do you think all police should work jails first?

[glock26rocs]

theres a lot of police officers who dont know how to talk to people and i think if they where in a situation where they needed to get 60 crooks to follow orders and they talked that crap and got knocked out,,,they might change their approach to people.All im saying is that there is a way to talk to people.

i mean theres times when i get to cursing and it works as long as you dont show the fear of 60 crooks around you..sometimes you take a chance in talking ****,,,but you cant be scared.

as far as being an officer on the street,,,all civilians arent bad and all civilians arent civilians,,,,,so i think police officers should know how to talk to people.

ive seen female cos run a cell block better than any males,,,,,,the job is mental more than physical.

so the question is,,,,,,,,do you think all police should work jails first?

i say yes

[Pedro56]

I say no, 95% of the jail guards I know would have no business on the street whatsoever. I don't know how it is out by you but here most of the deputy sheriffs cause more problems than they are worth.

[Bowles]

I don't think it would be a bad idea to allow (new) police officers to spend some time working the jail. Mainly because new officers will have the opportunity to learn many of the BS stories they will encounter on the streets.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by Bowles

I don't think it would be a bad idea to allow (new) police officers to spend some time working the jail. Mainly because new officers will have the opportunity to learn many of the BS stories they will encounter on the streets.

I agree. I hear lots of stories from both ends. I see no reason unless they need the bodies. In referance to the communication skills we have ours, you have your's.
When I started the jailers used to **** me off because I'd bring in total ********* and the jailers would pretty much kiss thier *** and tell them the bad man who brought you in will leave soon. After time I understand.
Inside the "block" I see who you need to pussy-foot around with them since they out number you, on the street we out number them.

TGY

[Freakapino]

Originally Posted by mz248

I say no....there are plenty of ways to learn communication skills besides working in a jail. I worked in the largest jail in this region for a couple of years before working the streets and it was great experience but there are other ways to learn how to deal with people.

I definitely agree with you. You don't have to work as a CO to learn all the BS, you'll get plenty of that on the street. However, that depends on the kind of town or city you work at. As for me, I work in the city where you get to deal with a lot of sh*tbags and BGs, and they'll give all the colorful BS and stories - not just that even regular civilians will tell you BS. So, it all depends on the person, on how (s)he deals with the BS and learn to pay attention on what people are saying, and how (s)he analyze and reacts to it.

Actually, in my honest opinion, the street environment is better to learn communications compare to jail, since you get to deal more with a variety of people - from little kids to teens, and adults of different of background, culture, and language. Now, talking about communication - that's a challenge - you know what to expect if you're in the jail, the kind of people you have to deal with. But in the street, you have to be more like a chameleon - be able to adapt to your surroundings and its people, because it changes constantly.

Whether you work on the street or in the jail, it doesn't matter, it all depends on the individual on dealing with people.

[Bodie]

You learn a lot. I think in a prison rather then jail where you are in among the inmates and have to earn respect and learn how to treat people.

[BillP]

Originally Posted by That Guy

I agree. I hear lots of stories from both ends. I see no reason unless they need the bodies. In referance to the communication skills we have ours, you have your's.
When I started the jailers used to **** me off because I'd bring in total ********* and the jailers would pretty much kiss thier *** and tell them the bad man who brought you in will leave soon. After time I understand.
Inside the "block" I see who you need to pussy-foot around with them since they out number you, on the street we out number them.

TGY

Your statement above is a prime reason why I think any street cop should have to work inside a state or county institution for at least 90 days, perferably in a maximum level setting.

How many felons do you, on average, come in contact with on a daily basis?

Try anywhere from 200 to 2500.

Behind the fences, the population is entirely comprised of convicted felons.

Different world from dealing with a population that is, vastly law abiding and not requiring any intervention by LEO.

Only advantage we have over any LEO on the street is that we know what we are dealing with on a daily basis.

Corrections Officers manage, by and large without any weapons aside from perhaps OC if they are lucky, to control what are basically self-contained cities with, unlike outside the fences, a totally criminal population and those Corrections Officers manage to do so on a daily basis without major incident.

And in this day of diminishing staffing it is being accomplished on a daily basis by a group that generally knows that if the doo hits the fan your hanging by yourself for a while.

I have the utmost respect for what LEO's on the street do, go through and deal with when it comes to their career. I have 2 friends who are PA State Troopers and another who is a local Township LEO. I know what they do, and what their day, for the most part consists of. They also know what I do, and what my day, for the most part, consists of.

Please do not try and minimize what a CO does, or paint it as we have to "pussy-foot around because we are outnumbered". If that were remotely true then what control is exercised on a daily basis inside the fence would simply not exist.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by BillP

Please do not try and minimize what a CO does, or paint it as we have to "pussy-foot around because we are outnumbered". If that were remotely true then what control is exercised on a daily basis inside the fence would simply not exist.

Didn't mean to offend anyone, trust me I wouldn't want your job. But on the same side you are out numbered inside. Many people I bring know the rules "inside" and are living out thier fantasies. They don't midn the COs. They don't care for us because we caught them and brought them there.

In the same breath qoutes like this:

theres a lot of police officers who dont know how to talk to people and i think if they where in a situation where they needed to get 60 crooks to follow orders and they talked that crap and got knocked out,,,they might change their approach to people.

Get a reaction like mine.

TGY

[Graydog]

I agree with most of the above. Working inside can certainly be an education for a new guy or gal......It's definately not for everybody though.
I think it should be a requirment for 90 days or so.
One thing to remember if working inside a jail or prison, you usually have barrier between you and them, but not always. Bottom line is, don't let your mouth overload your brain, epecially in a county jail. You just may see them on the street later, or worse yet, their friends with them in a car load you have stop. Ca. as some states now has a 3-strike law, and alot of these clowns you'll be stopping have nothing to lose if they take you out. The Don't want to go back inside.

Graydog

[Bowles]

Seems like a disagreement is erupting on this thread over who has the most dangerous job. The short answer is they are both dangerous. I've done 'em both so I'm not just talking out my *****. As for cops working inside a prison or county jail for a while, like I said above I can't see it being a bad thing. I wouldn't require it of them, but if they wanted and I were ruling the world I wouldn't object too it. My reason is that IMO the (new) officer would benefit from the exposure to these dirt bags. Likewise the CO could benefit from a few ride a longs as well.

[ftlaudcop]

I have to agree both sides..get the respect they deserve,

my agency has 1200 or so road patrol
1200 assigned to jail

I'd have to say 65 % went thru our jail system 1st,
and turned out career wise 10 star rated cop's

the local agencies, who hired our jail deputies after the 2 yr
" we promise you, do 2 yrs in the jail and you can go to the road"
those guys are doing great as well.

I can only speak for my agency , where it has worked well.......
different area's of the county are affected by, the demograpghics, economies
etc....nowadays, all l.e.o. agency's have a difficult task on hand.

they have inevnted course's on how to effectively recruit, and motivate
the gen x crowd, "fast and furious" cop's....

yr gonna get a rude awakening for sure if you start out in corrections,
put on yr boxing gloves or put on yr panty hose.


www.schackdaddy.com

[EMTFirefighter]

No way. Corrections is a completely different job than law enforcement. If you want to be a jailer, be one. If you want to be a cop, be one. It's like asking if you should work at McDonald's first before working at WAL-MART.

[brit girlie]

I say NO - the 2 jobs are very different but the skills needed are similar.
I'm sure if coppers wanted to work in prisons they would have done that instead, I have no doubt they would make a good job of it.....I don't fancy a Job swap.......too much running around at least my cons are in 1 place!!!

[Photogrrlz]

I thought it was a good learning experience when I worked in the jail before getting out on the road and in the courts. I got to learn who I would be dealing with on the streets.

[DaveNT]

I spent 12 months working in a large max/Security gaol whilst waiting for a position in the police. I thought it was a great leaning experience listening to all the tricks the cons try and pull on police. I think it gave me a little edge over some of my friends when I first when out on the road.

[paturnkey]

Originally Posted by EMTFirefighter

No way. Corrections is a completely different job than law enforcement. If you want to be a jailer, be one. If you want to be a cop, be one. It's like asking if you should work at McDonald's first before working at WAL-MART.

EMTFirefighter: What do you know about Corrections/Law Enforcement your a Police Dispatcher not a Cop or a C.O. In Corrections we Enforce the Laws of our State and the Rules of the Institution where we Patrol. We don't just stand there.We Patrol small citys that are Fenced/Walled that everone who lives in this city is a Covicted Felon.You know the one the Real Police try to catch after they commit a crime. We do the same Inside too. We investigate Crimes inside such as assaults sexual/phys,theft,and yes murder. Now we don't Press the formal state charges the State Police does that. We do Press the Institutional charges and yes they serve time for those too. I hope your impression of Corrections and Correctional Officers are not from Tv and the Movies which I have never seen to have shown what we do or what we go thru everyday we walk our Beat. Yes everyone of our Officers is a first Responder trained in basic first aid and Self Defence and our "Dispatchers" in Central Control are regular C.O.'s and respond when not in Contol. "C.Os Patrol the Toughest Beat in the world."

[Jabrim]

Originally Posted by EMTFirefighter

No way. Corrections is a completely different job than law enforcement. If you want to be a jailer, be one. If you want to be a cop, be one. It's like asking if you should work at McDonald's first before working at WAL-MART.

Ignorant response in my opinion, the two job fields are not completely different at all.

[Bowles]

Originally Posted by EMTFirefighter

No way. Corrections is a completely different job than law enforcement. If you want to be a jailer, be one. If you want to be a cop, be one. It's like asking if you should work at McDonald's first before working at WAL-MART.

This is a cut and past job of a response I gave to another post along these lines:

Originally Posted by BOWLES

Most people, including many police officers have no idea what our job is. As a former police officer myself I can say the jobs are more similar than most people would expect.
My jurisdiction, instead of ending at the city limit, or county line ends at a chain link fence covered in razor wire and everyone who lives there is a criminal.
When I'm on duty I respond to emergencies, investigate crimes and make arrests.
Everyone accepts the fact that there are crimes committed behind bars, but when was the last time a police officer responded to a prison? Usually when there is a riot, the state police are called in as back up. During more serious criminal investigations (murder/death of inmate) the SBI handles that investigation.
But that is about it. So next time someone tells you, Correctional Officers aren't law enforcement remember, all they think they know of your job is what they've seen on TV.

[paturnkey]

Originally Posted by Bowles

This is a cut and past job of a response I gave to another post along these lines:

Sorry Bowles wasn't trying to steal your statements even though they are close......I can't stand ignorance of a closed mind from someone who has no Idea what really goes on in our world and just listens to what they learn on T.V......and this coming from who must believe everything the perps are telling them.....just a thought

[Bowles]

Originally Posted by paturnkey

Sorry Bowles wasn't trying to steal your statements even though they are close.

Thought never entered my mind, just wanted to add my two cents.

[keith758]

Personally, the best cops on our department are those that worked in the jail first. They learned how to really talk with people on something other than an authoritarian level.

[EMTFirefighter]

Originally Posted by Jabrim

Ignorant response in my opinion, the two job fields are not completely different at all.

Yeah, I guess you're right. Cops and COs both wear uniforms and deal with ****bags. That's about the extent of the similarities.

[keith758]

I guess as someone that has worked in State prisons as a C.O., county jails as a C.O., and the road as an officer, there are a lot more similarities than some "experts" on this board would care to recognize. Both jobs not only put you in direct contact with societies rejects, but both jobs also cause you to think critically about the best way to handle a situation. In both you are given laws and rules that you must enforce, either to the letter of the law or to the intent of the law. In both you have to be aware of your surroundings to survive.In both, you are doing a job that most of society really has no clue about. It's a lot more than the " same uniforms and dealing with ****bags," as some "experts" would maintain.

[ftlaudcop]

I haven't seen to many mcdonalds hamburger flippers who turned street
cop have much street sense, yes their are exceptions.
if the retirement time could be bought city to county , the valuable people skills that you learn , you could not put a price on.

I work with 25 yr vet, and plenty of them still don't know their
***** from a hole in the ground...

some of the new hires are focussed, a lot are not....
they get a baptism under fire and their rear ends kicked
learning the mean ways of the street, where the guy who worked
inside for a few yrs....knows who can write a check with money in bank,
or mean mugging ya selling wolf tickets.


www.schackdaddy.com

[Crex4242]

Originally Posted by glock26rocs

theres a lot of police officers who dont know how to talk to people and i think if they where in a situation where they needed to get 60 crooks to follow orders and they talked that crap and got knocked out,,,they might change their approach to people.All im saying is that there is a way to talk to people.

i mean theres times when i get to cursing and it works as long as you dont show the fear of 60 crooks around you..sometimes you take a chance in talking ****,,,but you cant be scared.

as far as being an officer on the street,,,all civilians arent bad and all civilians arent civilians,,,,,so i think police officers should know how to talk to people.

ive seen female cos run a cell block better than any males,,,,,,the job is mental more than physical.

so the question is,,,,,,,,do you think all police should work jails first?

i say yes

Sry buddy, If I wanted to be a CO, then I would have applied at the jail or the prisions.I like being on patrol and lets try to leave that decision up to the officers not the department.