1. #1
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    Siren and Lights

    Wherever you may be located in the US or Canada, I have a couple of questions.

    As a citizen, do I legally have to move or pull over for a cop NOT using his sirens, lights, or intercom?? I just wondered b/c last week an undercover cop was flyin down the road, and I didn't know it was a cop until maybe he was right behind me.

    Is it also policy or law that a police officer must use lights or sirens when driving much over the speed limit? Are you allowed to respond to a call/ emergency or w/e without using them??

    Thanks a lot

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    No you don't have to pull over for every police car you see driving down the street. Only for lights. We frequently speed without lights to get to a location without bad guys knowing. Its fine.
    For the cops out there: You are an adult. If you want to write someone, write them. If you don't want to write someone, then don't write them.

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  3. #3
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    When going code here most pull over for lights, Canadians just keep driving same speed and pass the people that pull over for the emergency lights.. really tends to **** u off..got to slam on brakes for every Canadian on road really slows u down.. and since I am 10 miles from Manitoba border every time u go code on highway u inconter these clowns.. I wish had the man power to pull everyone of them over that does not yield and give them the $100 ticket they got comeing..

    Sometimes when I see a ambulance going code I follow it and pull over the first car that does not yield and cite them


    no Canadian bashing intended


    oh yeah to answer question any vehicle with out emergency lights turned on is just like another normal civilian car.. but when red+blues or just reds are flashing here all drivers must pull over to nearest righthanded sholder and stop until emergency vechile passes, that includes both directions of travel on a non divided highway
    Last edited by Red Swan; 01-29-2009 at 05:58 PM.

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    Around here a driver would not be legally obligated to pull over unless the emergency vehicle is operating with lights and siren activated.

  5. #5
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    California law stipulates emergency vehicles will operate a steady burning, forward facing red light. As well as a siren audible from 50ft away. Pursuant to 21055 CVC. (SgtCHP can correct me if I'm wrong...)

    21055. The driver of an authorized emergency vehicle is exempt from
    Chapter 2 (commencing with Section 21350), Chapter 3 (commencing
    with Section 21650), Chapter 4 (commencing with Section 21800),
    Chapter 5 (commencing with Section 21950), Chapter 6 (commencing with
    22100), Chapter 7 (commencing with Section 22348), Chapter 8
    (commencing with Section 22450), Chapter 9 (commencing with Section
    22500), and Chapter 10 (commencing with Section 22650) of this
    division, and Article 3 (commencing with Section 38305) and Article 4
    (commencing with Section 38312) of Chapter 5 of Division 16.5, under
    all of the following conditions:
    (a) If the vehicle is being driven in response to an emergency call or while engaged in rescue operations or is being used in the immediate pursuit of an actual or suspected violator of the law or is responding to, but not returning from, a fire alarm, except that fire department vehicles are exempt whether directly responding to an emergency call or operated from one place to another as rendered desirable or necessary by reason of an emergency call and operated to the scene of the emergency or operated from one fire station to another or to some other location by reason of the emergency call.
    (b) If the driver of the vehicle sounds a siren as may be reasonably necessary and the vehicle displays a lighted red lamp visible from the front as a warning to other drivers and pedestrians.

  6. #6
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    Is it also policy or law that a police officer must use lights or sirens when driving much over the speed limit? Are you allowed to respond to a call/ emergency or w/e without using them?
    ?

    Sometimes
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  7. #7
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    that being said, if an officer directs you to pull over (w/ or w/o lights) you better stop
    Perseverate In Pugna

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    California Vehicle Code section 21055 mandates how an emergency vehicle will be operated to be protected by law. As a matter of practice, in the state of CA, most emergency services vehicles opt to run with rear flashing yellow lights activated and no red or red/blue lights to the front when operating on the freeway. Emergency lights and sirens on the freeway generally cause chaotic responses from drivers who are otherwise distracted with personal or business matters. However, if one observes emergency lights and hears a siren approaching from behind they are obligated to move to the right and allow the emergency vehicle to pass unencumbered.

    Authorized Emergency Vehicles

    21806. Upon the immediate approach of an authorized emergency vehicle which is sounding a siren and which has at least one lighted lamp exhibiting red light that is visible, under normal atmospheric conditions, from a distance of 1,000 feet to the front of the vehicle, the surrounding traffic shall, except as otherwise directed by a traffic officer, do the following:

    (a) (1) Except as required under paragraph (2), the driver of every other vehicle shall yield the right-of-way and shall immediately drive to the right-hand edge or curb of the highway, clear of any intersection, and thereupon shall stop and remain stopped until the authorized emergency vehicle has passed.

    (2) A person driving a vehicle in an exclusive or preferential use lane shall exit that lane immediately upon determining that the exit can be accomplished with reasonable safety.

    (b) The operator of every street car shall immediately stop the street car, clear of any intersection, and remain stopped until the authorized emergency vehicle has passed.

    (c) All pedestrians upon the highway shall proceed to the nearest curb or place of safety and remain there until the authorized emergency vehicle has passed.

    Amended Sec. 68, Ch. 1154, Stats. 1996. Effective September 30, 1996.
    Actually, the tests for sirens are as follows:

    1021. Definitions.


    (a) A "siren" is an audible warning device that produces the readily recognizable warning sound identified with emergency vehicles. An audible device, such as a vehicle theft alarm, that produces a sound with one or more of the following characteristics is not a siren:

    (1) an unvarying sound.


    (2) a varying sound that cycles at a rate faster than 400 cycles per minute.


    (3) a discontinuous sound that repeats at rates lower than 90 cycles per minute or higher than 400 cycles per minute.


    (4) a sound frequency (and any second harmonics) lower than 100 Hz or higher than 5,000 Hz.


    (b) An "authorized emergency vehicle siren" is a device that meets the requirements of this article.

    (c) An "electromechanical siren" consists of a stator and rotor driven by an electric motor.

    (d) An "electronic siren" consists of an oscillator, amplifier, and speaker.

    (e) A "mechanical siren" consists of a stator and rotor driven by a mechanical connection to a moving part of the vehicle or engine.

    (f) "Manual" means a siren control that allows the operator to produce a wailing sound by alternately applying and releasing a momentary contact switch.

    (g) "Wail" is a siren sound producing a slow, continuous automatic cycling of increasing and decreasing frequencies and sound levels.

    (h) "Yelp" is a siren sound producing a rapid, continuous automatic cycling of increasing and decreasing frequencies and sound levels.

    (i) "Hi-Lo" means a nonsiren sound alternating between a fixed high and a fixed low frequency.

    (j) "ANS" means a standard adopted by the American National Standards Institute, Inc., 1430 Broadway, New York, NY 10018.

    (k) "SAE" means a standard or recommended practice of the Society of Automotive Engineers, 400 Commonwealth Drive, Warrendale, PA 15096.





    Note: Authority cited: Section 26103, Vehicle Code. Reference: Sections 26103, 26104 and 27002, Vehicle Code.
    Final note: When operating under emergency conditions (Code 3) the law is very clear and is supported by documented case law. The siren does not have to be in constant operation. It must be sounded as necessary to attract the attention of other drivers at any time they may be affected.

    If an emergency vehicle is not operating under emergency (Code 3) conditions, other drivers do not have to yield or move over unless directed by an officer.
    Be courteous to all, but intimate with few, and let those few be well tried before you give them your confidence!

    [George Washington (1732 - 1799)]


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    Quote Originally Posted by SgtCHP View Post
    As a matter of practice, in the state of CA, most emergency services vehicles opt to run with rear flashing yellow lights activated and no red or red/blue lights to the front when operating on the freeway. Emergency lights and sirens on the freeway generally cause chaotic responses from drivers who are otherwise distracted with personal or business matters.
    The same applies in our (much more rural) state. You will regularly see patrol cars in the left lane of the interstate running at high speed to a call with only the rear yellow lights flashing. Occasionally, they will turn on their front wig-wag headlights to direct slow moving traffic out of the left lane so they can pass.

    X2 on the problems you can cause running emergency down a freeway. What you end up with is drivers lulled to sleep by the highway not paying attention- then they suddenly panic when you pull up behind them. Mix that with other drivers who think they don't have to pull over and stop (they do under the law) on the freeway and you have a mess.
    ---Cut the red wire---

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by pilotguyCANADA View Post
    Wherever you may be located in the US or Canada, I have a couple of questions.

    As a citizen, do I legally have to move or pull over for a cop NOT using his sirens, lights, or intercom?? I just wondered b/c last week an undercover cop was flyin down the road, and I didn't know it was a cop until maybe he was right behind me.

    Is it also policy or law that a police officer must use lights or sirens when driving much over the speed limit? Are you allowed to respond to a call/ emergency or w/e without using them??

    Thanks a lot
    Nope and yep.

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    Here is something I have always wondered... A couple questions actually...

    1. If a officer is responding code, do other officers have to pull to the side?
    2. Personal opinion. If you see a squad driving code and you arent on a call, do you follow them to see what is going on?
    3. Does it happen often where for example a CHP is driving down the road and a Sheriff is speeding, does that CHP pull the local over or vice versa?
    4. What are the regulations regarding another agency speeding and you pulling them over?
    5. If you see a unmarked car driving down the road running code do you follow them? If they were unmarked and driving code speeding and it was a legit looking car (for instance, a crown vic or explorer as opposed to a 76 pinto) would you pull that car over?

    Number 5 I ask because I was doing a ride along with a bounty hunter. He was responding code to a call where we got a agent in distress. Our guy was pinned down and needed our back up. He had PD on the way also but we decided to roll code (Not my car, not my decision and I adviced him not to roll code but he did it anyways with his reds) We past a local PD and they didnt even look twice.

    Thanks in advanced!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by TRowe View Post
    Number 5 I ask because I was doing a ride along with a bounty hunter. He was responding code to a call where we got a agent in distress. Our guy was pinned down and needed our back up. He had PD on the way also but we decided to roll code (Not my car, not my decision and I adviced him not to roll code but he did it anyways with his reds) We past a local PD and they didnt even look twice.

    Thanks in advanced!
    "with his reds"

    bounty hunters are not authorized LEOs to have emergency lighting; maybe amber lights like construction crews...I'm surprised you and your co-worker bounty hunter weren't pulled over by the local pd cruiser you guys passed trying to play police

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    Yes, Im aware they are not authorized to have reds, hence me advising him against it. However, I wasnt going to sit there while my partner was pinned down in gun fire. If that idiot wanted to risk his career by running reds, thats his problem not mine. My main priority was getting to my partner to back him up. Im sure you guys would do anything you had to do to get to your partner. And to be honest, I would run reds any day if it meant saving anyones life, my partner or not.

    I take offense to your remarks. In fact, they were down right rude. We werent playing police. One, as I said, he wasnt my partner. He was another bounty hunter we were working with but I just happened to be with him at the time I got the call my partner needed back up. And two, we werent playing police. My partner was pinned down and we were getting to him. Are you telling me that you wouldnt do what it took to get to your partner if he had guns pointing at him and he was being shot at? Maybe YOUR in the wrong profession. Because I think running red lights is a pretty appropriate response to a, well what is to me at least, a potential 11-99... I would do anything to protect my partner and the lives of the good guys and I accept you would do the same thing.

    Im surprised to get such a prickish comment from someone on this board. At the least, you could have answered at least one of my questions. Meaning you didnt set out to be helpful at all, you just set out to be a complete *******. Get over yourself.

    After reading your profile, let me ask you this. Being that you cannot "play police" and run reds, if your partner was in trouble and you had no choice but to break a very petty law considering what you were doing it for, would you? You dont deserve to wear a badge otherwise because remember the LEO golden rule, make sure you and your partner go home at night. I would be very worried if you were backing me up
    Last edited by TRowe; 01-31-2009 at 04:06 AM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by TRowe View Post
    Yes, Im aware they are not authorized to have reds, hence me advising him against it. However, I wasnt going to sit there while my partner was pinned down in gun fire. If that idiot wanted to risk his career by running reds, thats his problem not mine. My main priority was getting to my partner to back him up. Im sure you guys would do anything you had to do to get to your partner. And to be honest, I would run reds any day if it meant saving anyones life, my partner or not.
    I wouldn't be further than 10 feet away from my partner. Plain and simple, why was your partner alone (assuming it was just him pinned right?) and why weren't you there with him, but racing towards him with another co-worker?

    I take offense to your remarks. In fact, they were down right rude. We werent playing police.
    Really?


    One, as I said, he wasnt my partner. He was another bounty hunter we were working with but I just happened to be with him at the time I got the call my partner needed back up. And two, we werent playing police. My partner was pinned down and we were getting to him.
    you repeated your statement twice. I guess your right about taking offense to my remarks. Again, why were you away from YOUR partner?


    Are you telling me that you wouldnt do what it took to get to your partner if he had guns pointing at him and he was being shot at? Maybe YOUR in the wrong profession. Because I think running red lights is a pretty appropriate response to a, well what is to me at least, a potential 11-99... I would do anything to protect my partner and the lives of the good guys and I accept you would do the same thing.
    I would be near my partner with a lot of my slober on the radio.....and my other hand on my glock. Not sitting in a passenger seat of another bounty hunter with a red light racing at higher rate of speed with unaware drivers darting around.......again, your lucky you guys didn't get arrested for impersonating a police officer or even worse, getting into an auto accident.

    Didn't you say the police were already called and were heading towards that direction? What use would you be to your partner dead or pulled over?

    Im surprised to get such a prickish comment from someone on this board. At the least, you could have answered at least one of my questions. Meaning you didnt set out to be helpful at all, you just set out to be a complete *******. Get over yourself.
    I highly suggest you cool your jets off chief. Also, I answered your question #5 to be exact.....re-read what I wrote.

    After reading your profile, let me ask you this. Being that you cannot "play police" and run reds, if your partner was in trouble and you had no choice but to break a very petty law considering what you were doing it for, would you? You dont deserve to wear a badge otherwise because remember the LEO golden rule, make sure you and your partner go home at night. I would be very worried if you were backing me up
    Excuse me? Your telling me and others the LEO golden rule, and what it takes to go home safely to our families at the end of our shifts? You don't know jack squat about LEO anything.

    Look, it's obvious you take a ton of pride in the employment you have chosen. To go through the liberties of searching everything for bounty hunting in the search tab and responding to any topic in relations to your pride and joy; and also asking awkward questions such as your #5

    "5. If you see a unmarked car driving down the road running code do you follow them? If they were unmarked and driving code speeding and it was a legit looking car (for instance, a crown vic or explorer as opposed to a 76 pinto) would you pull that car over?"

    It's obvious that you are looking for a LEO's input on bounty hunting and what we think of this profession in general. It's also obvious that you are trying to coin out little tidbits that you could do to be as law enforcing as possible and as similar to LEOs in terms of code 3 and emergency situations.

    Don't tell me that I don't deserve to wear a badge; when you go through real training and the police/peace officers academy and not through the bounty hunter's guide to protecting your partner by speeding down the highway/roadway with a single red flashing/strobing light with no sirens or other emergency equipment outfitted on your civilian vehicle(s) made to look like an unmarked police vehicle.......you have a lot to learn why some of us are sworn in and have a badge that is not ordered through a catalog.

  15. #15
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    After reading your profile, let me ask you this. Being that you cannot "play police" and run reds, if your partner was in trouble and you had no choice but to break a very petty law considering what you were doing it for, would you? You dont deserve to wear a badge otherwise because remember the LEO golden rule, make sure you and your partner go home at night. I would be very worried if you were backing me up


    And this is what separates bounty hunters from Law Enforcement!

    Probation Officers are more akin to Law Enforcement than private citizens acting on behalf of a third party.
    Theirs is recognized as a cog in the criminal justice system necessary for the maintenance of the guilty.

    Your inflated opinion of what is pretty appropriate when responding to a partner in trouble is pathetic. You should respond by CALLING the POLICE. Anything else is just an overreaction to an already bad situation.
    "a band is blowing Dixie double four time You feel alright when you hear the music ring"


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    Last edited by Tpr; 05-31-2009 at 02:52 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TRowe View Post
    I take offense to your remarks. In fact, they were down right rude.
    Simmer down now... Wow!

    I don't see anything in his remarks that was offense OR rude.

    If you took offense to a simple reply like that I would love to see how you handle an arrest with someone who is chipping their teeth at you!

    Let me give you an answer to #5. If I would have encountered your unmarked car running lights- one I do not recognize as being from the area I work- I would contact my dispatcher to have them query agencies in our area and I would fall in behind you. If no one could figure out who you were, I would stop you.

    The hole in your story is- if this was such an emergency with someone pinned down under gunfire and you had to use red lights etc to get to them for help, why wasn't that local patrol car responding to the same call? If there was an all hands, shots fired call going on in the area, I am willing to guarantee that no officer would be sitting along the road watching cars go by.

    Also, who in their right mind would take a "ride along" with them into a situation where shots are being fired?

    Tell you what. This sounds like it was a big deal. Why don't you give us a link to a media report that went out about this bond enforcement agency being pinned down by gunfire that you were at?
    Last edited by KAA951; 01-31-2009 at 01:01 PM.
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    Better not argue with the real cops on this thread then!
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    Quote Originally Posted by pilotguyCANADA View Post
    Wherever you may be located in the US or Canada, I have a couple of questions.

    As a citizen, do I legally have to move or pull over for a cop NOT using his sirens, lights, or intercom?? I just wondered b/c last week an undercover cop was flyin down the road, and I didn't know it was a cop until maybe he was right behind me.

    Is it also policy or law that a police officer must use lights or sirens when driving much over the speed limit? Are you allowed to respond to a call/ emergency or w/e without using them??

    Thanks a lot
    Yes in MOST cases our policy dictates that we use both lights and sirens together because it's the safest way to get to where we need to go. Not in all cases though do we use sirens obviously. When stealth is needed such as being close to an in-progress robbery etc...you get the picture. Regardless if we use lights only or both lighs and sirens it is your responsibility to yield to us and get out of our way and if you don't you can be charged. Hope that answers your question.
    "Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference in the world. The MARINES don't have that problem." ....Ronald Reagan

  20. #20
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    Read "Mr. Professional's" other posts about his Bail Enforcement career.

    http://forums.officer.com/forums/sho...=1#post1628847
    ---Cut the red wire---

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by TRowe View Post
    Yes, Im aware they are not authorized to have reds, hence me advising him against it. However, I wasnt going to sit there while my partner was pinned down in gun fire. If that idiot wanted to risk his career by running reds, thats his problem not mine. My main priority was getting to my partner to back him up. Im sure you guys would do anything you had to do to get to your partner. And to be honest, I would run reds any day if it meant saving anyones life, my partner or not.

    I take offense to your remarks. In fact, they were down right rude. We werent playing police. One, as I said, he wasnt my partner. He was another bounty hunter we were working with but I just happened to be with him at the time I got the call my partner needed back up. And two, we werent playing police. My partner was pinned down and we were getting to him. Are you telling me that you wouldnt do what it took to get to your partner if he had guns pointing at him and he was being shot at? Maybe YOUR in the wrong profession. Because I think running red lights is a pretty appropriate response to a, well what is to me at least, a potential 11-99... I would do anything to protect my partner and the lives of the good guys and I accept you would do the same thing.

    Im surprised to get such a prickish comment from someone on this board. At the least, you could have answered at least one of my questions. Meaning you didnt set out to be helpful at all, you just set out to be a complete *******. Get over yourself.

    After reading your profile, let me ask you this. Being that you cannot "play police" and run reds, if your partner was in trouble and you had no choice but to break a very petty law considering what you were doing it for, would you? You dont deserve to wear a badge otherwise because remember the LEO golden rule, make sure you and your partner go home at night. I would be very worried if you were backing me up

    The type of call you described is something we "routinely" deal with and because of it we have our policy. You do not have the right to drive with no regard for others safety by running red lights, trust me on this one and it has nothing to do with being a police officer or a bounty hunter. We have to stop at each intersection regardless of the color of the light and usually only the closest unit to the officer asking for help will actually be allowed to run code even if everyone wants to that does not mean everyone runs code. In your situation you had better just hope the Police got the call as a tone call so they could get there fast because in noway if you are not Police, Fire or EMS are you allowed to respond in the manner that we do. Non-emergency vehicles are not made to run code as frequently as we do and quite frankly non-emergecy personnel are not trained in the same type of driving that we are that involves speed and percision. That is a fact not someone needing to get over themselves. You need to face the reality of what is safe over your need to be somewhere no matter what the reason is, if you do not get their at all because you run red lights and flip your non-equiped car what good are you doing your friend?
    Last edited by Nightshift va; 01-31-2009 at 01:25 PM.
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by TRowe View Post
    Here is something I have always wondered... A couple questions actually...

    1. If a officer is responding code, do other officers have to pull to the side?

    Yes, if they are not operating Code 3!

    2. Personal opinion. If you see a squad driving code and you arent on a call, do you follow them to see what is going on?

    No! Why would I? If another agency wants additional assistance from my agency, they will call for additional units. If, however, I feel something is wrong, I may have the local agency called to see if there is an issue.

    3. Does it happen often where for example a CHP is driving down the road and a Sheriff is speeding, does that CHP pull the local over or vice versa?

    No! That type of action may result in an unfortunate loss of life or injury because of an ill timed traffic stop. It is not our business what another Officer is doing responding to a call. If they want help, they will call.

    4. What are the regulations regarding another agency speeding and you pulling them over?

    LEO's are bound by the same rules of the road as the public. They do, however, have certain exceptions granted them when operating an "Authorized Emergency Vehicle" We do not stop AEV's as a matter of routine. There have been exceptions.

    5. If you see a unmarked car driving down the road running code do you follow them? I may follow them as long as they are on my beat to make certain the public yields as required by law. If they were unmarked and driving code speeding and it was a legit looking car (for instance, a crown vic or explorer as opposed to a 76 pinto) would you pull that car over? Not as a general rule. However, I may have radio check to see if it is a legitmate undercover unit; and, if not, I would stop and verify the occupants. If they are not LEOs, they are subject to arrest for impersonating law enforcement officers; I would impound the vehicle and contact the appropriate State agency to see that the licenses to operate as a BEA's were cancelled within this state.

    Number 5 I ask because I was doing a ride along with a bounty hunter. He was responding code to a call where we got a agent in distress. Our guy was pinned down and needed our back up. He had PD on the way also but we decided to roll code (Not my car, not my decision and I adviced him not to roll code but he did it anyways with his reds) We past a local PD and they didnt even look twice.

    You were/are not an Authorized Emergency Vehicle and are not permitted to run Code 3 It would appear that you would be in violation of section 1299.07 of the California Penal Code - misrepresenting yourself as a law enforcement officer - if you performed (5) above in CA.






    Thanks in advanced!
    What you fail to realize is the fact that Law Enforcement Officers in CA are fairly well acquainted with other LEO's working in their adjacent areas. They know the equipment and can immediately radio in to ascertain if there is indeed an emergency or the circumstances of a specific call. Irrespective of what others may think, all agencies in CA work with cohesive respect and would never jeopordize the life of another. We all have our specific duties and regardless of the shape of the badge or color of the uniform we strive for professional conduct and do not abuse the respect of our brethren.
    Last edited by SgtCHP; 01-31-2009 at 04:48 PM.
    Be courteous to all, but intimate with few, and let those few be well tried before you give them your confidence!

    [George Washington (1732 - 1799)]


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