1. #1
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    Out of state DL's

    Hey all.

    I am a Deputy in California and I have recently been stopping people with either Suspended or NO California Driver's license....yet they provide me with an out of state DL that is vaild (usually Oregon or Washington...)

    My department doesn't focus on traffic, and some of us weren't sure what the law says regarding this issue. If I person is living and working in California, do they have to have a California DL or will any state do?

    A guy almost hit me head on last night. He was an illegal with no Calfornia DL, but he did have a valid Oregon DL...

    Any info would be great...thanks
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    I do not know about CA. In Vermont, if your privilege to operate is suspended in this State, you will get a traffic ticket for such or a citation to appear in Court if the suspension qualifies as "criminal suspension" in Vermont.

    Someone from another State can posses a valid DL, however you can still be suspended in Vermont (for what ever reason). If that is the case we issue a ticket for "no license"

    I know you asked about CA., but I thought I would throw my .02 in for my State.

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    I don't know about Cali, but in NH someone has to get a NH license within 60 days of establishing residency here. If their license privilege is suspended in NH, they get a summons for Operating After Suspension or Revocation. If their license is suspended in their home state, same thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xerious View Post
    Hey all.

    I am a Deputy in California and I have recently been stopping people with either Suspended or NO California Driver's license....yet they provide me with an out of state DL that is vaild (usually Oregon or Washington...)

    My department doesn't focus on traffic, and some of us weren't sure what the law says regarding this issue. If I person is living and working in California, do they have to have a California DL or will any state do?

    A guy almost hit me head on last night. He was an illegal with no Calfornia DL, but he did have a valid Oregon DL...

    Any info would be great...thanks

    Suspended is suspended. If CA says he can't drive then that person driving in CA is a violation of the law. Who gives a **** what other states do?

    CA has a law on the books if they live in the state for XX number of days they have to get CA license with the exception of military.

    The deal with that illegal, I would say his Oregon DL would cover him if it wasn't suspended or revoked, it would be like any other person visiting from another state.
    Last edited by wirefire2; 08-21-2009 at 06:21 AM.

  5. #5
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    One issue here is reciprocity -- other states recognizing each-others suspensions. I feel if you're suspended in one state you should be suspended nationwide. To some extent, many states do participate in an interstate compact.

    Buddy had one last week - Suspended Habitual Offender in Maine, but valid out of Louisiana... makes perfect sense!

    If we have someone from out of state driving with a suspended out of state license, we charge it "operating without license" and not suspended, since our DMV/BMV wasn't the agency that issued the suspension.

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  6. #6
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    VC 12502(a) (1) allows non-residents to operate on an out of state license, provided they are actually residents of another state. That section also points you to VC 12505 which defines when they become residents of California under the law and are required to have a California DL. It says:

    12505. (a) (1) For purposes of this division only and
    notwithstanding Section 516, residency shall be determined as a
    person's state of domicile. "State of domicile" means the state
    where a person has his or her true, fixed, and permanent home and
    principal residence and to which he or she has manifested the
    intention of returning whenever he or she is absent.
    Prima facie evidence of residency for driver's licensing purposes
    includes, but is not limited to, the following:
    (A) Address where registered to vote.
    (B) Payment of resident tuition at a public institution of higher
    education.
    (C) Filing a homeowner's property tax exemption.
    (D) Other acts, occurrences, or events that indicate presence in
    the state is more than temporary or transient.
    (2) California residency is required of a person in order to be
    issued a commercial driver's license under this code.
    (b) The presumption of residency in this state may be rebutted by
    satisfactory evidence that the licensee's primary residence is in
    another state.
    (c) Any person entitled to an exemption under Section 12502,
    12503, or 12504 may operate a motor vehicle in this state for not to
    exceed 10 days from the date he or she establishes residence in this
    state, except that he or she shall obtain a license from the
    department upon becoming a resident before being employed for
    compensation by another for the purpose of driving a motor vehicle on
    the highways.

    With respect to your 14601 question, the section reads, No person shall drive a motor vehicle at any time when that person's driving privilege is suspended or revoked .........

    So, if their California DL is suspended, it shouldn't matter if they have a DL from another state, they are still suspended in California.
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  7. #7
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    If they live in California then they need a CA license...10 days to get it once they establish residency. So if you cannot articulate that they live here then an out of state license is valid to drive. If they are suspended then they are suspended in CA no matter where they live and no matter what license they have. A lot of people around here get suspended in CA for DUI and wander over to Arizona to get a license. Doesnt matter as they are suspended from driving in CA for the duration of the suspension.

    I know a lot of LEO's dont "like" doing traffic, but getting suspended/unlicensed drivers off the road is important and improves safety. Just look at that one that almost hit you......

  8. #8
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    I am a Deputy in California and I have recently been stopping people with either Suspended or NO California Driver's license....yet they provide me with an out of state DL that is vaild (usually Oregon or Washington...)

    My department doesn't focus on traffic, and some of us weren't sure what the law says regarding this issue. If I person is living and working in California, do they have to have a California DL or will any state do?
    Take a man with a valid Wa. OL, and he is suspended in Ca. It's his priviledges that are suspended in Ca. If he's driving in Wa., he's OK. If he's driving in Or., he's OK. If he's driving in Ca., he's not OK ... then he's suspended.

    Now, take a man who only has a Wa. OL. Say Wa. suspends him. The isuing authority has suspended his priviledges. The OL issued is there for not valid anywhere else. He drives in Wa., he's suspended. He drives in Ca., he is driving without a valid OL, or unlicensed. He's not suspended in Ca, but penalties are likely nearly the same.

    Now, take a man with a Wa. OL who has established residence in Ca. as defined under Ca. law and is thus a resident. Say the time period in which he's required to obtain a Ca. OL under Ca. law after such residency requirement is met is past now. By law, he is in that period when he is required to have a valid Ca. OL before operating a MV on a highway in Ca. You catch him. If at all like other states, that Wa. Ol is no longer valid under the circumstances, as he is required by virtue of his having established residence in Ca. to have a Ca. OL.

    You of course need to be able to offer some proof on each point.

    If you enforce MV code, it is your responsibility to learn it first ... and then keep up with changes as they occur, as they will.. It is easy enough to violate someone's rights and to somehow find yourself a defendant in a law suit when you do know what you are doing, even easier when you do not.

    I'm way over on the east side of the "muddy river".
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    According to a CHP officer who backed me on a traffic stop, if a person has a suspended Calif. DL and has a valid out-of-state DL, they are considered suspended in Calif., but they can drive all they want in the other state where their license is valid.

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    In Washington if you are suspended in any state you are suspended here. Doesn't matter if you are clear in WA or any other state, if you are DWLS/R (drive with license suspended/revoked) in any other state you are no good to drive. Suspended in one = suspended in all.

    I often ask people what other states they have lived in or been stopped in just to find the outstanding suspension.
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by scotty707 View Post
    According to a CHP officer who backed me on a traffic stop, if a person has a suspended Calif. DL and has a valid out-of-state DL, they are considered suspended in Calif., but they can drive all they want in the other state where their license is valid.
    I confirmed this with a CHP Sgt who backed me on a t-stop the other day. 14601 with a valid out of state is still 14601.

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    I'm glad for all of the good feedback from everyone cuz they're right.... Sound like you may have kicked the guy loose who almost hit you. I can't stand when they hand me an Oregon, Washington, etc... when they live and work in the area. If I was an illegal, I would carpool with all of my friends up to Oregon and get a license, then come back to Cali and just tell the police I live in Oregon and that I'm down in Cali for work... Sucks!!! Good luck
    Last edited by Surfside; 08-25-2009 at 11:33 PM.
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    If you are suspended in one state you are suspended in all states. No state may issue a driver's license to anyone who is currently suspended in another state, although since not all states share information sometimes you can get one when you aren't supposed to. You are still driving while suspended, though, until you take care of all suspensions in all states.

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    In Colorado, if you are DUS (for Colorado DMV) you can't drive even if you have a valid license in 49 other states.
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  15. #15
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    I stopped a girl yesterday who was from Pennsylvania. She had a valid PA drivers license, however her NY state operating privelage was suspended for failing to pay a previous fine. I could have arrested her, but just wrote her some tickets and made her park the car.

  16. #16
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    Wow, just reading some of the explanations from other states confuses me. In Tx, one has 30 days to get a TX DL if their residence is in TX, but one has to surrender their valid DL from whatever other state the person comes from. If their license is not valid in the originial state, TX will not issue a DL until the person takes care of the problem.

    by the way, TX is in the violator compact. I believe california, michigan, and hawaii are the only states not in the violator compact, so maybe thats why a license may be suspended in california, but yet that person has a valid license in another state.
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  17. #17
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    when i was working in cali, a few years back, some ileigals would get a dl from OR or WA 'cause their DMV's would not ask for proof of citizenship (ie:SSN), this may have changed since. id ask them how long they had been working in cali or residing in cali and usually it was longer than the 10 days.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by scotty707 View Post
    According to a CHP officer who backed me on a traffic stop, if a person has a suspended Calif. DL and has a valid out-of-state DL, they are considered suspended in Calif., but they can drive all they want in the other state where their license is valid.
    That's right ... same here.

    Quote Originally Posted by CruiserClass
    If you are suspended in one state you are suspended in all states. No state may issue a driver's license to anyone who is currently suspended in another state, although since not all states share information sometimes you can get one when you aren't supposed to. You are still driving while suspended, though, until you take care of all suspensions in all states.
    Not so.

    For a fact, Virginia can suspend your priveledges to operate a motor vehicle in Virginia regardless of state of issuance. If out of state issuance, and it's otherwise valid, like maybe a Californioa OL and you get stopped in Kentuckey, then it's perfectly valid and you can drive in Kentucky on that California OL even though you might owe 24 fines and have 27 suspension and revokation orders in Virginia. Just best don't get caught driving in Virginia.

    Now, if your OL is issued by Virginia, and Virginia suspends or revokes your priveledges, that Virginia issued OL is no good anywhere, which means outside of Virginia you are simply "not licensed", while in Virginia, you'ld be "suspended" or "revoked" as the case may be.

    You can have suspensions in multiple states as many truck drivers once had ... and still be perfectly legal in some other states if in posession of a valid CDL issued from a state that has not suspended your priveledges.
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