more info released on off duty SDPD OIS by Oceanside PD

[e30sd]

OCEANSIDE POLICE DEPARTMENT
NEWS RELEASE


Statement by the Oceanside Police Department Regarding the Off-Duty SDPD
Officer-Involved Shooting on March 15, 2008

The Oceanside Police Department has reached a point in its investigation where it is appropriate to provide further information to the media and the public regarding an officer-involved shooting that occurred on March 15, 2008. The Department is closer to turning over its investigation to the District Attorney's Office, but is still awaiting some forensic test results. The Oceanside Police Department will continue to conduct a complete and fair investigation, while addressing the public’s concerns at the same time.

Based on Oceanside Police Department’s preliminary investigation, on March 15, 2008, at approximately 9:15 p.m., off-duty San Diego Police Department Officer Franklin White and his wife were driving southbound on Old Grove Road in their private vehicle. At the same time, Rachel Silva drove her own car from the parking lot of a Shell station onto Old Grove Road. In the front passenger seat was her 8-year-old son. Based on a statement from an independent witness, Ms. Silva’s car almost collided with the White’s and Officer White had to swerve to avoid a collision.

Officer White drove along Old Grove Road and turned into the parking lot of a Lowe’s store. According to a second independent witness, Ms. Silva was tailgating White’s car, revving the engine, and yelling and screaming as she followed Officer White and his wife in the parking lot. Officer White’s wife dialed 911 on her cell phone to report an aggressive driver. Officer White stopped his car. Ms. Silva pulled alongside the driver’s side of the White’s vehicle, and stopped.

Officer White displayed a handgun, and then backed his car away from Ms. Silva’s car, coming to a complete stop. Ms. Silva dialed 911 and reported a man with a gun. Ms. Silva then reversed her vehicle in the direction of the Whites’ car, sideswiping it. Officer White fired five shots toward Ms. Silva’s vehicle.

The first shot shattered the front driver’s side window of the White’s vehicle, and entered the closed, darkly-tinted right front passenger window of Ms. Silva’s vehicle. The other four shots entered the windshield of Ms. Silva’s car. All five shots were fired within a few seconds. One round struck Ms. Silva’s son in his knee, two others struck her in her arm.



Oceanside Police officers arrived very shortly thereafter and began their investigation.

The department has requested that the court release its seal on the search warrants obtained during this investigation. The court has taken this request under submission.
# # #

[Stugotz]

Odds are, both the involved officer and Oceanside will be accused of wrongdoing. The SD officer will be branded as trigger happy and reckless, and Oceanside will be accused of favoritism. The irresponsible mother's truly reckless and criminal behavior will be downplayed or buried to play up the anti-police bias that sells news.

[Copp'rPenny]

Odds are, both the involved officer and Oceanside will be accused of wrongdoing. The SD officer will be branded as trigger happy and reckless, and Oceanside will be accused of favoritism. The irresponsible mother's truly reckless and criminal behavior will downplayed or buried to play up the anti-police bias that sells news.


As a former journalist, I have to .... agree. :(

[want to be offi]

Hold on guys; lets not jump into conclusions here (I know you going to hate me for saying this) but we don't have Ms. Silva’s statement yet....

[LA DEP]

Hold on guys; lets not jump into conclusions here (I know you going to hate me for saying this) but we don't have Ms. Silva’s statement yet....

Dont need it.....this wasnt the involved Officer's statement.....it was the investigating agency's statement.....

and I am pretty sure she lawyered up and REFUSED to give a statement

[e30sd]

silva lawyered up, is not talking "for fear of her life." she originally asked for steve foley's lawyer, but he passed.

waiting on the tox report to come back on her. not trying to jump the gun (no pun intended) but with her track record, i wouldn't be surprised if somethign showed up.

[ExSDSO]

Soo I met a reporter from Fox 6 news the mexican guy not rueben (whos got sugar in the gas tank) And from I was told that OSide PD may have done some things wrong when this incident happend. He told me that there was no blood/drug test done on the women after the incident. Also the young boy didnt have a legal guardian with him at the time he was question.

THIS IS JUST WHAT I HEARD.

Maybe some of yous have heard something similar, different or something totally opposite.

[IE Copper]

I'm sorry but I have to question why an off duty officer felt it necessary to pull his gun out at a woman yelling at him. Yes, I don't know all the facts, but it sounds like the typical "look at me, I'm a cop" type of officer. I have never pulled my gun on anyone, and where I live is a'lot more dangerous than Oceanside. If someone is riding your butt and yelling, you just keep driving, you don't stop and confront them. We are supposed to be able to make better decisions than that....

[JRODF4]

Odds are, both the involved officer and Oceanside will be accused of wrongdoing. The SD officer will be branded as trigger happy and reckless, and Oceanside will be accused of favoritism. The irresponsible mother's truly reckless and criminal behavior will be downplayed or buried to play up the anti-police bias that sells news.


You are 100% correct. The city will then write a big check and make this case stay out of court (cheaper that way). Then she will be a rich wacko.:eek:

[JRODF4]

I'm sorry but I have to question why an off duty officer felt it necessary to pull his gun out at a woman yelling at him. Yes, I don't know all the facts, but it sounds like the typical "look at me, I'm a cop" type of officer. I have never pulled my gun on anyone, and where I live is a'lot more dangerous than Oceanside. If someone is riding your butt and yelling, you just keep driving, you don't stop and confront them. We are supposed to be able to make better decisions than that....


If you already identified yourself as a LEO and showed this wacky girl a gun then she still side swipes your vehicle I would consider dangerous with no respect for LE,society,herself and more importantly her child. You must stop the threat.

What are you suppose to do keep driving until your gas runs out and end up in the same situation or call the cops which he did (lets not forget he is a cop), may be speed away and try to scape (oh no thats what the bad guys do) and of course not drive home.

In reality a normal sane person w/ their child in the car would not get themselves in that situation. Do we all get mad while driving even w/ our child in the car YES but you have to draw the line. I think most sane people do in general LEO or not.

[CHUCKnmnV]

The Report States The Officer Pulled Out A Handgun. No Mention Of The Officer Identifying Himself As A Cop.

[ejay]

The Report States The Officer Pulled Out A Handgun. No Mention Of The Officer Identifying Himself As A Cop.

No, the statement released from Oceanside Police says that. We don't have the report or any investigative supplemental that would include the SDPD Officer's statement.

[willowdared]

Hold on guys; lets not jump into conclusions here (I know you going to hate me for saying this) but we don't have Ms. Silva’s statement yet....

Oh yes we have, she did lots of talking to the media through her lawyer last week.

First she didn't remember anything, then the remembered some arguing, then she remember she followed him into the parking lot.

This chick has been found twice passed out behind the wheel. Once was after an accident, and her infant was in the car at the time.

Can't wait for the tox report.

[JRODF4]

The Report States The Officer Pulled Out A Handgun. No Mention Of The Officer Identifying Himself As A Cop.

Hey brother so say he did not id himself as a LEO but showed you a handgun and your kid is sitting next to you scared what would you do as a sane civilian. I know I would not charge the guy w/ the gun with my car :eek:.

[JRODF4]

By the way there is 2 witnesses that favors LEO alledged statement (according to OCEANSIDE PD).

TODAYS SD TRIBUNE 4/11/08

Police tell what may have led to confrontation in lot
By Matthew Rodriguez
UNION-TRIBUNE STAFF WRITER

April 11, 2008

OCEANSIDE – Before off-duty San Diego police Officer Frank White fired into Rachel Silva's Honda, White displayed a gun and Silva sideswiped White's car, Oceanside police said yesterday in their first detailed account of the March 15 shooting.

White fired five shots within a few seconds, police said, hitting Silva twice in the right arm and her 8-year-old son once in the left leg.
White's first shot shattered the driver's side window of his car and went through the front passenger side window of Silva's car, police said. The other four shots went through Silva's windshield.

In a statement released at 4:30 p.m. yesterday, police also outlined for the first time what investigators believe led to the confrontation in the parking lot of the Lowe's store on Old Grove Road near state Route 76 in Oceanside.

This is what the statement, based on a “preliminary investigation,” says happened:

White, 28, was driving with his wife south on Old Grove Road about 9:15 p.m. Silva, whose son was in the front passenger seat, was leaving a Shell gas station onto Old Grove at the same time.

An independent witness said that Silva's car nearly ran into White's, and he swerved to avoid an accident. White continued along Old Grove Road and pulled into the Lowe's parking lot.

Another witness said Silva was “tailgating White's car, revving the engine, and yelling and screaming as she followed” White's black Mercury sedan into the parking lot.

White's wife called 911 “to report an aggressive driver.” White stopped his car, and Silva pulled her Honda to the left side of his car.

White displayed a handgun, and then backed away from Silva's car and stopped.

Silva called 911 and reported that there was a man with a gun. She then “reversed her vehicle in the direction of the Whites' car, sideswiping it.” White then fired five rounds into Silva's Honda.

The statement described the front passenger window of Silva's car as “closed” and “darkly tinted.”

Attorneys representing Silva, 27, who was unarmed, and her son said questions remain.

“Clearly there's a great deal more that we need to have before we can make an in-depth response,” said Michael Pancer, Silva's attorney. But he said the information released by police “fits with some of the facts as we understand them to be.”

“The facts show that after the confrontation on the road, our client ended up in the same parking lot as the officer,” Pancer said. “He threatened her with a weapon, she called 911, and while trying to get away from him, she and her son were shot.”

Pancer and Gene Iredale, the boy's attorney, said they are waiting for police to release more evidence, including 911 tapes, and to provide access to Silva's car. A hearing is scheduled Monday before Judge Harry Elias in Vista Superior Court about unsealing search-warrant affidavits and other material related to the case.

In yesterday's statement, Oceanside police also said they have asked the court to “release its seal” on search warrants, and that “the court has taken this request under submission.” The District Attorney's Office said it will not oppose unsealing them.

Oceanside police said they are close to turning over the investigation to the District Attorney's Office but are still waiting for the results of some forensic tests.

Four news organizations, including The San Diego Union-Tribune, filed a motion Monday in Vista Superior Court to have the search-warrant documents unsealed. The others are KFMB/Channel 8, KGTV/Channel 10 and KNSD/Channel 7/39.

Attorneys have filed claims on behalf of Silva and her son, the first step in possible lawsuits, against the city of San Diego.

[McGruff]

Here's a video interview of Silva and her attorney.

http://video.nbcsandiego.com/player/?id=233260

[GrndPnd0311]

Here's a video interview of Silva and her attorney.

http://video.nbcsandiego.com/player/?id=233260

That is 5 min of my life I will never get back.

Reporter: "Did he state he was a police officer?"

Silva: "Yes.."

Defense attorney: " He was in a crazy rage."

Reporter: " Thats a pretty bold statement. Have you talked to him?"

Defense attorney: "No I dont have to."

I dont even need to guess where he finished in his class in law school.

This is why you dont try to run over people. They might have a gun and/or be a LEO.

[McGruff]

That is 5 min of my life I will never get back.


5 mins? I went through the whole damn 11.28 mins! :p

I owe you a cold one. :D

[willowdared]

You'll notice, that her original lawyer is now only representing her son, she has a new lawyer.

And they did do blood tests at the hospital on the woman. One of her lawyer's beefs was there was no test done on the officer.

It's funny there hasn't been a statement from the friends who were watching her child that night. That was her reason for being in O'side - to pick up her child.

[JSL0506]

She was out of line and needs to suffer consequences for her actions. She obviously endangered her child. However, did the off-duty cop call in this incident to the on-duty guys? Did he really need to engage in road rage? Why couldn't he have kept driving to the police station to lead her to being arrested. Obviously the cop and this lady are poor decision makers.

[hbliam]

Based on the first post it might have been better just to display his badge. That usually makes people want to leave real quick. I can't see myself shooting at another car over road rage. I am fairly certain I could just drive away and out drive the fool.

[avalon42]

Based on the first post it might have been better just to display his badge. That usually makes people want to leave real quick. I can't see myself shooting at another car over road rage. I am fairly certain I could just drive away and out drive the fool.

Yea, that's what I thought too, why not display his badge and call it in? I was watching her googly eyes during the video, she doesn't seem like she's all there. Either way, this is really bad. :(

[willowdared]

She was out of line and needs to suffer consequences for her actions. She obviously endangered her child. However, did the off-duty cop call in this incident to the on-duty guys? Did he really need to engage in road rage? Why couldn't he have kept driving to the police station to lead her to being arrested. Obviously the cop and this lady are poor decision makers.

The officer's wife was in the car with him, and she was on the phone with 911 calling in an aggressive driver before they ended up in the parking lot. She is also a dispatcher with another local agency.

O'side is a known gang city, and there have been several car-to-car shootings in SoCal. There have been 2 officers in O'side that were gunned down in the past couple of years.

[CHUCKnmnV]

JRODF4

I drive like an old man when my kids are in the car. I'd gun it (no pun) and hope my 4 banger doesn't fail me.

[CHUCKnmnV]

I wonder if the Shell station has video of the incident or Silva?? I hope the best for the officer, as well as that Costa Mesa cop.

[Fuzz]

She was out of line and needs to suffer consequences for her actions. She obviously endangered her child. However, did the off-duty cop call in this incident to the on-duty guys? Did he really need to engage in road rage? Why couldn't he have kept driving to the police station to lead her to being arrested. Obviously the cop and this lady are poor decision makers.

Heres the section from the OPD statement regarding what happened.

White, 28, was driving with his wife south on Old Grove Road about 9:15 p.m. Silva, whose son was in the front passenger seat, was leaving a Shell gas station onto Old Grove at the same time.

An independent witness said that Silva's car nearly ran into White's, and he swerved to avoid an accident. White continued along Old Grove Road and pulled into the Lowe's parking lot.

Silva almost hits his car, he avoids it and then continues on his way without any road rage or engaging her.

Another witness said Silva was “tailgating White's car, revving the engine, and yelling and screaming as she followed” White's black Mercury sedan into the parking lot.

Silva, after almost causing an accident is now following him road raging and follows him into the parking lot which sounds like he again was continuing on his way.

White's wife called 911 “to report an aggressive driver.” White stopped his car, and Silva pulled her Honda to the left side of his car.

His wife calls 911 and Silva continues the road rage by driving up to him.


White displayed a handgun, and then backed away from Silva's car and stopped.

After her behavior I would have pulled a gun also....but I would have had my badge out. So far I think this may have been his first error.


Silva called 911 and reported that there was a man with a gun.

Now that this psycho has bitten off more than she can handle she plays the victim and calls 911. Why didnt she do that before if he was the aggressor??

She then “reversed her vehicle in the direction of the Whites' car, sideswiping it.”

If you are trying to get away from someone with a gun why would you drive in reverse and AT the person with a gun striking their car???

White then fired five rounds into Silva's Honda.

I don't know if I would have done the same, but I wasnt there. Based on this psychos actions and the fact that she just rammed his car.....I could see it happening.


To answer your questions......... yes his wife called 911, nothing in the released report shows he was the one road raging, she followed him into a parking lot how far does he have to drive to get away from a nutjob cause I'm sure she would have done the same thing at the first red light he hit, and as far as poor decision makers..... the only decisions he really made were to not display his badge (poor decision I will grant you) and then fire shots after being hit..... I'm not going to condemn some officer for that based on the psychos actions.

[avalon42]

More info released.

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-oceanside28mar28,1,6451390.story

Silva was driving on a suspended license and had two drunk-driving convictions, according to court records. Aguigui said police had probable cause to order Silva's blood drawn, but none to make a similar decision involving White.

The claim alleges that White, 28, who has been an officer for two years, is "manifestly unsuited" for his job and that Oceanside police are showing favoritism toward a fellow officer.

My feelings is that her stellar background isn't going to stop the claim, and the city will offer a substantial out-of-court settlement and Officer White is going to lose his job.

[LA DEP]

More info released.

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-oceanside28mar28,1,6451390.story

Silva was driving on a suspended license and had two drunk-driving convictions, according to court records. Aguigui said police had probable cause to order Silva's blood drawn, but none to make a similar decision involving White.

The claim alleges that White, 28, who has been an officer for two years, is "manifestly unsuited" for his job and that Oceanside police are showing favoritism toward a fellow officer.

My feelings is that her stellar background isn't going to stop the claim, and the city will offer a substantial out-of-court settlement and Officer White is going to lose his job.


Avalon....you are probably right on the settlement......however, I doubt that the Officer will lose his job....this is a civil service state.....even if they go all the way and try and fire him, civil service would most likely overturn that....and then the city/agency gets to deal with another lawsuit....this time from the Officer

[avalon42]

however, I doubt that the Officer will lose his job....this is a civil service state.....even if they go all the way and try and fire him, civil service would most likely overturn that....and then the city/agency gets to deal with another lawsuit....this time from the Officer

Really? That's great, because IMHO, it looks like he did almost everything he could do to avoid the situation.

This story would have been a lot more different if she road raged one of those Oceanside gang members...

[Fuzz]

Avalon....you are probably right on the settlement......however, I doubt that the Officer will lose his job....this is a civil service state.....even if they go all the way and try and fire him, civil service would most likely overturn that....and then the city/agency gets to deal with another lawsuit....this time from the Officer

Especially if he is cleared by the DA.......

[LA DEP]

Especially if he is cleared by the DA.......

Yup....I can think of more than a few agencies that have been paddled after doing something like this.....Inglewood comes to mind

[L8SHIFT]

More info released.

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-oceanside28mar28,1,6451390.story

[I]Silva was driving on a suspended license and had two drunk-driving convictions, according to court records. Aguigui said police had probable cause to order Silva's blood drawn, but none to make a similar decision involving White.

People are never responsible for their actions, right? It's still are fault when she shouldn't have been driving the car anyway. She gets her “shouldn't have been driving on a suspended license” panties in a twist when almost striking another vehicle, engages that vehicle in a threatening manner by closely following it while yelling, screaming and honking her horn. She then follows the vehicle into a parking lot at which point she is warned by the sight of a gun what may happen if she continues her assault. She strikes the vehicle and ultimately causes her own child to be injured when the vehicle’s driver defends himself from her vehicular assault.

He didn't need to show his ID. Any sober person would have left the location to avoid being shot after seeing the gun. Then after getting shot at she still remains in the parking lot. Bullet holes or not, get the hell away from harm. Sound like the crazy Woman wanted to get hurt. Why did she endanger her son by intentionally striking the other car? There is no law that requires us to ID ourselves in a life-threatening incident.

If this was not an officer she hit she and her son would have possibly been finished off. Media has no clue what happens on the street. I hope to see the TRUTH on the gas station cameras or possibly the cameras along the way, which may show her near miss.....


I will not allow anyone to harm my wife or family.

[willowdared]

Documents: Silva was legally drunk, tested positive for marijuana

By Matthew Rodriguez
UNION-TRIBUNE STAFF WRITER
1:42 p.m. April 14, 2008
VISTA – Rachel Silva had a .15 blood-alcohol level and tested positive for marijuana when she and her 8-year-old son were shot by off-duty San Diego police Officer Frank White, according to search warrant documents unsealed Monday.

The documents also say that White was “in fear of his and his wife's safety” and didn't see Silva's son in the passenger seat when he fired five shots at Silva's car.
.
The documents, eight search warrants and the affidavits filed to obtain them, were unsealed Monday by Judge Harry Elias.

They show Oceanside police asked for and received authorization to search Silva's and White's cars and to obtain Silva's and her son's medical records, surveillance videos, cell phone records and the air bag computer in White's car.

Three judges had previously sealed the documents at the request of Oceanside police.

During the March 15 incident, Silva was shot twice in the right arm, and her son was shot once in the left leg. No charges have been filed in the case, which police say culminated an apparent road rage incident.

Police have said White was driving south on Old Grove Road with his wife about 9:15 p.m. in a Mercury sedan. Silva was exiting a nearby Shell gas station onto Old Grove at the same time, with her son in the car.

In the affidavits, and in the statement released by police last week, police say a witness reported that Silva nearly crashed her car into White's, and that White swerved to avoid a crash. White then pulled into the parking lot of a Lowe's home improvement store, police said.

Police said a witness reported that Silva was “tailgating White's car, revving the engine, and yelling and screaming as she followed” White's car into the parking lot.

White stopped his car, and Silva pulled her Honda to the left side of his car. Police wrote in the affidavits that Silva was still revving her engine and was “so close Franklin could not open his door.” White, the documents say, could not hear what Silva was shouting.

“Franklin White pulled out his gun in an attempt to force the aggressive driver away,” police write in the affidavits.

Police have said White then backed away from Silva's car and stopped. Silva sideswiped White's car as she backed up, and White opened fire as the two cars passed each other. One round shattered White's window and the passenger window of her car.

A .15-blood alcohol level is nearly twice the legal limit for driving. In an interview, Silva denied she had been drinking or was high before the incident. She was driving on a suspended license as a result of two previous DUI convictions. She has not given a statement to police.

Oceanside police are expected to meet with the District Attorney's Office Wednesday for a briefing on the case, even though they are still waiting for some test results, said Robert Kearney, a prosecutor in the District Attorney's Office.

Police have said both Silva and White's wife called 911 before the shooting. The city of Oceanside has declined to release the tapes.

Attorneys have filed claims against the city of San Diego on behalf of Silva and her son, the first step in possible lawsuits against the city.

The attorneys had requested to photograph Silva's Honda, and Elias ruled Monday that they should be allowed to do so within 72 hours.

Four news organizations, including The San Diego Union-Tribune, filed a motion last week to have the search-warrant documents unsealed. The others were KFMB/Channel 8, KGTV/Channel 10 and KNSD/Channel 7/39.

In Monday's hearing, Oceanside police and the DA's office did not oppose unsealing the records.

[avalon42]

Wow, all that PLUS child endangerment. Can OPD put her under arrest now?

I hope the city doesn't give her squat and sees the logistics that we should not reward scum. The only victims I see here is Officer White, his wife, and Silva's child (for having a artard for a parent).

[knecht]

I will not allow anyone to harm my wife or family.

Exactly my thoughts as well. When she tailgated and attempted to ram Officer White on the road, he pulled into a parking lot to avoid being run off the road. When she followed him in, he attempted to warn her. When she then 245'd him with her car, she entered the realm where deadly force is absolutely necessary. Its a shame that someone would put their child in a situation such as this.

[Fuzz]

Lets take a look at poor Ms Silva now that more facts have been released....


2 Prior DUI arrests
1 Prior child endangerment arrest


Now in this case.......

She is driving on a suspended license (for her previous DUI), she is DUI again (.15 almost double the legal limit even though she denies ever drinking), child endangerment again by DUI with her kid in the car, marijuana in her blood stream (they found a MJ pipe in her shirt pocket...but oh yeah...there was no reason to have her blood taken so lets keep saying that they should have blood tested the officer too:rolleyes:), she follows him, she rams his vehicle...hmmmmmm and she still says she has memory lapses but didnt do anything.....


I wonder how many of the arm chair quarterbacks out there calling for White's head have become a little quieter now that the info is coming out....... which is what everyone should have waited for to begin with

[IE Copper]

I guess I'm a quarterback...oh well, anyone who wasn't there, including the officers investigating the incident, and the DA's office, are the same. If you had to put a justified or not-justified stamp on the case, I guess the justified stamp would be appropriate. I would rather there be a "not good decision maker" stamp on it though.

I find it hard to believe that pulling the trigger on a vehicle that side swipes you as it pulls away is the best decision. I haven't heard anything about the woman ramming his vehicle, just side swiping it and him firing at it after it did so.

Obviously she is a real winner, with the DUIs, 14601, and DUI. These are things that can not be used to justify what the off duty rookie did though. The fact that she was 14601, and DUI, had nothing to do with the decision that he was faced with . When the drunk observed his gun she obviously got scared and tried to get away, which should have ended the confrontation.

I am as pro-cop as they come, not just because I am one myself. That does not, however, mean that I have to side with decisions and actions of every single cop out there. We are human and we make bad decisions also. It is my opinion that he made a bad decision.

[L.A Sheriff]

I guess I'm a quarterback...oh well, anyone who wasn't there, including the officers investigating the incident, and the DA's office, are the same. If you had to put a justified or not-justified stamp on the case, I guess the justified stamp would be appropriate. I would rather there be a "not good decision maker" stamp on it though.

I find it hard to believe that pulling the trigger on a vehicle that side swipes you as it pulls away is the best decision. I haven't heard anything about the woman ramming his vehicle, just side swiping it and him firing at it after it did so.

Obviously she is a real winner, with the DUIs, 14601, and DUI. These are things that can not be used to justify what the off duty rookie did though. The fact that she was 14601, and DUI, had nothing to do with the decision that he was faced with . When the drunk observed his gun she obviously got scared and tried to get away, which should have ended the confrontation.

I am as pro-cop as they come, not just because I am one myself. That does not, however, mean that I have to side with decisions and actions of every single cop out there. We are human and we make bad decisions also. It is my opinion that he made a bad decision.

I agree, this was a bad decision on the off-duty officer's part. Side swiping while the officer is still inside his vehicle parked doesnt justify the use of deadly force to me. Now, if she was charging him full force, head on (front end or rear end) attempting to ram him, then thats a life threating situation. I just cant see a side swipe having the potential of killing someone or causing great injury, unless they are trying to run a vehicle off the road. I dont think that was the case in this situation.

I wish the officer the best of luck. When it comes down to it, it all depends what was the mind set of that officer and what made him believe that he needed to use deadly force. Everyone thinks differently (what may be threating to you may not be threating to your partner).

[ComicGuy]

I hope the city doesn't give her squat and sees the logistics that we should not reward scum.
Officer White and his wife both need to file suit against this lady. They both have a viable civil claim against her for running into their car and placing both their lives in danger. His wife, as a civilian, could also make the civil claim of extreme emotional distress. That way, even if the city does wuss out, she won't be able to keep a penny of her ill-gotten gains.

[hulakai]

Well...... well......... to all the nay sayers the intox is in and she is almost double the legal limit and has marijuana on board. Officer white is a close friend of mine we went to the police acad. together. Please don't pre judge any of our brother's and sister's in law enforcement until your in their shoes. Any way I am not hear to preach I wanted to wait until the intox report came back to post. Thanks for all the support for Officer White stay safe and God Bless

[avalon42]

Well...... well......... to all the nay sayers the intox is in and she is almost double the legal limit and has marijuana on board. Officer white is a close friend of mine we went to the police acad. together. Please don't pre judge any of our brother's and sister's in law enforcement until your in their shoes. Any way I am not hear to preach I wanted to wait until the intox report came back to post. Thanks for all the support for Officer White stay safe and God Bless

I was curious as to why he displayed his gun instead of his badge first. I was told by instructors that if you introduce a weapon into a weapon-less scenario, youare escalating the situation. :confused:

I am not knocking Officer White's actions, it looked like he did everything he could have to get away from this 5150. I would have been scared in that situation too.

[hulakai]

Don't believe everything you hear or read....... ie; THE MEDIA

[Meat]

I was curious as to why he displayed his gun instead of his badge first.


Most guys at my old PD didn't carry their badge off-duty, and I certainly never did. I carried my gun to defend myself off-duty, not take enforcement action. You don't need to have your badge with you to defend yourself. The only thing we carried was our commission card, in case we were contacted by other LEO's, so they would know we were authorized to carry. Hell, I never even carried a wallet, so I'd have nowhere to keep a badge! Now, with the Feds, our commission card is two 4X5 pieces, so you might as well carry your wallet badge along with it. But I see no reason to carry a badge off-duty unless you're planning on looking for folks to "bust" on your own dime. lol

[LA DEP]

Most guys at my old PD didn't carry their badge off-duty, and I certainly never did. I carried my gun to defend myself off-duty, not take enforcement action. You don't need to have your badge with you to defend yourself. The only thing we carried was our commission card, in case we were contacted by other LEO's, so they would know we were authorized to carry. Hell, I never even carried a wallet, so I'd have nowhere to keep a badge! Now, with the Feds, our commission card is two 4X5 pieces, so you might as well carry your wallet badge along with it. But I see no reason to carry a badge off-duty unless you're planning on looking for folks to "bust" on your own dime. lol

Most agencies here in SoCal REQUIRE you to carry both your badge and ID at all times while carrying a weapon

[willowdared]

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/northcounty/images/080414osideshootingwarrants.pdf

Search warrants

[Meat]

Most agencies here in SoCal REQUIRE you to carry both your badge and ID at all times while carrying a weapon

Agencies up here do that too, which is why most cops I know also have a concealed weapons permit. That way the PD has no say in what you carry, and certainly can't infringe on your 2nd Amendment rights :cool:

[LA DEP]

Agencies up here do that too, which is why most cops I know also have a concealed weapons permit. That way the PD has no say in what you carry, and certainly can't infringe on your 2nd Amendment rights :cool:

glad you can do that....we cant....

We are only allowed to carry certain weapons/ammo per policy......and it wouldnt matter if you had a CCW....a violation is around 10-20 days on the bricks....

CCW permits, more or less, do not exist in SoCal......I have only ever seen ONE in almost 20 years on the job, except for the ones that the reserve deps had......

[Meat]

glad you can do that....we cant....

We are only allowed to carry certain weapons/ammo per policy......and it wouldnt matter if you had a CCW....a violation is around 10-20 days on the bricks....

CCW permits, more or less, do not exist in SoCal......I have only ever seen ONE in almost 20 years on the job, except for the ones that the reserve deps had......

That sucks that you guys can't get CCW's down there. In fact, that's downright CRAZY!

However, my former agency tried to tell us the same thing, that it wouldn't matter if we had a CCW or not, that the agency could still dictate what we carried off-duty. That was until our Union president cited a U.S. Supreme Court decision to the contrary. Then our admin magically changed their position on the subject. lol

[LA DEP]

That sucks that you guys can't get CCW's down there. In fact, that's downright CRAZY!

However, my former agency tried to tell us the same thing, that it wouldn't matter if we had a CCW or not, that the agency could still dictate what we carried off-duty. That was until our Union president cited a U.S. Supreme Court decision to the contrary. Then our admin magically changed their position on the subject. lol

Remember....its CA....home of Baghdad on the Bay.....:cool:

Our creds ARE our CCW as far as it goes in CA.....there are a few counties (mostly in Central CA) where you can get a CCW....it is up to the Sheriff of the county to issue them.....and since ours is more than a bit anti-gun, it isnt happening anytime soon here

[e30sd]

Don't believe everything you hear or read....... ie; THE MEDIA

you make it sound like they are making this stuff up? all the info came straight from the investigating agency, and more is to come from the DA when after they receive the case tomorrow. no one in the "media" is siding with silva, just asking [valid] questions about the incident.

[willowdared]

you make it sound like they are making this stuff up? all the info came straight from the investigating agency, and more is to come from the DA when after they receive the case tomorrow. no one in the "media" is siding with silva, just asking [valid] questions about the incident.

There is certain language that may not "support" a side, but definitely sets a tone.

And, has a single reporter asked her why her 8 year old son was in the front seat - because kids under 12 are supposed to be in the back? Anyone find out if her car had front passenger air bags? Anyone bother to find out if he should have still been in a booster seat? Anyone interview the babysitter to find out if she was drunk when she picked him up?

When you continue to hear "an unarmed mother and her son" it creates a different picture then "an unknown aggressor in a vehicle with tinted windows, who cut off a driver, tailgated, followed, then sideswiped the vehicle" doesn't it?

An "unarmed mother with her son" in the vehicle ran a man down on the 78 last year and left him to die. Her son was covered with glass from the shattered windshield. She threw parts out her window has she headed home. Maybe the media should be careful with their analogies?

[e30sd]

There is certain language that may not "support" a side, but definitely sets a tone.

And, has a single reporter asked her why her 8 year old son was in the front seat - because kids under 12 are supposed to be in the back? Anyone find out if her car had front passenger air bags? Anyone bother to find out if he should have still been in a booster seat? Anyone interview the babysitter to find out if she was drunk when she picked him up?

When you continue to hear "an unarmed mother and her son" it creates a different picture then "an unknown aggressor in a vehicle with tinted windows, who cut off a driver, tailgated, followed, then sideswiped the vehicle" doesn't it?

An "unarmed mother with her son" in the vehicle ran a man down on the 78 last year and left him to die. Her son was covered with glass from the shattered windshield. She threw parts out her window has she headed home. Maybe the media should be careful with their analogies?

willow you raise valid points, but we can't lump everyone together. some media outlets choose to sensationalize the story. that's there editiorial decision, albeit an irresponsible one. i for one hope the facts will speak for themselves, and so far, miss silva is NOT striking much sympathy among the fourth estate.

[IE Copper]

Alot of people have CCWs in the IE.

[JRODF4]

This is the latest news - She was DRUNK AND ON DRUGS (keep in mind she has two prior DUI's).

Police say woman DUI when shot

The woman shot by an off-duty San Diego police officer during a traffic confrontation was driving drunk and had been using marijuana, according to police documents released Monday.

Rachel Silva's blood-alcohol level was 0.15%, well above the legal limit of 0.08%, according to documents released at the order of a Superior Court judge at the request of the media.

Silva, 27, and her 8-year-old son were shot by Frank White, 28, during a confrontation between the two adults while they were driving in Oceanside.

In other court documents, police say Silva was tailgating White, followed him into a parking lot, pulled alongside his car, then sideswiped it as she backed up. White fired five times from his vehicle.

White told Oceanside officers that he feared for his life and the life of his wife, who was a passenger. Silva, who was driving without a license and has two drunk driving convictions, has declined to be interviewed by investigators but has filed a negligence claim at San Diego City Hall.

Oceanside police are set this week to turn the case over to the district attorney's office, which will decide whether charges will be filed.

White, an officer for two years, has been on paid administrative leave since the March 15 incident.

--

[IE Copper]

Looks like every other article..

[hulakai]

I have been working the last 5 days and I have seen the case is finally going to the DA. I was trained by SDPD and have a ton of respect for the instructors at Miramar. I truly know Officer White and his wife feared for their safety and reacted with due regard. People who think other wise don't have a clue on what it feels like to make a split decision to use deadly force or not. We have a split second to decide and the rest of the world has a life time to criticize. To all my brothers and sisters who support Offcr. White thanks and God Bless..........Stay Safe........Sorry if I rambled................

[JSL0506]

How long did this incident go on for? And why no involvement with anyone on patrol?

[JRODF4]

JRODF4

I drive like an old man when my kids are in the car. I'd gun it (no pun) and hope my 4 banger doesn't fail me.


hehehehehe:D:eek:

[avalon42]

We have a split second to decide and the rest of the world has a life time to criticize.

That statement is so damn true...better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6?

[L8SHIFT]

That statement is so damn true...better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6?

I agree....

[willowdared]

How long did this incident go on for? And why no involvement with anyone on patrol?

They drove maybe a half block from the gas station to the Lowes....we are talking a few minutes for the whole thing to play out.

As I carefully explain to people calling for service. Officers have to get the call and drive from wherever they are, they may all be on other calls.

That, and the transporter beam is broken.

[sparkydavid]

According to Rodger Hedgecock, the cop should of waited for uniform cops to arrive and stand by lol.

[e30sd]

it was originally put out over the air as a possible "gang related" shooting. no one knew it was off duty till after the first units arrived on scene.

[JSL0506]

This situation is unfortunate for everyone involved. Yes, the lady is deranged and should face charges. Isn't there a code to communicate for an ois?, officer down or not, where everyone drops what they are doing and rushes to assist. It just seems with training that an officer is taught to communicate early and precisely with dispatch when you are on or off-duty. I am not judging the officer, it's not my place, just curious as to the protocol in a situation like this

[willowdared]

This situation is unfortunate for everyone involved. Yes, the lady is deranged and should face charges. Isn't there a code to communicate for an ois?, officer down or not, where everyone drops what they are doing and rushes to assist. It just seems with training that an officer is taught to communicate early and precisely with dispatch when you are on or off-duty. I am not judging the officer, it's not my place, just curious as to the protocol in a situation like this

That's if he has his radio with him....he didn't....his wife called 911.

[Fuzz]

This situation is unfortunate for everyone involved. Yes, the lady is deranged and should face charges. Isn't there a code to communicate for an ois?, officer down or not, where everyone drops what they are doing and rushes to assist.

There is, but it comes after shots are fired. The time to go from a traffic dispute to shots fired can be mere moments depending on what is going on. The off duty was not on the phone with dispatch...his wife was. She has been referred to as a dispatcher in the paper so I would assume she would know how to communicate, but sometimes when its happening things dont come across as clearly.


It just seems with training that an officer is taught to communicate early and precisely with dispatch when you are on or off-duty.

He was dealing with her...not on the phone and no radio.

I am not judging the officer, it's not my place, just curious as to the protocol in a situation like this

No problem.....many dont know that sometimes even we dont have a direct line of communication to our partners on duty. In a perfect world we would all have take home radios to make communication better. Unfortunately, we dont and that means we must use a cell phone like everybody else. It takes time depending on how busy dispatch is. There also could have been multiple callers, so if it came out as possible gang related then it could have been another caller.

[avalon42]

DA Speaks On Off-Duty Officer Shooting Investigation

SAN DIEGO -- District Attorney Bonnie Dumanis warned Thursday against a rush to judgment regarding an officer-involved shooting last month that left a mother and her 8-year-old son wounded.

Rachel Silva and her son were shot by off-duty San Diego patrolman Franklin White on March 15 in the parking lot of a Lowe's home improvement store in Oceanside, in a possible road rage incident.

White, 28, who has been a San Diego police officer since October 2005, is on paid administrative leave. He has not spoken publicly about the events of that day.

Dumanis said she shared the public's desire to know more about what happened. "But until all those facts are in, we will not rush to judgment about the guilt or innocence of either party involved, and neither should the public," she said.

"Once the case is turned over to our office, an independent decision on whether or not to file criminal charges will be based on the evidence and the law, not public opinion," the county's top prosecutor said. "I acknowledge that it can be frustrating to wait for the investigative process to run its course."

Dumanis refused to address questions regarding the handling of the incident or subsequent, ongoing investigation by the Oceanside Police Department, saying her office has a legal and ethical duty not to release any information that could jeopardize a potential prosecution.

No arrests have been made in the case.

White, who was in a black Mercury sedan, fired five shots at Silva, who was in a Honda with her son, according to Oceanside police. Four of five shots pierced the Honda's windshield, and one shattered the front passenger window, police said.

Silva, 27, was wounded in two places in her right arm, and her son was wounded in his left leg.

The driver's side window on White's black Mercury sedan was shattered.

While claiming memory lapses, Rachel Silva has denied doing anything that would justify the officer shooting her and her son.

According to police, the mother and the officer, both Oceanside residents, got into a traffic dispute about 9 p.m., and one followed the other into a nearby parking lot in the 100 block of Old Grove Road.

A short time later, White shot the mother and son. What caused him to pull the trigger has not been disclosed. He had an attorney with him when interviewed by his superiors.

White's wife, a Carlsbad police dispatcher, was with him at the time of the shooting.

She and Rachel Silva both called 911 after shots were fired.

Police said Rachel Silva was driving on a suspended license and facing a drunken driving charge when the confrontation started. Police ordered her blood taken at the hospital.

She is not cooperating with police, saying she doesn't trust the Oceanside department to be fair. White, she has said, should have had to undergo a sobriety test, as she did.

Silva and her ex-husband Luis have filed claims against the city of San Diego. In both claims, which are the first steps toward the filing of a lawsuit, unspecified damages are sought.

Luis Silva, a Camp Pendleton Marine, was on deployment to Iraq at the time of the shooting, but has since returned to Oceanside.
================================================== ====
You've got to be kidding me. So I assume that she has not been arrested (nor had her kid taken away) namely because its a sensitive issue.

I bet my donuts that the officer could not see the 8-yo (think about a kid's height in the passenger seat and the dark tint) and would have hesitated instead of firing.

[hulakai]

Offficer White is a former dispatcher and his wife a current one. They followed all protocol of off duty incidents. they tried to call in uniformed patrol officers, but when things go to **** you have to react and make a split decision....... and you hope with your training you make the right one. I stand by and say he did......... Stay Safe..............

[hulakai]

sorry sp Officer

[mobtown]

Breaking News: The officer has been charged in this shooting.

San Diego police officer Frank White has been charged with one felony count of gross negligent discharge of a firearm with two enhancements of causing great bodily injury in the March shooting of Rachel Silva and her son, District Attorney Bonnie Dumanis announced today.

White is also charged with one misdemeanor count of exhibiting a firearm, Dumanis said.

White will surrender to authorities today at his arraignment in Vista superior Court at 1:30 p.m.. Dumanis said. If convicted, he could face up to nine years in prison, she said.

I'm certain more info will be following.
http://weblog.signonsandiego.com/news/breaking/2008/07/officer_white_charged_with_fel.html

[pulicords]

One officer gets charged, we are all guilty (in the publics' eyes)! Any bets on whether there's enough evidence to prove this guy's "guilty" beyond a reasonable doubt in the opinion of 12 jurors?

[nobodyjr]

It's been a bad month for SDPD. I don't think they are going to get a conviction on this one though. In an unrelated case, a K9 officer is probably going to get charged, that one is more likely to get a conviction IMHO. We got two more guys likely being charged with stuff too that hasn't made it out to the press yet. It's ugly.

[willowdared]

It's been a bad month for SDPD. I don't think they are going to get a conviction on this one though. In an unrelated case, a K9 officer is probably going to get charged, that one is more likely to get a conviction IMHO. We got two more guys likely being charged with stuff too that hasn't made it out to the press yet. It's ugly.

I have a feeling the Foley case played a role in charges being filed.

**sigh**

You guys are still my heroes - stay strong.

[e30sd]

I have a feeling the Foley case played a role in charges being filed.

**sigh**

You guys are still my heroes - stay strong.

more like it's an election year and bonnie d doesn't wanna move out...

[LeeRoy]

Interesting tactic in one of the search warrants. Writing paper to figure out who the hospital roommate is so you can interview. Pretty thorough.

Seems to me that had the first responders hooked her for deuce and drawn blood two of the search warrants wouldn't have had to be obtained (one for the sample and the other for to identify chain of custody on the blood samples).

For any SD investigators. Those search warrants look pretty old fashioned. Is that format the norm for SD County?

[DagoStar]

The format is a pretty much the same but the style is little different than what I use. When I write search warrants I don't use titles/headers and don't space paragraphs. I guess it's all about styles. I don't really think our search warrants in San Diego have changed much in the last 40 years. Also using the "pleading" paper is optional. We haven't advanced to e-mail warrants or any of that stuff, if that would make my job easier I am all for it.

[CPLHARRISON]

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Frank-White-Speaks.html