View Full Version : Horse Health Question: Presence, Rumspringa, I need ya'll!
Ok, I have a weird health question for you guys! We're baffled at the moment.
For the last few days, my mom's 21yr old mare Barbie has been a little "off." Today I checked her out this morning when I got home from work and she had developed a HUGE swelling under her jaw/throatlatch, probably the size of 2 baseballs put together! It almost looked like Strangles, but considering her age and vaccination history, I don't think that's what it is. She also had not finished her breakfast (neither had Xander.)
I call the vet and tell her what's up. We already had an appt for tomorrow morning (our paint horse Doc had some squamous tumors frozen off two weeks ago and we're supposed to bring him back for a checkup.) I asked the vet if she could wait until the morning or if we needed to bring her today. She said to use our judgment and if she looks worse, to go ahead and bring her.
Well about noon (after 4hrs of very restless half-sleep on my behalf), I go outside to check on them. Her jaw is even bigger; she can't even move her neck. To make matters worse, Xander is lying stretched out on the ground in the arena like he's dead. I go to check on him and he gets up but looks listless. He had a very acute colic episode about 3 months ago (yeah, I’m having all the luck where horses are concerned...we also had another one slice his shoulder up pretty bad in December.) He didn't look like he was having another acute colic, but he did seem very off. I was hoping maybe this time, he was just vegging in the 90 degree heat, because he did stand up, shake off, and drink some water.
I decide to give them a little longer to see how they do. I lay down for another restless couple of hrs of sleep. My dad comes in from work before I wake up and Xander's down again. I get up, go check their vitals. Temps are high-normal (101.6 on Barbie, 101.7 on Xany.) Heart rates are up (56 on Barb, 60 on Xany.)
So we decide we've waiting long enough. We hook up our rig, get 'em loaded (Xander was still down, didn't want to get up.) We haul them to Equine Sports Medicine and Surgery clinic (the vet's we use.)
They look at Barbie first and her poor head is swollen so bad she can hardly move it. She's draining fluid under her jaw by now (just a little). They go to shave her jaw so they can look at it and just the VIBRATION of the clippers prompts her abscess to BURST all over the place. This was the nasty thing I've ever seen...a solid, pressured stream of goo comes pouring out of her neck. We got about 3-4 cups of this crap and it smells like something DIED. I mean this stuff was FOUL (worse than anything I've ever smelled working in the jail.) My dad said it smelled like a corpse (he's been around plenty of them in his LEO career.)
The vet says that horrible stench is NOT consistent with strangles, and thinks it might be an infected tooth abscess (not probable, since we had her teeth done in December.) They do digital x-rays, can't find anything. They took a culture of the goo, but won't even have a preliminary result on it until tomorrow and won't have a GOOD analysis for 2-3 days.
On the bright side, she did appear to feel MUCH better after the goo was drained. They decided to keep her there in the hospital overnight, until they know what's wrong with her and if it's contagious. We're supposed to go back tomorrow morning for Docs appt and to find out how she's doing. This is my mom's horse, and she is beside herself with worry. We've never seen anything like this. The vets don't know what it is, which really disturbs me because this is one of the largest/most renowned clinics in the country and if THEY don't know what's wrong, then that doesn't bode well.
They also checked out Xander and they don't believe his issue is related to hers (guess I just got lucky, got two sickies on one day!). His guts were a little quiet, but his temp was down to 101 and his heart rate back to normal by the time they examined him. They tubed him, gave him some banamine and ran some blood work which showed his kidney function to be slightly off and his white blood cells to be a little low. They don't know why he colicked or if it's related to his last colic episode.
They had me go ahead and take him home, and said to keep an eye on him and bring him back tomorrow when we come back so they can run his blood again.
Has anyone ever heard of anything like this? What in the world could it be? I'm sort of freaking out! I need advice!
Granted, I'm not a horse guy.
Barbie's issue sounds like a classic infected injury. If you can certainly rule out an abscessed tooth, I'd look towards a scratch or puncture wound that got infected. I see it in people all the time. I've seen it in my cats on occasion after a fight.
Xander's issue is very likely NOT related.
Yeah we were wondering about a puncture. Our fence is decent but not perfect...and in the location it's at, she could have leaned over the fence and scratched it. Kind of hard to tell if there was a puncture since she now has a huge fricking hole in her skin where the abscess burst.
And at 14.2h, she's the perfect height to have scratched herself on the fence.
I'm really concerned to find out *what* kind of bacteria she's dealing with. It's so odd for her to be sick...We've had her 10yrs and she's never been sick or off a day in her life :( In fact, she's the ONLY one that never gets sick, lol!
You're going to hate to hear this, but Horses are like Kids, if they are not hurt, they are sick, and if they are not sick, they are finding some other way to make you spend money.
you've been lucky to have healthy ones.
barbies face sounds like an infected wound. She probably started scraching it on everything as soon as it was injured and could pack all kinds of nastyness into it (Think of how much all horses like having the space between their jawbones scrached)
Look at what has been happening with the Colicky guy over the course of his treatment. Is there any common factor between the first problem, and the last few days? Did he get a treat right before both episodes? Did someone wash out his food or water supply with soap? Is he cribbing (Chewing) on something new like green pressure treated lumber?
As big and tough as they appear, horses can be fragile.
M-11
M-11, I know you're right!
We've had bad luck with horses these last 10yrs.
10yrs ago: Lost a horse I was leasing to a gas colick when the neighbors fed her grass clippings.
9yrs ago: Lost a 5yr old barrel prospect to intestinal cancer (that one was bad.)
3yrs ago: My western pleasure mare pulled a stifle and ended up being sold to be a broodmare.
2yrs ago: Doc lost his eye (to the same kind of squamous we're dealing with now)
Same year my good barrel horse was diagnosed with navicular and we ended up having to sell him to someone who could afford the expensive treatments he needed on a never-ending basis.
In the last year, my younger mare kellie pulled a shoulder and was off for 6 months.
My older barrel horse bowed a tendon shortly after.
Then the farrier (who's been totally reliable for 10yrs) quicked all my horses, Xander worse than the others. He was off 6 weeks with that.
And now Xander colicking, Docs new tumors, Turbo slicing and dicing his shoulder, Barbie has an abscess, UGH!
I have 6 horses and we're lucky if we have even 1-2 competition worthy at any given time. I'm so frustrated I could scream!
Is there any common factor between the first problem, and the last few days?
I don't think so. We KNOW what caused it the first time. My mom double fed him. I fed him (like I do EVERY sunday morning) and for some reason my mother had a brain fart and went down there and fed ALL of them again. He was the only one to colic though. He eats a massive amount of grain anyway (he's a western pleasure horse in training, but we're also showing halter and showmanship on him, so we keep him fat.) Between that and his massive size (16.2h) he eats more than any of the others.
Did he get a treat right before both episodes
I give him alfalfa cubes as treats on a regular basis, but that's it.
Did someone wash out his food or water supply with soap?
No. I usually just scrub them daily with a handful of hay (sounds stupid but it works.) They don't ever really get enough grime that I need to use soap.
Is he cribbing (Chewing) on something new like green pressure treated lumber?
Never seen him crib, but he does try to eat/bite/destroy blankets (has destroyed about 4 or 5 this winter.) He hasn't had one on since last week though.
I think the worst part is that we are SO careful with their care. We use the best vet within several hundred miles, they are on very carefully regimented feeding/training schedules, get the best feed/worming/vet care/farriers etc in general. We buy the best tack and equipment that money can buy, they have massueses, chiropracters, etc. I mean, we are just REALLY neurotic with their care and yet they are constantly injured/sick/etc.
And I have neighbors with a couple of old nags that haven't seen a vet or a farrier or a tube of wormer in I don't know HOW long and those darn critters are ALWAYS just fine! I don't get, lol!
I'd clean the crap out of his stall, hose it out and let it dry. Look for signs of cribbing, and look for Mold or moss growing inn the corners. Might want to change out for a new bag of grain (a dead mouse or somthing can mess up tons of grain) and check your hay for mold as well.
Look for a difference in droppings, and if he likes chewing on blankets, he'll chew on anything if he gets the idea.
M-11
I'd clean the crap out of his stall, hose it out and let it dry
It's pretty clean. It's got rubber mats on the floor and we just redid all the sidewalls where he had kicked through the plywood that lines them */sigh*
Look for signs of cribbingI'll look again, but he's never show the slightest interest in cribbing.
look for Mold or moss growing inn the cornersI'll check the walls again, but they *are* fairly new (at least the inside lining is..the outer wall is metal) and I don't think the rubber mats would be growing anything, but it's worth a try.
Might want to change out for a new bag of grain (a dead mouse or somthing can mess up tons of grain)
I'll go through the grain too. We keep it in big metal bins with *supposedly* mouse-proof containers (and none of the others who eat out that bin are sick, but I suppose he may just be uber-sensitive.)
check your hay for mold as well
I know the square bales he's eating off of are good, but there's still some old hay on the ground from the round bales that got ruined in the snowstorm. Those might be moldy...
he likes chewing on blankets, he'll chew on anything if he gets the idea.
Chewing probably wasn't the right word..he RIPS them, violently. Like turns around, grabs them in his mouth and viciously RIPS them from his body. It's the weirdest thing I've ever seen. We have to pepper spray his blankets to keep him from doing it.
I'll double check all those things you mentioned though, just to be sure.
I'm wondering if he doesn't just have a sensitive system...The funny thing is that the horses I've had that are foundation bred (3 of the ones I have now are) seem to be healthy and hearty. They might get injured but they don't get colicky/sick. My horses that are show-bred or race-bred always seems more sensitive and colicky.
Stewie
03-15-2008, 02:11 AM
I would turn that thing into a Horse Steak and ground Horse Hamburger IMO! :D
I would turn that thing into a Horse Steak and ground Horse Hamburger IMO!
Barbie is insured for 10 grand...that's a mighty expensive burger!
Stewie
03-15-2008, 02:16 AM
Barbie is insured for 10 grand...that's a mighty expensive burger!
I bet she would be mighty good though! Sorry I'm done derailing your thread. :) Just bored at work :p
I bet she would be mighty good though! Sorry I'm done derailing your thread. Just bored at work
That's ok!
I don't know if she'd be good...she's a barrel horse, which means she's all lean muscle! Not very good for eating I don't think!
texaschickeee
03-15-2008, 03:31 AM
the one with the swellon glands....I'm thining ether a tooth problem or thraot problem (like s sore one or cold type illness. the punction infectin again rings true)
the one lying on the ground....DR> time.
They xrayed her for tooth issues...her teeth are awesome actually.
Sometype of throat infection is a possibility.
The one that was lying down actually isn't the one they're most concerned with. His gums were good, heart rate good, temp good, no impactions in his gut, etc. They seem to think he just had a mild colic episode(which could be gas, stress, eating something he shouldn't have, or even be caused by an ulcer possibly.)
Had he been sweating, showing pain, biting his sides, etc we would have been worried (those are acute symptoms of colic.) But just the lying down by itself isn't a huge thing.
Also, to be honest, Xander is a huge wuss with a low pain tolerance and it's possible he just had a slight tummy ache and decided to be a drama queen about it to get attention (because he really loves it when I baby him and hold his head in my lap and all that other mushy stuff.)
Like when the farrier quicked them all...the others are back to normal in 2-3 wks. Not Xan-the-man. He's tip-toeing around like a ballerina for 6wks. He's a huge prima-donna.
Day-before-yesterday, he nearly had a conniption because, get this, a ladybug landed on his nose. A ladybug. You'd have thought the earth was coming to an END. And when it rained last week and he had to stand in it for a whole TEN minutes while I brought the others in , he was screaming and running around and acting a fool...I bring him in, and he looks at me, all indignant like, as though I'm the biggest jerk on the face of the earth. How dare I let him get wet! He got his white stockings dirty, the HORROR!
He's definitely a show horse. Sometimes he frustrates the snot out of me...but then he looks at me with those big ole brown eyes and flicks his ears at me and I melt.../sigh...I think I'm in love ;)
Good thing for Xany he wasn't born on a ranch. I think he'd have died, lol.
He's spoiled rotten...He loves to be bathed, and clipped, and have his hair messed with :p. Also he's gotten accustomed to being groomed with my grooming vaccum which is hilarious. If I come at him with regular brushes, he turns around and looks at me like, "Excuse me? Where are my vaccuum brushes. Regular brushes are for lesser mortals!"
PA Civilian
03-15-2008, 06:29 AM
Well it's the next day, how's it going?
I agree it sounds like something else going on. Is there a temp today? What's the horses respiration like?
I have 3 horses, they are pastured not stalled and I am always waiting for one of them to come up with an injury.
Keep us updated.
I don't know PA, I'm still at work. When I get home in an hour, I'll check them. Or rather, I'll check Xander, since Barb is still at the vet, where they have techs checking her twice an hour.
Vet appt is at 11am, so we'll hopefully know something for real then.
Mine are at pasture during the day, stalled at night (except the one that gets squamous tumors...when the weather is warm/the sun bright, he's inside during the day and out at night.)
2411Show
03-15-2008, 06:45 AM
A barn about 30 miles from me had a new horse introduced into the barn, within hours the whole barn was quarantined because the new horse had strangles and she was 18 years old. She showed minimal signs at the time of transport, no one paid attention.
PA Civilian
03-15-2008, 07:26 AM
Just a quick thought, could be a far fetched thing but a good friend had both her girls come down with PIGEON FEVER. The vet was shocked they had it. Nasty swellings etc in the chin, can't remember it all as it was several years ago. I'd at least ask about it.
I've heard of pigeon fever too, but never seen it personally.
The preliminary guess of the vets today is that Barbie may have been bitten by a black widow spider (we have hundreds of them out here) and the bite got infected. They won't know for 100% sure until the final lab results are complete in a couple of days. She's still draining gooey stuff but she's home now and she seems to feel better.
Xany was positively bright-eyed and bushy-tailed this morning and seems totally back to normal. Apparently the vets think my theory is the most likely...That he got a tummy ache from some minor gas or indigestion and decided to be his normal wussy, cry-baby self about it, :p
Thank you for everyone who chimed in with advice! Barbie is going to be a while healing up but it looks like everything is going to be fine now.
Unfortunately, we did have to refreeze the tumors on Doc's eye today.../sigh...but that's a whole 'nother worry in and of itself.
willowdared
03-15-2008, 05:13 PM
Can horses get MRSA?
They just linked a woman's reoccurring MRSA with her cat. The cat was just a carrier, but after being treated with antibiotics, the woman's MRSA finally cleared up.
Hope they get better soon.
Not only can they get it, they can transfer it to people :eek:
Thanks Willow :)
wearsastetson
03-16-2008, 04:24 PM
the one with the swollen glands....I had a horse once that got a wood sliver in it's hay. The sliver lodged in about that spot and got a smilar infection. When I punctured the abcess it too had a lot of pressure and the hole was big enough for me to put my pinkie in. That's how I found the sliver. Also, my dad had a cow die out in pasture. The vet thinks the same thing happened to it and the fluid was draining into the lungs until the cow died of pneumonia. It was early spring and we just found the cow dead with no obvious signs. Couldn't even get meat from it since it died from an unknown illness....but we did have to pay the vet.
Rumspringa
03-16-2008, 05:39 PM
It looks like the key to having healthy horses is to have ones which aren't worth a darn and hurt to look at. Keep them fenced in electrified barbed wire about knee high. They'll live forever and won't even need a farrier. :P
I'm sorry to hear what you're going through. Keep us posted on what they think caused the abscess! The only thing that reminds me of is horses who get an infection in their neck from contaminated intramuscular injections. They eventually blow out and leave a huge hole. Yours sound like it's in the wrong spot for that, though.
Yeah she hasn't had any sort of injections at all.
It looks like the key to having healthy horses is to have ones which aren't worth a darn and hurt to look at. Keep them fenced in electrified barbed wire about knee high. They'll live forever and won't even need a farrier. :P
That seems to about be the size of it!
texaschickeee
03-16-2008, 08:04 PM
"They seem to think he just had a mild colic episode(which could be gas, stress, eating something he shouldn't have, or even be caused by an ulcer possibly.)"
we all know that horses NEVER eat anything that they aent suppose to right???
we all know that horses NEVER eat anything that they aent suppose to right???
Never!
SJammer03
03-17-2008, 03:08 AM
Hey JMTX -- Even on your day off!!! Can't sleep???????????
Presence
03-17-2008, 09:24 AM
JMTX, it does sound like Xander just had a mild colic. My horse Skylar did something similar a few months ago...he was off his feed in the morning, and so the barn owner called me to come out and check on him. I went and spent some time with him, combed out his tail, and just basically hung out with him in his pasture for a few hours until i determined that it wasn't serious. He'd eaten his feed by the time I got there, but he'd been sort of listlessly picking at it earlier that morning. Since my horse is a voracious eater, the barn owner was concerned.
Unless it's major, usually just walking them around will do a lot of good... He worked out of it, thankfully, and I didn't have to call the vet.
it is interesting to me that where you live you actually take your horse TO the vet instead of the vet coming to you. Is that how it works for you other horse people here too?? We just call and the vet comes to us. (Thank goodness, because I don't own a truck or trailer). Though, if it was a life or death situation and he had to get to the surgery, we could call a friend to transport him.
I haven't had any experience with the situation you describe with Barbie. Horses are strange, and as you know, they are very very good at finding ways to hurt themselves or make themselves sick.
best of luck to you in their healing...
Presence
03-17-2008, 09:46 AM
and, while all the horse people are sort of assembled for the moment...i have to unload something that is sitting on my chest. if you are very sensitive or get upset easily, you probably don't want to read this...
I was at a very prestigious three day event this weekend. On cross country day, two horses died. The first one died of a heart attack in the middle of the course. I was not there to witness it, thankfully. Unfortunately, I was sitting next to the jump where the second accident occurred.
The jump was a bounce jump into water, then a series of jumps going out of the water. A bounce means you jump in, land, and immediately take off (bounce) to jump over the second element. The lead up to the bounce was downhill... This poor girl and her horse came galloping down the hill, and i was thinking, Sit up sit up sit up, you have to collect up, that's a bounce! Well, she didn't collect him enough, or at all, and he just had too much momentum built up. He started to fly over the first element of the bounce, and one of his forelegs got hung behind him on the jump as he went over it... When he started to land, obviously his one leg couldn't support the weight of his entire body as it came flying over the jump... :( :( :( He lurched forward, head first into the second element. If any of you know cross country, you know the jumps are sturdy, and do not break away. This is to encourage the horse to be bold while jumping the fences. Unfortunately, in this instance, when his head plowed into the jump, we heard the crack. He crumpled to the ground, kicked his legs momentarily, then lay still. The rider was thrown over his head into the water on the other side. She knew immediately that he'd broken his neck and she ran away screaming and collapsed on the other side of the water complex...
:(
I know police officers see the worst of people every day, and see horrible, terrible things and then have to deal with it... I'm not an officer...yet anyway. I can't get this to stop playing and replaying in my head. it was honestly the most terrible thing I've ever actually witnessed happen. I feel so bad for the girl, because I know she'll always blame herself for the accident. I've been praying for peace for her to be able to move on from this...
Hey JMTX -- Even on your day off!!! Can't sleep???????????
LOL, I keep the same schedule 7 days a week....I'm always up that time of night.
it is interesting to me that where you live you actually take your horse TO the vet instead of the vet coming to you. Is that how it works for you other horse people here too??
They offer mobile services, but their office is a full scale hospital/surgery center, so when possible they prefer you to come to them where they all their equipment at. For example, by bringing Xander to them, they were able to immediately run his blood work and stuff. They also have the digital xrays there and everything.
Here's a link to them:
http://www.equinesportsmedicine.com/esmtest.html
I'm sorry to hear about what you saw Presence. That's why cross-country scares me so much! I can hardly watch it.
Presence
03-17-2008, 04:21 PM
yeah...it's a double edged sword... On one hand it's extremely exciting to watch, because of the element of danger involved.... Then again, it's that element of danger that makes it so scary...
and to think I used to do three day eventing! Never to the level these people were riding at, but all the same, I don't have the guts for it these days.
I flat out refuse to jump. Period. It terrifies me.
I've tried to take English lessons with 2 different teachers and both started harping one me to jump within 3 lessons...What part of I just want to do flatwork and learn dressage do you guys not get, lol?
Presence
03-18-2008, 08:48 AM
yeah, jumping is not for everyone. especially cross country!
Rumspringa
03-18-2008, 10:40 AM
Yikes! My sisters did eventing when I was young and I would always park myself at the water obstacles to watch the disasters. That accident sounds awful- glad I didn't have to witness anything like that.
I agree that jumping is terrifying- I've done it anyway. Somehow the fear never really goes away entirely, but I suppose it's for good reason.
Presence
03-18-2008, 12:27 PM
it was really terrible. :(
i think if you ever get to the point where you aren't at least a little bit scared about that stuff, you get complacent, and that's when accidents can really start to happen.
i used to love jumping, then I went to college and didn't ride for a few years...now I'm trying to get back into it... Riding, just on the flat for now, obviously...maybe one day I'll try to jump again...
Rumspringa
03-19-2008, 12:09 PM
Heheh jumping lessons always made me nervous! I groomed for a hunter/jumper barn out of high school and got lessons for free. My lesson horse of choice was known to be a little wacky, but we got along well... One day he was being a little reticent about going forward and the trainer would not listen to me when I said something just wasn't right. He told me that that couldn't be so because this was a horse who other people couldn't STOP from going forward. Well, coming towards home on a long run to an oxer (what horse wouldn't jump that?) he very sneakily stopped and dipped a shoulder right at the fence. I planted my hands on his neck and did an unintentional front handspring into the oxer. I'm lucky it was a little fence so that I landed in it rather than crashed through it! When the trainer came to give me a leg up, he informed me that he would have no more of these "dramatic dismounts." No respect... :P
Presence
03-19-2008, 01:42 PM
hahahah!! front handspring!! at least you didn't crash through it! trust me that's no fun either! ;)
PA Civilian
03-19-2008, 04:02 PM
I don't do eventing but I DO LOVE JUMPING. It's a thrill, and I am a born thrill seeker. I owned motorcycles when I was very young, I love fast boats, fast cars fast horses. I also love sparring, thus the blackbelt in karate. My gelding is not a jumper, he's super fast though. My mare is a jumper but not fast, almost wish I could combine the two.
PM me if you want to see the webshots albums for the horses.
he informed me that he would have no more of these "dramatic dismounts."
Haha. Reminds me of when I was doing "steer undecorating" in high school rodeo. It's an event that is set up just like steer wrestling (girl on horse, steer, then hazer on the other side.) Only instead of jumping off the horse to wrestle the steer, the girl just runs up beside the steer and grabs a ribbon that's been stuck to it's back.
Well I was borrowing a horse for the event from the stock contractor because my only horse was a 16.2h :o
This mare was a real pistol...we all called her "psycho Sassy". She pops out of the box like a freight train, I lean for my ribbon and FALL OFF, face first into the dirty.
My hazer comes up and says, "You ain't supposed to be bulldoggin' honey, get up!"
I was so mad I could have slapped him.
Rumspringa
03-20-2008, 05:59 AM
LMAO! I'd be ****ed too, but that was FUNNY!
I got one better, but it didn't happen to me!
Same hazer, same horse, different gal (lots of the girls didn't own horses, or only owned barrel horses, so the contractor had a group of horses they let all the girls use for this event.) If you were a beginner, they put you on one calm old horse...if you were a little better, they put you on the 2nd horse who was a little faster and you could win a little more, and if you were a GOOD rider, they put you on Psycho Sassy and you hoped you lived (this mare was so bad, they couldn't even ride her to warm her up or cool her down..they had to pony her. And she was a blithering idiot in the box. She'd get your nerves so worked up that it was no wonder you'd fall off her after she popped out. And it was always a coin toss as to whether she'd break the darn barrier...but I digress.)
Girl leans over to get her ribbon and starts to fall towards the steer. The hazer (big ole boy) goes to push her shoulder to push her back into the saddle. He MISSES and hits her square in the eye. She starts to fall off the OTHER side of the horses, so he GRABS her. She was wearing kind of a silky shirt and every button on the thing RIPS as he grabs her shirt. Shirt slides through his fingers and she still ends up falling.
So there this poor kid is, half naked, black eye, and covered in dirt. I felt SOOOOO bad for her.
I have tons of great "falling off" stories. When I was 15, I got thrown off a western pleasure colt at his first show. I landed on my BUTT so hard that it jarred my brain and gave me a concussion. They had to rush me to the emergency room and I had memory loss of the situation and all...My mom said she'd always suspected my head was up my rear, and now she had proof!
Presence
03-20-2008, 08:37 AM
"So there this poor kid is, half naked, black eye, and covered in dirt. I felt SOOOOO bad for her!"
aaaaahhahahahhahahahhahahahahhahahahhh!!!!!! awesome... i wish I could have seen that.
one of these days I'll have to scan my old eventing photos.. I have 'em in an album, but they were from the days before digital cameras were so popular, so I don't have 'em on a computer anywhere. some of them are really hilarious, my facial expression, that is... Going over jumps with my teeth gritted, jaw clenched, eyes wide in terror... lol...
No, it wasn't that bad at the time, my first eventing pony though, Twilight, was a full blooded mustang, and every now and then she'd take me for a nice uncontrolled run... I miss that little tyrant. :)
/sigh
Back off to the vet this morning. We're taking Barbie for a routine re-check but taking Xander back to because his abdomen has a weird distended place that I believe is supposed to be indicative of gas colic.
I am so worried that this $2000 horse is going to cost me a $5000 colic surgery before it's all said and done :(
Wish my pretty boy luck!
http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z264/jrmorganhorses/picssept120.jpg
Presence
03-20-2008, 08:50 AM
man...that sucks.
strange to see you on this time of the morning, no? guess it's cause you are taking pretty boy to the vet. best of luck to you and Xander!
Rumspringa
03-20-2008, 11:43 AM
Wow- he is stunning.
Hope the vet visit turns out okay.
We gotta have those event pics, Presence. :)
Thanks for the compliment :) I think he's gorgeous, but I'm partial.
The vet said he *was* holding a little gas but it didn't seem to be an abnormal amount (I disagree...I think it was a weird amount.)
Then he proceeds to tell me that his flank is sticking out more than normal because he's fat. WTF??? First of all, he is not "fat." He is halter fit. I'm prepping him for halter/showmanship and if he was any skinnier they'd laugh him out of the ring. (He's a little bigger than he is in the pic, but he isn't HUGE or anything!)
This was a different vet than usual too...I think he's a bit of a goober.
Sigh.
Xander is fine.
Barbie is back in ICU.
She started trying to lay down this evening and acting lethargic. We took her back to the vet. They palpated her and found some "hard structure" up high inside her. It was too far forward to really feel where it was, but they are concerned about it.
They feel it could
A) be a slight impaction colic caused by the antibiotics she's on.
B) be a major impaction colic
C) be a intestinal abscess (which, in relation to the other abscess could indicate lymphoma, a tumor. some other kind of cancer.)
We left her there over night on IV fluids...They are hoping that if it's a minor impaction , it will have passed by in the morning with the help of all the fluids.
They'll palpate her in the morning and in the morning, if it's gone, we're all good.
If it's not, they'll pull fluids off her stomach and run tests. Hopefully that will give them an indicator as to whether it's an abscess or not.
If it's an abscess/lymphoma they will treat her and hope her body fights it. If it doesn't, there isn't much we can do :(
If it's an actual tumor (intestinal cancer) or a major impaction, it's going to cost us $5,000-$10,000 in surgery and treatment (and there are no guarantees of course.)
Thankfully, my dad is being just spectacular about the money issue (we already owe the vet $1700 between tonight and the last episode.) His attitude has just been, "It's only money." Which is good for him of course as my mom would consider refusing to pay for colic surgery as grounds for divorce.)
deputy x 2
03-24-2008, 10:42 PM
Our thoughts are with you and Barbie!
Thanks Deputy.
Here lately it seems that if it weren't for bad luck, we'd have none.
My mother is a wreck :(
Presence
03-25-2008, 09:00 AM
egads... i'll send positive healing thoughts your way!
Ok, good news...it was just a small impaction and she passed it this morning.
I wish they'd have taken a picture of it seeing as how it added up to roughly a $1200 turd.
They're keeping her again tonight for observation, but hopefully she'll be home tomorrow.
*sigh* my best friend who reads tarot warned me that one of my older horses was about to have some health issues (that was February 9th he said that). He's been giving me readings for 10yrs...I wish he'd occasionally be wrong :(
Presence
07-07-2008, 10:51 AM
Okay, I have a horse health question for you horsey people...
My sister bought a 6 y/o TB gelding about 6 months ago. He is thin as a rail. We cannot seem to put any weight on this guy.
Any suggestions??
(I have to talk to my sis to find out exactly what he's eating each day). The food quality is high, a special blend the barn uses. He's fed once daily, gets hay in the evening, and the pasture is very grassy. He stays rail thin though- we just can't seem to fatten him up.
PA Civilian
07-07-2008, 12:41 PM
TB's are notoriously hard keepers. Sounds like he is getting the right stuff. Make sure he's been wormed recently.. might have to do a power pack if he's gone along time without that.
Have the vet check for ulcers, TB's again are high maintenance horses. Check to be sure he's FINISHING the foods given. Doesn't help much if he leaves food untouched.
Also check his teeth if food is not finished.
Ahhh that's all I can think of at the moment.
Presence
07-07-2008, 01:31 PM
Thanks for the tips... He is up to date on all worming, shots, teeth floating, etc...
My TB was really thin when I got him too (about 8 years ago. :) but, he fattened up and filled out, and now he's a very big boy. Almost 17 hh, large and in charge.
Magic on the other hand... We thought he'd be putting on some weight by now, at least a little. He's been pastured with another horse for a while. We are going to remove the other horse from the field to be sure that it is actually Magic that is getting the food...It will be a few weeks before we can do that though. As of now he's been eating just once a day, because this other horse in the field is a pig and will eat it all. The barn is full at the moment with campers, so unfortunately it'll be another couple of weeks before we can start giving him two meals per day. I think this will help a lot.
I've read about adding different oils to his food to up the fat content, but that gets really messy...Don't know how the barn owner would feel about having to deal with oily buckets... SO, other thoughts??
I've thought about Alfalfa... there are several different forms to choose from, cubes, hay and pellets, so that could be helpful...
We've also thought about putting him on a senior feed instead of the one he's on, or supplementing his feed with something like that... Just not sure which would have the best result.
Here's the skinny boy just after she got him:
http://photos-c.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-sf2p/v239/184/116/195400246/n195400246_30203434_9630.jpg
He just started on a new feed (mixed with a high oat/sweet feed mixture, high bran content)... It's called Purina 10/6 Horseman's Edge. He is also on a supplement called Ultra Bloom.
This is a recent pic of him. His coat has improved, and he looks a little better, but still very slim. You can't see his ribs as much because of the square saddle pad obscuring them (purposely):
http://photos-a.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-sf2p/v239/184/116/195400246/n195400246_30205536_3349.jpg
Not a cop
07-07-2008, 02:21 PM
Presence,
When I ran my barn in West Palm I fed Semenal herbal blend to the TB's and a 10% pellet to the warmbloods. Red cell during winter grand prix and stress dex. Bran mash once a week with corn oil to clean out sand a crud from their gut. Hey is more important than grain. I like T&A at about 10-20%A. Let them eat all the hay they want. Horse need to be eating constantly because of how they digest food.
http://www.seminolefeed.com/HorseFeeds.htm
I don't see herbal blend on their site now. It must have been discontined. A rep from the company came out to my barn and did tested all the fields for me then did individual feeding recomendations for each horse in my barn.
Not a cop
07-07-2008, 02:23 PM
I also add apple cider viniger in the pellets 2x a day.
Presence
07-07-2008, 02:33 PM
Thanks for the tips!
The feed they are on now is a good mix, it has a high bran content...and more oat than sweet feed. The Horseman's Edge 10/6 is something new we are trying... He hasn't been on it long enough to notice results yet. I'm just wondering if somewhere out there someone knows of some miracle fattening solution... ;)
What is the apple cider vinegar for, exactly? Digestion?
Not a cop
07-07-2008, 02:45 PM
miracle fattening solution... Turn him out in a good pature with lots of grass.
The apple cider vinegar helps digestion and also keep flys off them. I swear by it and everyone I know who has tried it has stuck with it. I've used corn oil in the past as well. It is high fat and keeps things moving on though.
PA Civilian
07-07-2008, 02:48 PM
BOSS (black oil sunflower seeds) great way to get fat and oils into his system. No mess. I bet removing the other horse will improve things for him, he's probably stressed from the bossy horse. The campers could be adding to the stress also. Some horses just don't do well in busy environments.
The Equine Sr feed would help also, high in fat. We fed the ancient QH at the farm a mix of that and Boss. We fed him 2 or 3 times a day. (he was 36 yrs old) However we also fed him several QUARTS vs the small amounts my TWH's get. (easy keepers). Horses are better off towards the thin side vs too fat. Hoof issues, ligament issues etc increase with weight.
He's lucky to have you guys looking out for him.
Presence
07-07-2008, 02:50 PM
Not a cop: Ah! I see. We have them on a supplement called Bug Check which helps with the flies quite a bit. The problem is that it's expensive. Apple cider vinegar would probably be a lot cheaper... Maybe we'll try that out!
thankfully the barn we are at now has WONDERFUL pasture, so I'm hoping now that it is summertime and the grass is growing like mad that it will help him out.
PA Civilian: Thanks for the thoughts! I've considered equine senior... My horse gets a little bit of it because he is on a supplement that won't stick to the oats... So, we shake it onto some senior and it does the trick. I guess we are going to give this new Purina food he's on a chance, as well as remove the other horse... and hopefully he'll start filling out. He's a great little horse, just very slim... A little too slim for our liking. The barn is very busy in the summertime- lots of campers, etc. But the rest of the year it's pony parties, etc... very busy place, full of farm animals, etc... It's good for the horses, actually, I think, because it gets them used to lots of commotion. That is, unless you have a goofy TB like mine who forgets that there are pens of farm animals (goats, sheep, pigs, geese, chickens, donkey, cow, etc), even though he's walked by them about 300 times. :P
I've never heard of BOSS, but now I am intrigued! :) I will tell my sis about it, do some more research, etc...
Keep the ideas coming though, because if this doesn't start working within the next few months, we'll need to try something else.
Maybe I should have just started a thread for general horse health tips and tricks that we all use. :) Or, we can just work off of this one, if anyone is interested.
Not a cop
07-07-2008, 03:12 PM
Mabey a "Mounted police officer tips and tricks" forum...
I second BOSS, and I'd say add flax seed too.
Add 1cup of corn oil a day, and feed grain 2-3x a day instead of once. I also second changing to senior feed.
Alfalfa hay once or twice a day wouldn't hurt either.
Based on the pic you posted, he is not *that* bad for a TB. Sometimes you just *can't* get their fricking ribs covered, especially that last 1-2 ribs.
Oh yeah, and the power pack isn't a bad idea even if you are already worming properly. Doesn't hurt to have the vet do a fecal egg count either.
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