PDA

View Full Version : Civilian Military Police



cuffs203
11-16-2007, 01:54 PM
In eastern North Carolina (ie: MCAS Cherry Point & Marine Base Camp Lejuene) there are currently posts for Civilian Marine Police. It appears that in his area the base pay is around the 28,000 range and I'm only assuming that this is the crew that will be replacing some of the Military Police to cover for PMO. Does anyone have any specifics? Is this a federal law enforcement position or do you have to turn in your gun and badge when you get off at the end of the day? Do you have to pull the 12 hours (actually 14 hours) that the MPs do now? Anyone with any information will be appreciated. Lots of us Cilivilan Police are Veterans and are interested in the job.....just don't want to lose that "Police" certification in the states. Thanks!

Woofdog
11-16-2007, 04:42 PM
Currently, they work 12-hour shifts. Every other weekend off. Yes, they have to turn in their weapons at the end of the shift, per DoD regulations. Unless they have independent authority to carry concealed, they are prohibited from doing so under DoD employment. They will be able to apprehend, but not arrest, civilian and military offenders (DoD uniformed police don't have statutory powers of arrest). In other words, they have to release offenders after processing. Serious felonies are turned over to NCIS for investigation and/or arrest, if warranted.

They do not fall under the federal LE retirement system, so there is no age 37 limit.

I think the pay is a little higher than you posted, though. Probably depends on prior qualifications.

A lot of local LEO's in the Coastal Carolina area are interested, also a lot of retired service members living in the area.

cuffs203
11-18-2007, 03:31 AM
By no means am I belittling the job that these guys are gonna do, but are they basically armed security guards? Is it a gun/badge uniform? From what most of the guys in my department and surrounding think.....this is a federal law enforcement position. They are under the impression that this will give them the ability to carry weapons off duty under our federal law for law enforcement officers to carry anywhere w/o the concealed carry permit. Also the pay in considerably lower than what the rumors said it would be. The NCESC has the pay in the mid 28,000 range, but I see other areas paying around 31,000.

Thanks for you information.

Cuffs

Woofdog
11-18-2007, 09:04 AM
No, they are not just armed security guards. They will enforce traffic - including DWI's, respond to calls in housing and industrial areas, apprehend lawbreakers aboard the base, take statements, and basically do everything a municipal officer would do in a city or town. Just like military MP's are doing now. But they won't have the turnover and shortage of personnel due to MP deployments and combat support roles.

The ONLY operational difference between these officers and sworn state or federal police officers is the lack of statutory powers of arrest both under federal and state law. It's a military thing, and has to do with the fact that they ultimately report to a military officer, the base commander.

Even though they can apprehend and detain lawbreakers, they have to either release them after processing (identification/statements, etc.), or turn them over to NCIS if an arrest is needed. In other words, they can't take a lawbreaker to the magistrate and on to the jail.

That applies to both military and civilian lawbreakers.

Because there is not a federal or state law giving them statutory powers of arrest, they are not covered under the Law Enforcement Officer Safety Act (LEOSA) which allows sworn officers with statutory powers of arrest to carry concealed nationwide. They turn their Berettas in at the end of the shift, and can't carry concealed unless they have a NC CCW permit.

There are only a handful of DoD police agencies who are covered under LEOSA, and they all ultimately report to a civilian DoD CLEO.

The positive thing is, because they don't fall under federal LE retirement, retired military personnel over 37 YOA can be hired.

Here is more info from the local paper:

http://www.jdnews.com/news/police_53380___article.html/base_officers.html

cuffs203
11-18-2007, 02:07 PM
Thanks for the reply. Does this mean that the police officers will have the benefits similar to NADEP employees and other federal employees that work on base? You certainly answered a lot of quetions and squashed some rumors.

Cuffs

orlandofed5-0
11-18-2007, 05:39 PM
Thanks for the reply. Does this mean that the police officers will have the benefits similar to NADEP employees and other federal employees that work on base? You certainly answered a lot of quetions and squashed some rumors.

Cuffs


Yes. All federal employees have the same choice of benefits. Doesnt matter if your an 1811 (Criminal investigator), an 0083 (police officer) or an 0318 (secretary). The only difference is in retirement with the exception of the Federal Bureau Of Prisons who trains everyone as a correctional officer and places them in the LE Retirement.

Woofdog
11-18-2007, 09:55 PM
What Orlandofed5-0 said.

It's a good gig, especially for more mature, experienced officers who are tired of being stressed out in a local department, and who are tired of working for peanuts. You do find the spectrum of crime on a military base, but much less so by number, than in the civilian community.

cuffs203
11-18-2007, 11:31 PM
What kind of retirement does this provide if not under the federal retirement system?

LochRaven
11-19-2007, 02:07 AM
I know this is a different topic, but no sense in making a whole new thread (unless no one looking here knows).

Theres a bunch of postings for DON Civilian LEs on USAJOBS right now. There in an area I'm fond of (VA Beach, Norfolk), and so I'm slightly interested. I've read some crazy stuff about those guys over the past few years and there powers being given / taken away, etc. But what I'm interested in is their training. It states in the posting that they attend a 13-Week-Long academy in Norfolk, VA. Who runs this? Is it the Norfolk City PD academy? Or is it a Navy based one? Whats the Navy PD training like, and is it transferable to VA standards at all?

Thanks.

ice_fog
11-19-2007, 07:39 AM
What kind of retirement does this provide if not under the federal retirement system?

It is under the Federal retirement system, just not the law enforcement system.

orlandofed5-0
11-19-2007, 08:30 PM
I know this is a different topic, but no sense in making a whole new thread (unless no one looking here knows).

Theres a bunch of postings for DON Civilian LEs on USAJOBS right now. There in an area I'm fond of (VA Beach, Norfolk), and so I'm slightly interested. I've read some crazy stuff about those guys over the past few years and there powers being given / taken away, etc. But what I'm interested in is their training. It states in the posting that they attend a 13-Week-Long academy in Norfolk, VA. Who runs this? Is it the Norfolk City PD academy? Or is it a Navy based one? Whats the Navy PD training like, and is it transferable to VA standards at all?

Thanks.

The academy is run by the navy for its officers assigned to the Midlantic region. It includes all the facilities in the Tidewater region and the officers assigned to the former Philadelphia Naval base. As of right now, they lost the authority to issue cites into Norfolk courts and are working to hammer out a new contract with the mangement. The academy is not DCJS transferable however many officers have left and gotten hire both in the area and out of state. Its a basic bs academy with some minimum pt thrown in. Do a google search for the navy's phase1/2 training and that is what you will get. The academy is waiverable in Florida.

LochRaven
11-19-2007, 09:04 PM
Thanks for the information. You say phase 1/2 - is that for the police training or the PT? I've thrown it in the to google, and it comes up with Navy Seal training and Royal Marines.

orlandofed5-0
11-20-2007, 08:20 AM
Thanks for the information. You say phase 1/2 - is that for the police training or the PT? I've thrown it in the to google, and it comes up with Navy Seal training and Royal Marines.


It deals with the police training. Ive included a link from the Naval postgraduate school police training site.


http://www.nps.edu/Adminsrv/police/

SWATCybercop
11-21-2007, 12:05 PM
One of the positive "unintended consequences" of the Marines hiring civilian police officers in this part of the state will be the need for surrounding civilian LE departments to increase officer salaries. It's sorely needed in this area.

cuffs203
11-21-2007, 12:09 PM
I agree! It has been a long time coming.

Bearcat357
11-21-2007, 02:02 PM
One of the positive "unintended consequences" of the Marines hiring civilian police officers in this part of the state will be the need for surrounding civilian LE departments to increase officer salaries. It's sorely needed in this area.

From what I have heard, thats what happened down in the "Army Pit of Missouri" aka....Ft Leonard Wood.....

The locals had to kick up salaries to keep up with DOA....because they were losing folks to them......

jchughes05
11-25-2007, 02:02 PM
Is it true MCAS Cherry Point is looking to hire civilian (non-military) police officers for the on-base protection?

Woofdog
11-25-2007, 05:02 PM
Yes, it's true.

Bearcat357
12-19-2007, 02:30 AM
Bump.....

FYI....USMC is looking for Civilian LEOs on a lot of bases....annoucement just came out today.....

If interested....0083 is the series....and go to usajobs.opm.gov to locate same.......

Pay seems to be really, really low....so beware......

blotterjock
12-31-2007, 06:50 PM
GS 08/09 is not too shabby. I have only worked on an Army post though.

Bearcat357
12-31-2007, 07:20 PM
GS 08/09 is not too shabby. I have only worked on an Army post though.

Depends where you are at...... I started with the Feds almost 4 years ago as a 7 in DC.....and it sucked monkey butts...... I had to get a second job to survive.....

Woffski
12-31-2007, 07:45 PM
I do not have a lot of confidence in the USAJOBS site. I have applied to the Camp LeJeune jobs. So, lets see what happens.

Bearcat357
12-31-2007, 07:50 PM
I do not have a lot of confidence in the USAJOBS site. I have applied to the Camp LeJeune jobs. So, lets see what happens.

Well....USAJOBs is the only gig out there when it comes to Federal Jobs unless an agency is posting stuff on their own websites as well......

You may want to look at the Navy or USMC HR civilian hiring websites..... Not sure who has this posting....as I just looked at it briefly.....

cuffs203
01-01-2008, 03:35 AM
I do not have a lot of confidence in the USAJOBS site. I have applied to the Camp LeJeune jobs. So, lets see what happens.


If your referring to the Civilian Military Police - Camp LeJeune it is posted on North Carolina's Employment Security Commission website. www.ncesc.com or http://www.ncesc.com/individual/jis/jobDetail.asp?JobOrder=NC4622019

Narrow the search down to Law Enforcement and use a local zip code or search Onslow/Craven Counties. Cherry Point MCAS and Camp LeJeune are both posted on this website. Although the salary doesn't seem to be as high as some have posted....I, however, am not very knowledgeable on the payscale or if you get locality pay for Eastern North Carolina. Hope this helps...if anyone knows for sure what the salary is, I'd certainly like to know.

Cuffs

Unit453
01-01-2008, 11:34 AM
Leonardwood finally transitioned?

I dont really agree with the term "civilian" military police. Its either civilian or you're military. Some call it federal. Most call it DoD no matter your actual agency or title because its all the same.

Some think its a failing syste. Some think its basically designed for retirees to kick back and collect a decent paycheck. The Army is having a hard time with the transition. While some installations have fully replaced all their MP's in lieu of DoD police, others have not. Some installations are a mix of "green suiters" and "blue suiters." Some bases just cant let go and will always have some kind of MP assets on the road.

Also, you cant really look at the base salary as what you're actually gonna make. 10% shift differential for workin after 6pm, sunday premium at 25%, holidays worked at double time and overtime at time and a half.

Blotterjock, GS8/9 are good gigs but there are patrolman as GS6's who can make upwards of 50k on certain installations. I know GS7's who cleared over 60k this year. Just depends on how much and what hours you work.

My opinion is that unless you're retired or simply cannot make it on the outside, DoD police agencies are set up for failure. Until they get some kind of 20 year retirement or on an LEO scale and some actual authority, I dont think its a place for young aspiring police officers. Getting out of the military and getting hired? Sure, great idea to get you on your feet and dip yourself into the civilian sector but more of a stepping stone for most people, absolutely.

irishlad2nv
01-01-2008, 12:16 PM
I do not have a lot of confidence in the USAJOBS site. I have applied to the Camp LeJeune jobs. So, lets see what happens.

USAJOBS is about the only way you can apply for most Govt. jobs, if not 95% of them. All Govt. Agencies utilize USA Jobs to post all jobs. Now only about 50% use USA Jobs to apply for the specific job. Most allow you to submit your resume through the site, and then direct you to another hiring tool website. CPOL (Army) and DONHR (Navy), are the only ways you can apply to both the navy and army. If all you do is apply through USA Jobs, most likely your resume will be sitting. You must read the specific instructions to apply.

Bearcat357
01-01-2008, 01:27 PM
Most allow you to submit your resume through the site, and then direct you to another hiring tool website. CPOL (Army) and DONHR (Navy), are the only ways you can apply to both the navy and army. If all you do is apply through USA Jobs, most likely your resume will be sitting. You must read the specific instructions to apply.

Exactly. When I applied for the Force Protection/Anti-Terrorism job that I am in the running for with the Army, USAJOBs directed me to the Army CPOL site (which I have an account there) and I submitted all my information that way.....

Same with other agencies. Some use USAJOBs while others might use Aveue.

Just need to read the annoucement over really good....and follow the directions.

Good luck....

ICE Offcr
01-01-2008, 05:07 PM
WOOFDOG:

I think you are a little off here, most cilivian cops on a post are in the series of 0085 (security guard) with very few in the 0083 series (police officer). Most of it is based on the grade from what I have seen, lower grades are 0085's and 6 or 7's are the 0083's.

Second the LESO act requires you to to be classified as a federal law enforcement officer as such the 0085 series would not qualify:

`Sec. 926B. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified law enforcement officers
`(a) Notwithstanding any other provision of the law of any State or any political subdivision thereof, an individual who is a qualified law enforcement officer and who is carrying the identification required by subsection (d) may carry a concealed firearm that has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, subject to subsection (b).
`(b) This section shall not be construed to supersede or limit the laws of any State that--
`(1) permit private persons or entities to prohibit or restrict the possession
of concealed firearms on their property; or
`(2) prohibit or restrict the possession of firearms on any State or local
government property, installation, building, base, or park.
`(c) As used in this section, the term `qualified law enforcement officer' means an employee of a governmental agency who--
`(1) is authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention,
detection, investigation, or prosecution of, or the incarceration of any
person for, any violation of law, and has statutory powers of arrest;
`(2) is authorized by the agency to carry a firearm;
`(3) is not the subject of any disciplinary action by the agency;
`(4) meets standards, if any, established by the agency which require the
employee to regularly qualify in the use of a firearm;
`(5) is not under the influence of alcohol or another intoxicating or
hallucinatory drug or substance; and
`(6) is not prohibited by Federal law from receiving a firearm.
`(d) The identification required by this subsection is the photographic
identification issued by the governmental agency for which the individual is
employed as a law enforcement officer.

ICE Offcr
01-01-2008, 05:20 PM
"What kind of retirement does this provide if not under the federal retirement system"?

CUFFS203

federal retirement has three differet versions, one is no longer used (CSRS), the other two are used both are called FERS:
1. is for all personnel, mainteance, cooks and what we call NON-Covered LEO's (mostly 0083s and 0080's).
they receive 1% per year for retirement based on the high three system

2. is for Covered (6c) Law Enforcement Officers and Agents (mostly all 1811's, 1801's, 1896, 0007s, 0006's and some 0083's)
this provides a special retirement amount higher for those considered in an ardous job function, this is 1.7% per year based on the high three. These positions also have age limits for entering, 37, retire at 57 except CBP which is now 40, retire at 60.

Bearcat357
01-01-2008, 05:45 PM
I think you are a little off here, most cilivian cops on a post are in the series of 0085 (security guard) with very few in the 0083 series (police officer)


Not sure about Texas, but out here in NVA, all Army Civilian LEOs are hired as 0083s....at the GS-6/7 level with the commands paying a locality pay so they are in line with the locals..... or at least get it up there to being close to them......

All the 0085s out here guard buildings inside an instillation unless a specific command has opted to hire contractors to do it.

All gates are covered by contractors as well.....

I know that for the above to correct due to the fact one of my neighbors is the DPM for one of the local bases out here....and that's what the entire area does (at least Army wise).......

Paul554
01-01-2008, 06:02 PM
Well there seems to be some basic misconceptions going on with the basics of being a DA (department of Army) Cop. I’ll try to give me brief view point as a DA Cop on a large installation (Ft Lewis) who has a little experience.

First off I am classified under the 0083 series as a police officer as all DA Cops are. The 0085 series is security guards and they do serve a different function that is not LE. Now that being said I know most people don’t consider DA cops to be true LE either. Heck even according to O.com I’m not a sworn officer :D Now that being said I’ve been in several purists and foot pursuits. Arrested people for Felony and Misdemeanor crimes from everything to vehicle theft and meth possession to DWLS. On average the majority of us deal with crimes and events similar to that of a same sized police department.
Some things we do are different though. We do not have statutory power of arrest. This is a big one for me and I feel holds us back a lot. The reason we don’t though is mainly due to the posse comatatus (sp?) act which prohibits military law from being enforced on the populous. We are fighting for this to change though as the DA Police department becomes stronger.
We also do deal with military personnel and do report to a degree to them. This really doesn’t affect us thanks to our union though and as long as we are cordial to the army side they return the favor. Heck we lost a Post Commander here due to a DA Cop arresting him for DUI one night!
Take home guns and cars are a distant pipe dream of the future as well. One again posse comitatous bites us in the behind.

Moving on to some good things though! We have great equipment for a department of our size. To include undercover cars, new impalas, new fully marked off road vehicles to include a F150, Dodge Dakota, numerous Jeeps and some kick butt ATV’s with lights and sirens. Most of our vehicles are equipped with the stalker Dual Radar system and we several handheld radars and lidars as well. We also get a good selection of Army style training and equipment as well provided to us.
Now for pay I will admit as a GS-6 starting off you won’t be the richest person out there. Though with locality pay, a new special form of LE pay our union got us, retention pay, and night and weekend shift pay you can make some good money. Out here in Washington I make close to the same as any new hire would to a local PD.

Well guys I hope that clears up a few things with the DA police. There is still a LOT I could go on and on about so if anyone has any other questions just feel free to ask or send me a PM. Stay safe everyone and happy new years.

Woofdog
01-01-2008, 07:47 PM
WOOFDOG:

I think you are a little off here, most cilivian cops on a post are in the series of 0085 (security guard) with very few in the 0083 series (police officer). Most of it is based on the grade from what I have seen, lower grades are 0085's and 6 or 7's are the 0083's.

Second the LESO act requires you to to be classified as a federal law enforcement officer as such the 0085 series would not qualify:

`Sec. 926B. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified law enforcement officers
`(a) Notwithstanding any other provision of the law of any State or any political subdivision thereof, an individual who is a qualified law enforcement officer and who is carrying the identification required by subsection (d) may carry a concealed firearm that has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, subject to subsection (b).
`(b) This section shall not be construed to supersede or limit the laws of any State that--
`(1) permit private persons or entities to prohibit or restrict the possession
of concealed firearms on their property; or
`(2) prohibit or restrict the possession of firearms on any State or local
government property, installation, building, base, or park.
`(c) As used in this section, the term `qualified law enforcement officer' means an employee of a governmental agency who--
`(1) is authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention,
detection, investigation, or prosecution of, or the incarceration of any
person for, any violation of law, and has statutory powers of arrest;
`(2) is authorized by the agency to carry a firearm;
`(3) is not the subject of any disciplinary action by the agency;
`(4) meets standards, if any, established by the agency which require the
employee to regularly qualify in the use of a firearm;
`(5) is not under the influence of alcohol or another intoxicating or
hallucinatory drug or substance; and
`(6) is not prohibited by Federal law from receiving a firearm.
`(d) The identification required by this subsection is the photographic
identification issued by the governmental agency for which the individual is
employed as a law enforcement officer.



OK, I'll bite.

Please be specific on exactly HOW my posting was "a little off," and we'll discuss.

Paul554
01-01-2008, 07:54 PM
WOOFDOG:



Second the LESO act requires you to to be classified as a federal law enforcement officer as such the 0085 series would not qualify:

`Sec. 926B. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified law enforcement officers
`(a) Notwithstanding any other provision of the law of any State or any political subdivision thereof, an individual who is a qualified law enforcement officer and who is carrying the identification required by subsection (d) may carry a concealed firearm that has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce, subject to subsection (b).
`(b) This section shall not be construed to supersede or limit the laws of any State that--
`(1) permit private persons or entities to prohibit or restrict the possession
of concealed firearms on their property; or
`(2) prohibit or restrict the possession of firearms on any State or local
government property, installation, building, base, or park.
`(c) As used in this section, the term `qualified law enforcement officer' means an employee of a governmental agency who--
`(1) is authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention,
detection, investigation, or prosecution of, or the incarceration of any
person for, any violation of law, and has statutory powers of arrest;
`(2) is authorized by the agency to carry a firearm;
`(3) is not the subject of any disciplinary action by the agency;
`(4) meets standards, if any, established by the agency which require the
employee to regularly qualify in the use of a firearm;
`(5) is not under the influence of alcohol or another intoxicating or
hallucinatory drug or substance; and
`(6) is not prohibited by Federal law from receiving a firearm.
`(d) The identification required by this subsection is the photographic
identification issued by the governmental agency for which the individual is
employed as a law enforcement officer.

ICE Offcr, i wish i could say we in the 0083 series fell under this but we do not. We meet all the standards EXCEPT statutory power of arrest.

ICE Offcr
01-01-2008, 11:06 PM
Again, I can only go off of what knowledge I have, Homestead ARB has all 0085's with the higher grades as 0083's.

Why do you not have statutory arrest powers? Who makes the arrest?

Unit453
01-01-2008, 11:08 PM
I dont know where you get that most base police agencies are 0085's...85's are security, plain and simple. 83's are police, cut and dry.

Paul554
01-01-2008, 11:12 PM
This is an odd bit with statutory arrest powers and what not. We have powers of arrest but not statutory arrest powers. This means we can arrest and then release an individual once we are done citing them either on their own or to other authorities. Now this gets weird at times because we can check people into local jails for warrents or even request a marshal hold be put on violent offenders. Though it takes literally an act of god for that to occur!

Honestly if you ask me DA police will have all the powers of normal LE within the next 10 years. Like we say were always 10 years behind with common sense ;)

Unit453
01-01-2008, 11:32 PM
Also, it still depends on the state you work in. Some agencies are taught state courses by state instructors, which in turn gives them state certification. Also, if the individual state they reside in recognizes DA or DoD as an acredited agency, each individual now has certain powers of peace or police officers in the state's eyes. You just gotta have a good backing leadership that works for you administratively.

Unit453
01-01-2008, 11:54 PM
Again, I can only go off of what knowledge I have, Homestead ARB has all 0085's with the higher grades as 0083's.

Why do you not have statutory arrest powers? Who makes the arrest?

Basically because the Defense Department is broken and has no idea how to manage their civilian employees, especially their police.

And I believe the word is "apprehension" of what DoD fall under. Just different laws governing different agencies.

Woofdog
01-02-2008, 09:38 AM
This is an odd bit with statutory arrest powers and what not. We have powers of arrest but not statutory arrest powers. This means we can arrest and then release an individual once we are done citing them either on their own or to other authorities. Now this gets weird at times because we can check people into local jails for warrents or even request a marshal hold be put on violent offenders. Though it takes literally an act of god for that to occur!

Honestly if you ask me DA police will have all the powers of normal LE within the next 10 years. Like we say were always 10 years behind with common sense ;)


The reason is that DoD & DoA civilian police officers ultimately report to a military officer, the base commander. Regardless if they have a civilian Chief or of a Provost Marshal.

Civilian DoD/DoA cops, just like military MP's, have the authority to apprehend, detain and process a suspect, but after a reasonable period of processing time, must release him OR. In case of a serious offense, a suspect has to be turned over to a civilian DCIO or other federal agent, or a US Marshal with statutory powers of arrest.

Civilian DoD/DoA cops, just like military MP's, can "apprehend" a military suspect under the UCMJ, and turn him over to his command representative.

Civilian DoD/DoA cops, just like military MP's, don't have the authority to arrest and take an individual to jail. There is NO federal statute of law giving them that authority. It would take an act of Congress to enact such a statute.

irishlad2nv
01-02-2008, 10:52 AM
Again, I can only go off of what knowledge I have, Homestead ARB has all 0085's with the higher grades as 0083's.

Why do you not have statutory arrest powers? Who makes the arrest?

The Air Force is running a little slow compared to the Army, Navy and Marine Corp bases with getting their Civilian Police on board. The Navy even has 0083's in Bahrain, Army in Germany. I am sure what you are seeing is 0085, Security Guards and they may have higher pay grade 0083 only because they have not yet started placing/hiring 0083 Police Officers to work. Some Navy bases only start their Police Officer's at GS-4.

orlandofed5-0
01-02-2008, 11:43 AM
ICE offc.. I do not know where you got your info but the DoD officers at Homestead ARB are now GS 0083 police officer series. They were until 2002-2003 GS0085 security guards at the 5/6 grade level. Only the Air force cops who are Air Reserve Technicians (ARTS) are still considered GS-0085 series. However they do hold police authority as that is derived from the CO of the base and from being military police officers.

Unit453
01-02-2008, 11:45 AM
This is true. But also, it depends on the state in which you are working in. Here at Ft Drum, we have statute powers of arrest and are considered "peace" officers within the state's eyes. We have the exactly the same authority as FBI, DEA, Customs, Border Patrol and ATF within the state of New York. Under the penal law, all federal agencies are lumped into one category and we fall into that. I'm currently working as a GS-8. We're always hurtin for people too.

Most Army installations did the transition from "green" to "blue" in 2004. I've seen random Air Force bases posting job opportunities. Marine Corps is hiring out the *** currently.

Ive personally never seen "oh 85's" on the gates. All I've ever seen were contract security.

Woofdog
01-02-2008, 11:56 AM
This is true. But also, it depends on the state in which you are working in. Here at Ft Drum, we have statute powers of arrest and are considered "peace" officers within the state's eyes. We have the exactly the same authority as FBI, DEA, Customs, Border Patrol and ATF within the state of New York. Under the penal law, all federal agencies are lumped into one category and we fall into that. I'm currently working as a GS-8. We're always hurtin for people too.

Most Army installations did the transition from "green" to "blue" in 2004. I've seen random Air Force bases posting job opportunities. Marine Corps is hiring out the *** currently.

Ive personally never seen "oh 85's" on the gates. All I've ever seen were contract security.



The state of NY may consider you a "peace officer," but under DoD regulations, you still DO NOT have statutory powers of arrest. Check with DoD IG: State "deputation" of DoD/DoA civilian and military LE personnel is not allowed. The only legitimate authority you have is that given by the UCMJ and DoD/DoA regulations, and none of those give you any statutory powers of arrest. Unfortunately, you are not covered under the federal law giving LE officers with statutory powers of arrest, and cannot LEGALLY carry a weapon concealed nationwide under HR218.

ice_fog
01-02-2008, 01:06 PM
...... Unfortunately, you are not covered under the federal law giving LE officers with statutory powers of arrest, and cannot LEGALLY carry a weapon concealed nationwide under HR218.
sad but true
Sign the petition lets get this thing going again and make the change.
http://www.petitiononline.com/LEOEA/

fedguy889
01-02-2008, 04:20 PM
The state of NY may consider you a "peace officer," but under DoD regulations, you still DO NOT have statutory powers of arrest. Check with DoD IG: State "deputation" of DoD/DoA civilian and military LE personnel is not allowed. The only legitimate authority you have is that given by the UCMJ and DoD/DoA regulations, and none of those give you any statutory powers of arrest. Unfortunately, you are not covered under the federal law giving LE officers with statutory powers of arrest, and cannot LEGALLY carry a weapon concealed nationwide under HR218.

Yep you are completely correct.

fedguy889
01-02-2008, 04:25 PM
sad but true
Sign the petition lets get this thing going again and make the change.
http://www.petitiononline.com/LEOEA/

Your link doesnt work. Try this one:

http://www.petitiononline.com/LEOEA/petition.html

Unit453
01-02-2008, 04:35 PM
Correct. Many of us work in outside agencies to maintain our state cert so under that pretense, we're covered.

Like I said, DoD is broken and that petition really needs to go through. I say that because most of us care but everyone's still seeking outside employment just to get away from the b.s.

Unit453
01-02-2008, 05:18 PM
Whats the deal with that petition anyways? I've seen that a few years ago. Where is it today? Who's heading this up? Is there a number of signatures it requires?

ice_fog
01-02-2008, 06:18 PM
Whats the deal with that petition anyways? I've seen that a few years ago. Where is it today? Who's heading this up? Is there a number of signatures it requires?

My understanding of it is that the whole act is stalled in congress, was introduced in 2003 and has been stalled in committee ever since, it would be nice since this is an election year that the unions (big money contributors) pull some one to the side and tell the hey might get a vote or two from the members if….
No there is no set number the petition needs it was just a way to show the members of congress and the president it is an issue that people are interested in.

mostly I think it is the AFGE and FOP that are the backers.

LochRaven
01-02-2008, 07:48 PM
Didn't want to start a new thread, hopefully someone in here knows and can tell / PM me...

What's up with the DON Security Specialist / Officer position? It almost seems like an LE position ('Protection of property, people, etc.'), but then the announcement refers to conducting background checks or investigating applicants to the Navy.

Thanks.

Unit453
01-02-2008, 07:52 PM
Sounds like a background investigator.

Whats the pay grade? GS what?

Bearcat357
01-02-2008, 08:00 PM
Didn't want to start a new thread, hopefully someone in here knows and can tell / PM me...

What's up with the DON Security Specialist / Officer position? It almost seems like an LE position ('Protection of property, people, etc.'), but then the announcement refers to conducting background checks or investigating applicants to the Navy.

Thanks.


Those seem an open continous positions.....as the Navy is always advertising for them.... It seems like when they need a person for a particular position at a particular base, they will dig into the files and start reviewing them.....or at least that seems what it looks like to me.....

As for what the job does, it looks like it covers the entire 0080 career field.....which can be AT/FP stuff, Background stuff, OPSEC stuff, Info security, etc..... Some of it is LE....while other isn't........

Bearcat357
01-02-2008, 08:05 PM
Sounds like a background investigator.

Whats the pay grade? GS what?

For all those positions, they list it as GS-5 through 15.....

The positions were/are open for a year....and if they Navy continues to do what they have in the past....they will reopen them for another full year....

As stated in my above post, it looks like they are culling resumes for these jobs and when they have an opening....they will start digging through them and find what they are looking for (OPSEC/PERSEC/AT-FP/etc...) then go from there....

Woffski
01-26-2008, 07:39 PM
Well, I have applied under the USAJOBS site, which directs you to the Navy's Chart site. I met all the time requirements, submitted all by 1st cutoff date, and still have not heard anything!!!!

MPSoldier84
01-26-2008, 10:19 PM
[QUOTE=Unit453;1047079]
Blotterjock, GS8/9 are good gigs but there are patrolman as GS6's who can make upwards of 50k on certain installations. I know GS7's who cleared over 60k this year. Just depends on how much and what hours you work.
[QUOTE]

Plenty in admin say that in Fed LEO, the patrolman can make more than them even though they are a lower GS grade. Shift dif, mandatory overtimes, holidays, performance appraisal bonuses, cash awards, and step increases can really put some major cash in your pocket. Best bet is to add 15-20percent onto a base salary. Also don't forget that almost every year you get a COLA increase. We got a 3.5% increase this year.

Woffski
02-15-2008, 03:33 PM
Anyone here apply for the Camp Lejeune Police? :confused:

SergeantJay
03-14-2008, 09:16 AM
What is a Civilian Military Police? I've never heard of such a thing.

Unit453
03-14-2008, 11:39 AM
I know...Either or...

Bearcat357
03-14-2008, 12:53 PM
What is a Civilian Military Police? I've never heard of such a thing.

The Army (along with the other services) have hired...and/or in the process of highering Dept. of the Army civilian Police Officers to fill in for all the MPs that are deployed......