others got about ten days. Is that because of some peoples circumstances or just how it works?

    I have a house out of state, well about 8 states away and it will be a big move for me, plus quitting my current job which is supposed to be the typical 2 weeks notice. I know with medical and the panel they were very good at working with you when it came to dates. How are they when it comes to FOE's? I know they have to fill class dates, i dont want to "haggle" or anything with them because i really want this job, but being realistic im gonna need at least a little time.

  10. #2135
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Worldwide
    Posts
    66
    Quote Originally Posted by Armed Greeter View Post
    That is rather sad seeing as that has nothing to do with the panel and to waste someone's time and money to give them a token interview that they have 0 chance of passing is less than ethical. I don't doubt the credibility of your post, as have heard similiar chatter. It just dissapoints me that people are invited to the panel with no chance of getting a job. I think they need to include that type of stuff in the competencies qustionaire so people are weeded out more effectively.
    Why do so many people feel entitled to this job just because you meet basic requirements? It is no different than any other LEO job. You can have great credentials/quals and answer the one question they put the most weight on the wrong way and that was the difference.

    Of course you have a chance to get the job when invited to the panel, but they are looking for specific things. Just because you have advanced degrees, etc doesn't mean you fit the mold. Then you have people that do 7 pull ups and run 1.5 miles in 14 minutes and wonder why they get passed over by the selection committee.

    FLEO jobs that pay 100K are not easy to get and it takes years for some to break in.

  11. #2136
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Worldwide
    Posts
    66
    Quote Originally Posted by medic2931 View Post
    If they know they won't take a person who's not a PT king, why pass them on to the selection committee? If they know they want a certain type of person, again, why pass them on to the selection committee? I'm not a PT God but I work hard at everything I do and give it everything I have. I am working to improve my numbers should I get hired. But, if my numbers aren't good enough and they know it, why pass my application on in the first place?
    Because they like what you bring to the table and that is a testament to you, however if they have another applicant with like qualifications PT scores could be the deciding factor. I am sure they recognized your effort at the PTA and that was a factor, as it should be, but again if it comes down to you and a guy who is excellent in every category........it's probably going to him.

    I think what people fail to realize, especially regarding PT, is that the people making the hiring decisions at FO Level do that same PTA 4 times per year. If your #'s are sub par, then it factors in.

    From what it sounds like you have done your job. You got referred for selection. It is out of your hands now and I wish you luck.

  12. #2137
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    101
    Quote Originally Posted by Squared Away View Post
    Why do so many people feel entitled to this job just because you meet basic requirements? It is no different than any other LEO job. You can have great credentials/quals and answer the one question they put the most weight on the wrong way and that was the difference.

    Of course you have a chance to get the job when invited to the panel, but they are looking for specific things. Just because you have advanced degrees, etc doesn't mean you fit the mold. Then you have people that do 7 pull ups and run 1.5 miles in 14 minutes and wonder why they get passed over by the selection committee.

    FLEO jobs that pay 100K are not easy to get and it takes years for some to break in.
    Not really my fight here but who said anything about being entitled to anything. We all know that there are more than enough applicants for these positions and that the agency will be able to be very selective. So, if military or college degrees are a litmus test for some offices (not that I'm saying I believe this is necessarily the case), doesn't it benefit all those involved to streamline the process a bit. The offices are busy, applicants are flying in from all over the country, etc.

    I just hope people aren't taking time off of their current jobs and spending money they don't have to fly in and interview for a job that they never had a chance at getting.

  13. #2138
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    DC
    Posts
    139
    Quote Originally Posted by Squared Away View Post
    Why do so many people feel entitled to this job just because you meet basic requirements? It is no different than any other LEO job. You can have great credentials/quals and answer the one question they put the most weight on the wrong way and that was the difference.

    Of course you have a chance to get the job when invited to the panel, but they are looking for specific things. Just because you have advanced degrees, etc doesn't mean you fit the mold. Then you have people that do 7 pull ups and run 1.5 miles in 14 minutes and wonder why they get passed over by the selection committee.

    FLEO jobs that pay 100K are not easy to get and it takes years for some to break in.
    What post are you reading and responding to? I would recommend that you read more carefully

    You are arguing against points that were never made. (This seems to happen on this forum a lot)

    I passed my panel so I am in no way biased. No one referred to botching a question on the panel. However, not many who actually understand how the hiring process works would debate that they will give contingent offers to people who have no chance of being hired such as someone with a degree
    but no military or trigger time. Also, I didn't make the point of someone showing up fat to the PT test being unfair. That doesn't apply to me either. Although, you could set minumums in the announcement so people don't waste their time applying.

    "Of course you have a chance of getting the job when you are invited to the panel"

    False. FAMS uses a contractor to send out contingent offers to send out CBT and interview invites. FAMS doesn't look at these before hand and will wait until a candidate shows up before they know anything about them. Again, I have never had to fly on my own dime or take 3 unpaid days off for one of these interviews, so I am not biased here. Take for example the guys that passed their panel and were sent home by the SAC before the interview. That happens more than you think.

    The points I made are that they 1) give out too many contingent offers and 2) After fewer offers are made, they should at least attempt to review them in order to save time for themselves and applicants.

    Not trying to put words in your mouth, but I believe you were trying to say that there are things that cant be weeded out on paper. If that was your point, then most everyone would agree with you. For example, the guy who shows up to the interview in jeans and a 5 O' Clock shadow, or the 25 year old who makes the run in over 16 minutes.
    Last edited by Armed Greeter; 05-02-2010 at 09:14 AM.

  14. #2139
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    NH
    Posts
    21
    Quote Originally Posted by hollowpoint40 View Post
    Question to those that just got final offers, i just passed medical and i am hoping to receive "the call" soon. I know the thought is always just take what they give you as far as a date of entry. I see some people are getting about a months notice (late may to report) and others got about ten days. Is that because of some peoples circumstances or just how it works?

    I have a house out of state, well about 8 states away and it will be a big move for me, plus quitting my current job which is supposed to be the typical 2 weeks notice. I know with medical and the panel they were very good at working with you when it came to dates. How are they when it comes to FOE's? I know they have to fill class dates, i dont want to "haggle" or anything with them because i really want this job, but being realistic im gonna need at least a little time.
    My family is in a similiar situation, my husband got a final offer last week. We live many states away from the field office, with a house to sell. He reports towards the end of May, so he was able to give 2 weeks notice, but I don't think he was given that reporting date because we lived far away, that was just the date of the next group of people starting.

    He was told that he will be at the field office for about 2 weeks and then go to training. So I will be selling the house while he is gone. What we don't know yet is, where he should stay during those 2 weeks before going off to training. A hotel for 2 weeks will be pretty expensive. The other thing we don't know yet is if there is any time off at the completion of training in order to move.

  15. #2140
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    US
    Posts
    239
    Quote Originally Posted by KAL5485 View Post
    My family is in a similiar situation, my husband got a final offer last week. We live many states away from the field office, with a house to sell. He reports towards the end of May, so he was able to give 2 weeks notice, but I don't think he was given that reporting date because we lived far away, that was just the date of the next group of people starting.

    He was told that he will be at the field office for about 2 weeks and then go to training. So I will be selling the house while he is gone. What we don't know yet is, where he should stay during those 2 weeks before going off to training. A hotel for 2 weeks will be pretty expensive. The other thing we don't know yet is if there is any time off at the completion of training in order to move.
    I guess I will ask these questions when the call comes. I would have thought some of this would have been mentioned during "the call" but it seems like its a pretty basic call. I have no idea what guys do that have long time careers and or property etc. I'm single so I have no help or anything, its all me. Hopefully some of these questions will be clarified soon....

    The time up there before going to academy I know is out of our own pockets, I'm guessing your technically getting paid right when you get up there and do paperwork but I don't know.

  16. #2141
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Southeast
    Posts
    884
    Quote Originally Posted by hollowpoint40 View Post
    I guess I will ask these questions when the call comes. I would have thought some of this would have been mentioned during "the call" but it seems like its a pretty basic call. I have no idea what guys do that have long time careers and or property etc. I'm single so I have no help or anything, its all me. Hopefully some of these questions will be clarified soon....

    The time up there before going to academy I know is out of our own pockets, I'm guessing your technically getting paid right when you get up there and do paperwork but I don't know.
    Not sure if anyone has noticed, but they don't care or have any sympathy for current personal situations. They don't care about your current job, nor do they care about your current housing situation. Even if you get the job, you don't become "family", you become just another # to them, another one of the millions of federal employees out there (not sure if that figure is completely accurate).

    Just want to make sure that no one is expecting a "warm and fuzzy" welcome just because they hire you. Across this entire forum, there are tons of threads regarding the same situation for various agencies. Pretty common to most of them.....they don't care about your personal situation. It is on you to figure out how to make it happen. The most I would hope for is a timeframe that allows for the ability to give a current employer a 2-week notice, but I don't even expect that to be a possibility in most situations.

  17. #2142
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    US
    Posts
    239
    Quote Originally Posted by flyer2007 View Post
    Not sure if anyone has noticed, but they don't care or have any sympathy for current personal situations. They don't care about your current job, nor do they care about your current housing situation. Even if you get the job, you don't become "family", you become just another # to them, another one of the millions of federal employees out there (not sure if that figure is completely accurate).

    Just want to make sure that no one is expecting a "warm and fuzzy" welcome just because they hire you. Across this entire forum, there are tons of threads regarding the same situation for various agencies. Pretty common to most of them.....they don't care about your personal situation. It is on you to figure out how to make it happen. The most I would hope for is a timeframe that allows for the ability to give a current employer a 2-week notice, but I don't even expect that to be a possibility in most situations.
    In some ways I see why they don't do much to be "helpful", I mean how can they...especially if they are hiring a thousand people. Getting a call now and being told to report end of may is a pretty good little chunch of time but not all have been that lucky. For medical and panel they were real good to me letting me change my dates and I can make it work if I can get some leave after the academy to move but I don't get how people that are high up into company's and stuff make it work with a ten day notice like some have gotten.

    A lot of the reason I'm bringing it up is I have a family reuinon type thing at the end of may, and yeah I know people are getting called up around that time so I was just wondering. I would NOT say no to a DOE don't get me wrong. I have heard most FAM and FAM support say that you should just put in for admin leave near the end of the academy, because if you move everything before and fail out, your screwed, but that's just been here say.....

  18. #2143
    Forum Member
    UD4LIFE's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    East Coast
    Posts
    1,032
    Quote Originally Posted by flyer2007 View Post
    Not sure if anyone has noticed, but they don't care or have any sympathy for current personal situations. They don't care about your current job, nor do they care about your current housing situation. Even if you get the job, you don't become "family", you become just another # to them, another one of the millions of federal employees out there (not sure if that figure is completely accurate).

    Just want to make sure that no one is expecting a "warm and fuzzy" welcome just because they hire you. Across this entire forum, there are tons of threads regarding the same situation for various agencies. Pretty common to most of them.....they don't care about your personal situation. It is on you to figure out how to make it happen. The most I would hope for is a timeframe that allows for the ability to give a current employer a 2-week notice, but I don't even expect that to be a possibility in most situations.
    Bingo!

    The hiring agency cares about the mission and thats pretty much it.

    You applied and knew the rules months in advance, so its not their problem if you can't sell house, need a hotel, take a loss on current house, wife hates your new job, miss family events/holidays.

    To them...its a YOU problem...not a me problem.

    Good luck all, just remember that the mission is the priority.

  19. #2144
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Worldwide
    Posts
    66
    Quote Originally Posted by Armed Greeter View Post
    What post are you reading and responding to? I would recommend that you read more carefully

    You are arguing against points that were never made. (This seems to happen on this forum a lot)

    I passed my panel so I am in no way biased. No one referred to botching a question on the panel. However, not many who actually understand how the hiring process works would debate that they will give contingent offers to people who have no chance of being hired such as someone with a degree
    but no military or trigger time. Also, I didn't make the point of someone showing up fat to the PT test being unfair. That doesn't apply to me either. Although, you could set minumums in the announcement so people don't waste their time applying.

    "Of course you have a chance of getting the job when you are invited to the panel"

    False. FAMS uses a contractor to send out contingent offers to send out CBT and interview invites. FAMS doesn't look at these before hand and will wait until a candidate shows up before they know anything about them. Again, I have never had to fly on my own dime or take 3 unpaid days off for one of these interviews, so I am not biased here. Take for example the guys that passed their panel and were sent home by the SAC before the interview. That happens more than you think.

    The points I made are that they 1) give out too many contingent offers and 2) After fewer offers are made, they should at least attempt to review them in order to save time for themselves and applicants.

    Not trying to put words in your mouth, but I believe you were trying to say that there are things that cant be weeded out on paper. If that was your point, then most everyone would agree with you. For example, the guy who shows up to the interview in jeans and a 5 O' Clock shadow, or the 25 year old who makes the run in over 16 minutes.
    I am not arguing any points just making some.

    Remember hiring standards are also handled by OPM so minimum qualifications are set and if you meet them you apply. Pretty standard for any government employment. If an applicant meets the minimum standards, by law they can't call up and say "Hey you meet qualifications, but don't show up".

    There are minimum PT standards set. If you only meet the minimum applying for any job, do you really feel you are going to be competitive in a FLEO hiring process?

    If someone takes 3 days off, pays to fly to the FO, etc I would think they would have enough sense to be able to do a self assessment and figure out if they are competitive enough to warrant such an expense. If not, that is on them. Not an agency problem.

    You made my point for me regarding entitlement:

    "Take for example the guys that passed their panel and were sent home by the SAC before the interview. That happens more than you think."

    It happens because that particular applicant isn't what they were looking for. Why is someone entitled to the SAC interview just because they pass the panel and the pt? They aren't. It is part of the vetting process.

  20. #2145
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    101
    Quote Originally Posted by Squared Away View Post
    I am not arguing any points just making some.

    Remember hiring standards are also handled by OPM so minimum qualifications are set and if you meet them you apply. Pretty standard for any government employment. If an applicant meets the minimum standards, by law they can't call up and say "Hey you meet qualifications, but don't show up".

    There are minimum PT standards set. If you only meet the minimum applying for any job, do you really feel you are going to be competitive in a FLEO hiring process?

    If someone takes 3 days off, pays to fly to the FO, etc I would think they would have enough sense to be able to do a self assessment and figure out if they are competitive enough to warrant such an expense. If not, that is on them. Not an agency problem.

    You made my point for me regarding entitlement:

    "Take for example the guys that passed their panel and were sent home by the SAC before the interview. That happens more than you think."

    It happens because that particular applicant isn't what they were looking for. Why is someone entitled to the SAC interview just because they pass the panel and the pt? They aren't. It is part of the vetting process.
    Again who said "entitled?" Please reread the post you responded to on this issue originally. That post regarded those who showed up with no chance at all of moving on and supposedly that being decided long before the person interviewed, even if they interviewed well.

    I think you negated your own point. People can only make a "self assessment" based on the qualifications laid forth in the announcement. A very small percentage are privy to the information we receive on this forum.

  21. #2146
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    67
    With all this talk about awesome PT performance is there anyone who received a FO that didn't have good PT?

    Also, what are your thoughts of females and PT performance. I spoke with a females who are in training now and was told that all of the females couldnt do any pull ups and 3 couldnt do any push ups. I'm concerned because I am a female and with all this talk about stellar PT i'm no where close to any of the guys on here.

    Your thoughts....?

  22. #2147
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    DC
    Posts
    139
    Quote Originally Posted by anydaynow View Post
    Again who said "entitled?" Please reread the post you responded to on this issue originally. That post regarded those who showed up with no chance at all of moving on and supposedly that being decided long before the person interviewed, even if they interviewed well.

    I think you negated your own point. People can only make a "self assessment" based on the qualifications laid forth in the announcement. A very small percentage are privy to the information we receive on this forum.
    That was very well put. Maybe I wasn't illustrating my point well enough.

    Just to clarify, I don't believe they are bringing people to the CBT and interview that they know ahead of time that they don't want, but they could very easily make the standards on the application more congruent to what they are looking for. Like I said, the major flaw for both FAMS and applicants is that FAMS won't take a few minutes to skim the apps that HR sends up before hand. I have no issue with them looking for cops who were prior military with BA or advanced degrees, but I wish they would include that in the application competencies.
    Last edited by Armed Greeter; 05-02-2010 at 01:11 PM.

  23. #2148
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    503
    Quote Originally Posted by bs0329980 View Post
    With all this talk about awesome PT performance is there anyone who received a FO that didn't have good PT?

    Also, what are your thoughts of females and PT performance. I spoke with a females who are in training now and was told that all of the females couldnt do any pull ups and 3 couldnt do any push ups. I'm concerned because I am a female and with all this talk about stellar PT i'm no where close to any of the guys on here.

    Your thoughts....?
    As another female applicant, I follow the chart that FAMS has. But you should work to do more then what is required. Pull ups are my weak point but I am up to 10. But I have been working on pull ups for awhile. FAMS requires 4 for excellent if your between 21-29.

    Its really sad if a female can't do a push up. Come on, if they really wanted a career in Law enforcement they would get serious about PT. PT standards are out there well in advance.

  24. #2149
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    MA
    Posts
    44
    Quote Originally Posted by Armed Greeter View Post
    That was very well put. Maybe I wasn't illustrating my point well enough.

    Just to clarify, I don't believe they are bringing people to the CBT and interview that they know ahead of time that they don't want, but they could very easily make the standards on the application more congruent to what they are looking for. Like I said, the major flaw for both FAMS and applicants is that FAMS won't take a few minutes to skim the apps that HR sends up before hadn. I have no issue with them looking for cops who were prior military with BA or advanced degrees, but I wish they would include that in the application competencies.
    If you have what it takes to make it to the panel then what are you worried about? You can't focus all your energy on what you don't have, but rather utilize your strong points and illustrate what you can bring to the table. Just like anyother interview, look sharp, be articulate, and display your skill set.

  25. #2150
    Forum Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    DC
    Posts
    139
    Quote Originally Posted by vernagma View Post
    If you have what it takes to make it to the panel then what are you worried about? You can't focus all your energy on what you don't have, but rather utilize your strong points and illustrate what you can bring to the table. Just like anyother interview, look sharp, be articulate, and display your skill set.
    I am not trying to sound sarcastic or malicious when I say this, but do you have any idea as to what we are all talking about?
    Last edited by Armed Greeter; 05-02-2010 at 01:08 PM. Reason: cant type from blackberry :(

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Log in

Click here to log in or register