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    Unhappy LAPD DQ'd: I NEED ADVICE!

    I was recently disqualified from the LAPD last week and need some advice from you guys out there. The three main issues that my case manger said affected me were ‘Interpersonal Skills, Sensitivity for Other’, ‘Maturity and Discipline’, and ‘Honesty, Integrity, and Respect for Others’. In the first one, she that was a minor one and I know it relates to an incident at work were a coworker yelled and used profanity at me. I have a pretty strong case against this one in that I was given an apology from my supervisor and my store manager and was exonerated from any wrongdoing because I did exactly what they asked me to do in that situation (they have zero tolerance for confrontation policy) and the other person was disciplined for the incident. And the other two (the main cause for the DQ) ‘Maturity and Discipline’ and ‘Honesty, Integrity, and Respect for Others’ relates to their indetermination on my amount of drug use and what the think is dishonest about it. To begin with I have only used marijuana and that’s all. My Background Investigator could not determine how many time had I experimented with it in my life time. I initially said, and continue to maintain, that I used it once when I was 16 in 2005, again 3-4 times a month (48 at most) between 1999 & 2000, and last used it once in 2003. They investigated this and spoke to a friend who gave them a number too low of my marijuana use and a former friend who gave them a number too high. These two guys were the last ones I smoked with in 2003. The former friend is currently a pot smoker and I haven’t associated with him since 2003, my current friend around the same time I did in 2003. I plan to appeal the LAPD DQ as soon my friend (who’s also a hotshot law school student) and I finish drafting my letter and review it. My LAPD mentor told me that I needed 4 letters or recommendation with my appeal letter and said with that I would be ‘cool’. And just to throw this in, I’m 4 units away from receiving my BA in Philosophy with an emphasis in Ethics, I volunteer quit often at an elementary school helping kids with their basic arithmetic and reading skill, and I also have done some volunteer work at a homeless shelter feeding the homeless this summer. This being said, I want to know: A) What should I include in my letter of appeal?; B) Who should I get to write my letters of appeal?; C) What are the chances of getting reinstated?; D) When will I hear back from the appeals board?; E) How will this affect my future applications with other departments?, and; F) How should I Address this to these other departments?

    Thank you for reading this. I know its super long but I wanted to get you guys an insight into my situation so that you may make a descent assessment.

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    Just a word of advise too, you might want to check out www.policebackground.net and their forums. It's mostly LAPD centric and they have a section there for being DQed and Appeals. I was in your boat but took the waiting route.

    There are two types of letters in this phase, the "soft deny" letter aka. the non-select which gives you a time line to "heal" your background and have you reapply or a "hard deny" where you are deemed ineligible due to your background.

    Did they give you a time line on the letter on when they suggest you reapply?
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    No they did not give a time line. it only says that I'm not '...among the most qualified candidates and your are being disqualified....our investigation identified concerns related to following background standards." (which i have listed above). Also, it says that if i appeal i have to: 1) discuss any mitigating circumstances that you wish to have considered; 2) provide any relevant and/or supporting documentation; 3)give justification for my continued participation in the selection processes; 4) give accomplishments or personal and/or professional goals that may reflect positively on my candidacy, and; 5) give a brief discussion of the reason i believe i meet each of the six background standards. Further, it says that I have one month to appeal the DQ and that if I '...should attempt to re-enter the Police Officer selection processes at some future date, [I] would need to address these background issues at that time." So, what do you think?

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    48 times sound like a lot to me. Especially since they are barley hiring at the moment.

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    Without knowing exactly what was written in your package, it is impossible to give you any meaningful advice. All anyone can do is wildly speculate, which is what I will do now.

    Based on the cause you quoted in the first incident, it sounds like it didn't matter who was right and who was wrong. They simply felt that your response to the situation reflected a lack of Interpersonal Skills, Sensitivity for Others, Maturity and Discipline, which are minimum requirements for the position you are seeking. If your personal history indicates that you lack any of the minimum qualifications, you get disqualified. I'm not sure what you can write to show that your response to that incident reflected proper Interpersonal Skills, Sensitivity for Others, Maturity and Discipline.

    With respect to the second issue, (and again, I am just taking a wild guess) Dishonesty suggests your friends gave the BI a significantly higher number for your marijuana usage that you did. If that is the case, you are going to have to throw your friends under the bus and prove that they are in error and that your numbers are correct. Given that it is a you said, they said situation and you are outnumbered two to one, I'm not sure how that's going to work out. Again, Honesty is one of the minimum requirements for the position. If the evidence suggests that you lack it, you will get disqualified.

    Now, here is where I will stop speculating. Civil service is fairly black and white. If you lack even one of the minimum qualifications for the job, civil service law prohibits you from being appointed to that position. That's it. No exceptions. So, four letters of recommendations are fairly meaningless. What you need to do is establish that the department was in error when they determined that you lacked the minimum requirements for the job, which were the basis for your DQ.
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    The way I see it, with so many qualified applicants in a down economy, and with so few spots available, the big obstacle is convincing LAPD that you are more worthy than the next guy or girl to be hired. In times past, LAPD was trying vainly to fill a large number of spots with not as many qualified candidates. These days, the economy and a winding down of the war in Iraq has ensured that the few academy spots will go to the most qualified candidates. Look in the mirror, you admitted to smoking marijuana, possibly as many as 48 times. Are you the most qualified candidate?

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    Quote Originally Posted by QRF View Post
    The way I see it, with so many qualified applicants in a down economy, and with so few spots available, the big obstacle is convincing LAPD that you are more worthy than the next guy or girl to be hired. In times past, LAPD was trying vainly to fill a large number of spots with not as many qualified candidates. These days, the economy and a winding down of the war in Iraq has ensured that the few academy spots will go to the most qualified candidates. Look in the mirror, you admitted to smoking marijuana, possibly as many as 48 times. Are you the most qualified candidate?
    QRF is exactly right, we have slowed our hiring down considerably due to that pesky economy thing (at least we're still hiring; many others aren't). This means we can be a lot more picky then we used to be.

    I agree with others here, if you used an ILLEGAL substance possibly as many as 40+ times, you are gonna have a more difficult time over others who have never used it.

    By the way, if you're gonna have more long posts, please use paragraphs, they make your long posts much easier to read, not to mention it's proper grammer, especially for someone about to get his BA.

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    Quote Originally Posted by alicon View Post
    I initially said, and continue to maintain, that I used it once when I was 16 in 2005, again 3-4 times a month (48 at most) between 1999 & 2000, and last used it once in 2003.
    You were 16 years old in 2005? That means you are now at most 20 years old. Furthermore, if you were 16 in 2005, then you were 10-11 years old when you were smoking marijuana between 1999-2000. WOW!

    My point is that you really need to write more clearly. You obviously meant something completely different but you were unable to articulate it very well in writing. Take this time to finish your degree and brush up on your writing skills especially if you are tutoring children.

    Good luck to you..

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    Quote Originally Posted by alicon View Post
    I initially said, and continue to maintain, that I used it once when I was 16 in 2005, again 3-4 times a month (48 at most) between 1999 & 2000, and last used it once in 2003.
    Wait one minute. Your last use was once in 2003 however you also said that you used in 2005 when you were 16?

    Trying to figure out your story is giving me a headache!

    alicon, please explain..

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    Quote Originally Posted by alicon View Post
    I initially said, and continue to maintain, that I used it once when I was 16 in 2005, again 3-4 times a month (48 at most) between 1999 & 2000, and last used it once in 2003.
    Seriously, you are 4 units away of obtaining a B.A. and you can not write in chronological order. Like was mentioned above and just as we are, the B.I. must have been scratching his head at this.

    Also college should have taught you to proofread your work, before submitting.

    again 3-4 times a month (48 at most) between 1999 & 2000, last used it once in 2003, once when I was 16 in 2005
    To many joints to be considered "Experimental Usage".

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    it wasn't 2005, it was 1995 and it was simple mistake. i wrote hastily, and i'm sorry for the trouble. i thought i was asking a question to a group of police officers and not to a group of English professors. i'm trained in technical writing - although i still need improvement. listen guys, i appreciate your help here. you guys are the best. don't confuse the finger for the moon.

  16. #16
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    Succesful candidates stand out in the testing, oral, and PAT processes, then keep from standing out during the BI.

    Reason being is that when testing they cast their nest wide to get the most applicants into the process. Then they look at BI's and fugure out who they can cut out quickly. Why spend one more minute on you when there are people who equal your qualities, but have smoked a lot less dope...perhaps none at all (and, yes, they do exist!)?

    As has been said, cannibis use in those numbers may have gotten you through the door during the 'let's hire anyone who can breathe and fog up a mirror' days...but times are lean and they can afford to be picky.
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  17. #17
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    why would someone who wants to be a cop smoke weed? That shows that you have little to no respect for the law weed is not legal, we arrest people for dealing it, and using it. My advice is that you need to put some distance on your weed smoking...48 times is not just dabbling in it, or trying it to see what its like...its using it on a regular basis. Depending on your age I would join the military and learn disipline, and get some maturity. Thats what I did when I got DQed from LAPD and I have been a cop now for 6 years.
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    Another doper wants to now be a cop, is that what I'm reading on this thread? Another thing, your grammar skills follow you. You use poor grammar skills here you will use them every where.

    When an officer writes a report it is read by attorney's, people who have spent many years in college. These attorneys are called "defense lawyers" and are just waiting for some dumb "doper cop" to write a poor report so they can get their client off because you wrote a poor report.


    I don't believe anyone who uses dope, including mj, should be allowed to be a cop.

    LVMPD arrested 2 cops from Hawaii for MJ use last week. And you don't understand why the big bad LAPD does not want to hire you.

    I could care a less whether you become a cop, you are probably one of the "little dopers" I took to jail back in the 90's when I chased "little dopers".

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by alicon View Post
    I was recently disqualified from the LAPD last week and need some advice from you guys out there. The three main issues that my case manger said affected me were ‘Interpersonal Skills, Sensitivity for Other’, ‘Maturity and Discipline’, and ‘Honesty, Integrity, and Respect for Others’. In the first one, she that was a minor one and I know it relates to an incident at work were a coworker yelled and used profanity at me. I have a pretty strong case against this one in that I was given an apology from my supervisor and my store manager and was exonerated from any wrongdoing because I did exactly what they asked me to do in that situation (they have zero tolerance for confrontation policy) and the other person was disciplined for the incident. And the other two (the main cause for the DQ) ‘Maturity and Discipline’ and ‘Honesty, Integrity, and Respect for Others’ relates to their indetermination on my amount of drug use and what the think is dishonest about it. To begin with I have only used marijuana and that’s all. My Background Investigator could not determine how many time had I experimented with it in my life time. I initially said, and continue to maintain, that I used it once when I was 16 in 2005, again 3-4 times a month (48 at most) between 1999 & 2000, and last used it once in 2003. They investigated this and spoke to a friend who gave them a number too low of my marijuana use and a former friend who gave them a number too high. These two guys were the last ones I smoked with in 2003. The former friend is currently a pot smoker and I haven’t associated with him since 2003, my current friend around the same time I did in 2003. I plan to appeal the LAPD DQ as soon my friend (who’s also a hotshot law school student) and I finish drafting my letter and review it. My LAPD mentor told me that I needed 4 letters or recommendation with my appeal letter and said with that I would be ‘cool’. And just to throw this in, I want to know: A) What should I include in my letter of appeaI’m 4 units away from receiving my BA in Philosophy with an emphasis in Ethics, I volunteer quit often at an elementary school helping kids with their basic arithmetic and reading skill, and I also have done some volunteer work at a homeless shelter feeding the homeless this summer. This being said, l?; B) Who should I get to write my letters of appeal?; C) What are the chances of getting reinstated?; D) When will I hear back from the appeals board?; E) How will this affect my future applications with other departments?, and; F) How should I Address this to these other departments?

    Thank you for reading this. I know its super long but I wanted to get you guys an insight into my situation so that you may make a descent assessment.
    I salute your outgoing attitude to distance yourself from your 100% sordid past. However, I think the amount of your past MJ usage goes way beyond experimental and into "avid user" territory. This will DQ you from most agencies.

    However, I would recommend that you try to volunteer your time with a law enforcement agency (if you can pass their backgrounds standard) so that they might get a better feel for the overall direction your life is heading. It is really hard to judge someone's present character solely on what they did in the past. You need to demonstrate that you have evolved and moved on. If you can't pass for a reserve officer position, try parking officer, dispatcher, etc. I know certain agencies have different standards on the drug usage for other non-sworn positions. Most agencies recruit from within, and it will give you an opportunity to bump arms with various personnel and command.

    This comes from my personal experience as an applicant, although I have entirely different background "problems" than you. I have passed 3 backgrounds, waiting to hear back from 1 more. I have been fortunate to been selected for two competitive LE internships, and also one reserve officer position (1 more on the way). Granted, these opportunities are volunteer, but what better way to show them what you got, especially in this economy.

    Best of luck to you in your endeavor.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by avalon42 View Post
    I salute your outgoing attitude to distance yourself from your 100% sordid past. However, I think the amount of your past MJ usage goes way beyond experimental and into "avid user" territory. This will DQ you from most agencies.

    However, I would recommend that you try to volunteer your time with a law enforcement agency (if you can pass their backgrounds standard) so that they might get a better feel for the overall direction your life is heading. It is really hard to judge someone's present character solely on what they did in the past. You need to demonstrate that you have evolved and moved on. If you can't pass for a reserve officer position, try parking officer, dispatcher, etc. I know certain agencies have different standards on the drug usage for other non-sworn positions. Most agencies recruit from within, and it will give you an opportunity to bump arms with various personnel and command.

    This comes from my personal experience as an applicant, although I have entirely different background "problems" than you. I have passed 3 backgrounds, waiting to hear back from 1 more. I have been fortunate to been selected for two competitive LE internships, and also one reserve officer position (1 more on the way). Granted, these opportunities are volunteer, but what better way to show them what you got, especially in this economy.

    Best of luck to you in your endeavor.

    Hey thats what I'm trying to do as well . I've never tried any type of drugs or anything and still I haven't had any luck with the agencies I've applied for. So ALICON do yourself a favor and try to mature and learn from those negative aspects. Probably time will heal all those mistakes and bad decisions you've made throughout your life. And please dont let anybody discourage you.

    By the way guys; how's my writing? English is my second lenguage and I've been trying to improve my grammar skills. Please be mean and heartless with your opinions and feedback... I love to suffer. (Ok, ok! That was a joke)

  21. #21
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    1 or 2 or even 3 times is experimental. Anything more than that makes me believe, "You tried it.....and LOVED IT." Seriously after experimenting for the 30th time....what were you thinking????? "Hmmmm I think I can get higher and more hungrier." LOL
    What if quotas did exist?!

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    Pepe....getting better! I see a marked increase in proper grammar and spelling. Good job, sir, and keep it up!

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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by ExSDSO View Post
    1 or 2 or even 3 times is experimental. Anything more than that makes me believe, "You tried it.....and LOVED IT." Seriously after experimenting for the 30th time....what were you thinking????? "Hmmmm I think I can get higher and more hungrier." LOL
    Yeah, I think after the third or fourth time, you've moved on from experimentation to research. By then you need a lab coat, a clipboard, a white rat, and a maze.
    "Many times, I have thoughts and feelings which can only be expressed through dance!" - Bender, Futurama

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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by hankido2000 View Post
    Let me guess, you smoked but didn't inhale, right?
    If you don't inhale, it does not count!
    Last edited by Nacho1523; 08-27-2009 at 12:53 AM. Reason: spelling

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    Quote Originally Posted by FJDave View Post
    Pepe....getting better! I see a marked increase in proper grammar and spelling. Good job, sir, and keep it up!
    Sir, yes, sir!!


    By the way can I pm you with an important question I have.

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