Hall Of Justice

[AmericanMan]

Anyone hear the rumor of of nys court officers taking over the hall of justice in rochester.

[EMTFirefighter]

Won't happen. It's a county court - NYS court officers are only employed to protect the state courts. Yes, MC court is tehnically part of the NYS Unified Court System (even every town and village court is), but the "local" courts will still be responsible to maintain their own safety, security and decorum.

[AmericanMan]

Originally Posted by EMTFirefighter

Won't happen. It's a county court - NYS court officers are only employed to protect the state courts. Yes, MC court is tehnically part of the NYS Unified Court System (even every town and village court is), but the "local" courts will still be responsible to maintain their own safety, security and decorum.

You were wrong before and you might be wrong again. I've heard this rumor from a total of 5 sources now.

[EMTFirefighter]

Originally Posted by LT. EXPLORER

You were wrong before and you might be wrong again. I've heard this rumor from a total of 5 sources now.

Whatever you say, pal! What was I "wrong before" about? Do tell!

[AmericanMan]

Originally Posted by EMTFirefighter

Whatever you say, pal! What was I "wrong before" about? Do tell!

Check the post "Rochester, NY". By the way your not suppose to take things personally here.

[EMTFirefighter]

Originally Posted by LT. EXPLORER

Check the post "Rochester, NY". By the way your not suppose to take things personally here.

Well, when a little kid tells me something I know to be completely false yet INSISTS he's right, it's a bit irritating.

I have family in the Court Bureau of MCSO, I think they might know a bit more about the subject than you. Thanks for your opinion, though.

[AmericanMan]

Originally Posted by EMTFirefighter

Well, when a little kid tells me something I know to be completely false yet INSISTS he's right, it's a bit irritating.

I have family in the Court Bureau of MCSO, I think they might know a bit more about the subject than you. Thanks for your opinion, though.

Please ask and let me know. A road deputy said they might be going state, I want to here what a court deputy says. Someone online recently said this "the courts academy annex in cohoes has a class scheduled to start on 7/11/05. they have had people doing surveys of various locations in the 3rd and 4th depts to check staffing needs. they are beginning to take over contracts from sheriffs and local pd's who currently staff upstate areas. it will be a slow process but should continue. which areas are next to go is anyones guess" p.s I'm not your enemy I just like to debate

[EMTFirefighter]

Originally Posted by LT. EXPLORER

Please ask and let me know. A road deputy said they might be going state, I want to here what a court deputy says. Someone online recently said this "the courts academy annex in cohoes has a class scheduled to start on 7/11/05. they have had people doing surveys of various locations in the 3rd and 4th depts to check staffing needs. they are beginning to take over contracts from sheriffs and local pd's who currently staff upstate areas. it will be a slow process but should continue. which areas are next to go is anyones guess" p.s I'm not your enemy I just like to debate

I've already asked, where do you think I got my information from? By NYS law, each county sheriff's office is only required to do 2 things - maintain a correctional facility and provide a civil bureau to the county. They are not obligated to maintain a road patrol or provide court security like you're used to with a full-service agency such as MCSO.

What you're going to see happen is what you've seen happen before with law enforcement. Counties with a small population base have a small tax base, therefore less money. What happens when there's too little law enforcement coverage in a county? NYSP steps in. What happens when counties start feeling the effects of having to pay employees to staff a building that has nothing to do with the county (county courts aren't part of the county, they fall under the auspices of the NYS Unified Court System)? NYS Court Officers will step in. It's pretty simple, really.

Due to contractual obligations and the fact that Monroe County taxpayers generally have no problem stepping up to the plate when it comes to public safety, you won't see MCSO dropping their court bureau for a long time.

[AmericanMan]

Originally Posted by EMTFirefighter

I've already asked, where do you think I got my information from? By NYS law, each county sheriff's office is only required to do 2 things - maintain a correctional facility and provide a civil bureau to the county. They are not obligated to maintain a road patrol or provide court security like you're used to with a full-service agency such as MCSO.

What you're going to see happen is what you've seen happen before with law enforcement. Counties with a small population base have a small tax base, therefore less money. What happens when there's too little law enforcement coverage in a county? NYSP steps in. What happens when counties start feeling the effects of having to pay employees to staff a building that has nothing to do with the county (county courts aren't part of the county, they fall under the auspices of the NYS Unified Court System)? NYS Court Officers will step in. It's pretty simple, really.

Due to contractual obligations and the fact that Monroe County taxpayers generally have no problem stepping up to the plate when it comes to public safety, you won't see MCSO dropping their court bureau for a long time.

But with this it is possible to see this eventually correct?

[EMTFirefighter]

Originally Posted by LT. EXPLORER

But with this it is possible to see this eventually correct?

Possible, yes. Plausible? Hardly.

[Dinosaur32]

It's really not up to the county residents. The Office of Court Administration contracts with local law enforcement to provide security in the courts upstate. Gradually OCA is doing away with those contracts and introducing Court Officers to these courts. Within a few years all courts in New York will be staffed by Court Officers.

[AmericanMan]

Originally Posted by Dinosaur32

It's really not up to the county residents. The Office of Court Administration contracts with local law enforcement to provide security in the courts upstate. Gradually OCA is doing away with those contracts and introducing Court Officers to these courts. Within a few years all courts in New York will be staffed by Court Officers.

That is correct right now the sheriff is holding onto court security because he wants say in it among other things. The deputies are not sure if they would like the change or not becasue there are several pros vs. cons.

[mark7777]

Originally Posted by EMTFirefighter

I've already asked, where do you think I got my information from? By NYS law, each county sheriff's office is only required to do 2 things - maintain a correctional facility and provide a civil bureau to the county. They are not obligated to maintain a road patrol or provide court security like you're used to with a full-service agency such as MCSO.

What you're going to see happen is what you've seen happen before with law enforcement. Counties with a small population base have a small tax base, therefore less money. What happens when there's too little law enforcement coverage in a county? NYSP steps in. What happens when counties start feeling the effects of having to pay employees to staff a building that has nothing to do with the county (county courts aren't part of the county, they fall under the auspices of the NYS Unified Court System)? NYS Court Officers will step in. It's pretty simple, really.

Due to contractual obligations and the fact that Monroe County taxpayers generally have no problem stepping up to the plate when it comes to public safety, you won't see MCSO dropping their court bureau for a long time.

hmmm how long before monroe county has much less population then now and much less tax base lets say little to no kodak property among others.

wait that bus station downtown is going to turn rochester around lol.My brother is a VP there if they could dump rochester faster than they are currently they would.

rochester-- buffalo 2 cities that are in decline more and more.

[EMTFirefighter]

Originally Posted by LT. EXPLORER

That is correct right now the sheriff is holding onto court security because he wants say in it among other things. The deputies are not sure if they would like the change or not becasue there are several pros vs. cons.

He doesn't really have much say in it.

[AmericanMan]

Originally Posted by EMTFirefighter

He doesn't really have much say in it.

Yes I know, but that is what a senior court dep. told me. The deps. are paid by the state anyway.

[Corato]

Originally Posted by LT. EXPLORER

Anyone hear the rumor of of NYS court officers taking over the hall of justice in rochester.

Okay, here is the deal - I work in the Court Bureau in Rochester and believe me the Deputies in the Court Bureau do not want the State to take over for many reasons. First and foremost we would lose our retirement. We currently have a 25 year retirement at 1/2 pay and full medical. The State has 30 years and age 55; not sure on the medical. After 15 years of service, we get 24 vacation days per year and it can roll over to a max of 40 days. The State gets 20 days. Depending on which medical plan a deputy is enrolled in, we pay anywhere from $10.00 per pay period to $20.00 per pay period. It's triple that for the State and the coverage isn't as good. We work for the Sheriff, and while that hasn't always been a "Picnic", it's better than working for the Court Clerks and being someone's maid or butler. The NYS CO pay is better - on paper, but if you add up what we lose as deputies, it's not worth it. It would have to be about a $20,000.00 per year raise for us to say "WELCOME, WE'VE BEEN WAITING FOR YOU". None of this is meant to insult the NYS Court Officers, but they have a completely different situation - the judges in NYC are appointed - in Monroe County they are elected so the NYS COA would have very little power in that regard. Which is another factor; we currently have our own union with a significant amount of money in our treasury. Our Union is strong. We would lose that and while the NYSCOA is a good Union - they are located in NYC not Rochester and they depend on the NYS budget - which as we all know is usually never completed on time.

As an FYI all monies needed to budget for Court Security in Monroe County are reimbursed 100% to the County by the State OCA.

We may not be able to stop the State from taking over, but they need to be aware of the huge moral problem they will incur if we lose that retirement. The best scenerio would be for them to announce a take over that will take place in 2012. That would give everyone who is eligible retire in the next 7 years to do so and give the others a chance to adjust retirement plans. The next best scenerio would be for the State to honor the retirement of those eleigible for the 25 year retirement within the next 7 years. Once again giving the others a chance to plan. Another option would be for the Sheriff to keep everyone and all new hires after 1 January 2006 (or future date) would be hired as State Court officers and through attrition the State would take over and offer any Deputies an opportunity to make the change to NYS Court Officer.

That's it in a nutshell. I'll try to keep tabs on this issue and answer any questions or give any updates. Stay Safe.

[AmericanMan]

Does anyone know how Erie County Made this transition. What options did they give their deputies?

[Dinosaur32]

When OCA moves into a county they offer the current court deputies the opportunity to grandfather in as Court Officers. Other Court Officers are brought in as transfers from other jurisdictions. The status of your judges has little to do with who staffs security in your court house. OCA controls the purse strings and in the long run calls the shots. Taleovers are not done over night, but when offered the chance to keep their gig in the Courts or go back to road patrol and a wheel, a good number of deputies will choose the Courts. Takeover of Rochester Courts has been talked about for almost 20 years.

[AmericanMan]

Just looked on the Onadoga County Deputies' union Site. The OCA plans on taking over their courts on October 2006.

[AmericanMan]

I figured I would bring this one back. Anymore updates?

[ChrisF202]

Who guards the Sufolk County courts? I assume the deputy sheriffs or do they have county court officers?

[TheBoss]

Suffolk county, as well as Nassau County on Long Island have been under State jurisdiction for 25 years now. State Court officers absorbed them from the local jurisdiction, then Nassau Marshals and Suffolk deputy sheriffs with little difficulties. They were able to form their own unions as well. Those that wanted to remain were welcomed and some even became bosses during the transition. Most agreed that they did much better with the state than the local depts.
There are a little more than 3700 sworn UNIFORM NYS Court Officers and that number is growing rapidly and there are now two academies operating in NYS. The ultimate goal is for the Unified Court System to no longer depend on local police agencies for the security of the courts in this State. All courts with the exception of village courts, answer directly to the State regardless of who is providing the security at this time. Even those that are man by sheriffs and local PDs are monitored and reviewed by a ranking NYS court officer to assure compliance with OCA guidelines.
I have been a State Officer for 25 yrs now and love this job. I am presently the commanding officer of one of the busiest facilities in the City of NY and would be happy to help answer any questions that I may be able to. If not I would be happy to direct you to the right source. Feel free to e-mail if the need arises. Your brother LEO!

[AmericanMan]

Any other court security personel from New York?

[john133]

Pal,
This is the matter of justice and we just want it at any cost. So this is better if it is for the justice.
_________________________________________
John Cena
Addiction Recovery New York

[PlainSilverTin]

wow dug far for this one...has this been resolved anyone know the outcome? this original post is almost 3 years old....