Border Patrol Agent vs. CBP Officer

[HokieBird]

What are the advantages and disadvantages of each?

Have any of you worked for both groups? If so, I'd be curious to hear your experiences.

[madchiken]

What are the advantages and disadvantages of each?

Have any of you worked for both groups? If so, I'd be curious to hear your experiences.

Did you see this thread? (http://forums.officer.com/showpost.php?p=972947&postcount=1)

[toughmommy]

Hello Hokiebird!

Both agencies have the same end desire and that is to protect this country from terrorists and to keep the illegal drugs from crossing our borders. The main difference, which I am sure you have read from the posts as well as if you visit the cbp.gov web site is that you will get a 6c rating with BP and not with CBP (as of yet but I have a feeling 6c will be given to CBP soon, which is well deserved because CBP are officers just as anyone else). This means that you can get early retirement and you do get more of a pension. Another aspect which individuals are trying to note in the forums is that BP receives a much higher pay rate. This is actually not true. With BP you start off higher but that is because they can add up to 10 hours a week to your shift at a rate of 25%. With CBP, any overtime you work is paid at double time. Both agencies are great agencies for what their purpose and job is and it depends entirely up to the individual person as to which agency they want to work for. Good luck in your process!!!!

[GB0610]

Here is the biggest difference that the above poster continues to fail to mention.

In the PA, you will PATROL.

With CBP(I) of (O) (however you see it), you will be at a static post.

[Bearcat357]

cbp.gov web site is that you will get a 6c rating with BP and not with CBP (as of yet but I have a feeling 6c will be given to CBP soon, which is well deserved because CBP are officers just as anyone else).

That's not going to happen. It's been made to go away, year after year, no matter who is in charge of Congress or the WH....

If they do it for CBP....then they will have to do it for the rest of the Gov....and they aren't going to do that....way too much money.....

Sucks..? Yeap....but thats how things work...

[FmrHammerMonkey]

That's not going to happen. It's been made to go away, year after year, no matter who is in charge of Congress or the WH....

If they do it for CBP....then they will have to do it for the rest of the Gov....and they aren't going to do that....way too much money.....

Sucks..? Yeap....but thats how things work...

+1

That is why CBP stands for "Can't Be Proactive" or "Call Border Patrol"

My all time favorite...."Confused But Paid":D

[toughmommy]

That's just sad! CBP don't run all over the place but they still patrol. I would never trash BP! I think BP is another wonderful part of our government in fighting terrorism and drugs but it is not for everybody. How can you say the men and women of the CBP are not as worthy as the Border Patrol? Just sad! And it is not that I continue to fail to mention "patrol". CBP does the same thing, they are just stationary. I think every law enforcement agency in our country is a great agency because we are after a common cause. Sad!

HokieBird...ultimately you are the ending deciding factor of what agency you decide to go with. Whatever that may be...GOOD LUCK TO YOU!

[toughmommy]

For crying out loud...HokieBird wanted to know the difference!

[GB0610]

That's just sad! CBP don't run all over the place but they still patrol. I would never trash BP! I think BP is another wonderful part of our government in fighting terrorism and drugs but it is not for everybody. How can you say the men and women of the CBP are not as worthy as the Border Patrol? Just sad! And it is not that I continue to fail to mention "patrol". CBP does the same thing, they are just stationary. I think every law enforcement agency in our country is a great agency because we are after a common cause. Sad!

HokieBird...ultimately you are the ending deciding factor of what agency you decide to go with. Whatever that may be...GOOD LUCK TO YOU!

Ok, ok, calm down. Nothing that was said is "just sad". No one is saying that CBP is worthless. As you said, they are simply different types of LE. But as I said, one is much more LE in your typical sense of the term.

Explain to me how CBPO's do the same things as the Patrol if they are stationary? You are making no sense. They are different job descriptions. That's like saying a jail deputy sheriff is the same as a road deputy. They do different jobs! I will also tell you that there are MANY people that work for CBP that do NOT view themselves as LEOs. They are auditors with guns on, by their own choice. MANY would NEVER make is as PA's.

From experience, Patrol work is much more difficult with many more nuances(sp?) than working at a stationary post. I have done both. One takes a lot more common sense and inate ability........hence the reason why the standars for employment are different and why one type of training is that much more in depth.

I know you only want to defend your husbands, my former and your future line of work. But you need to face the reality and not suggest to a poster that the job of a PA and CBPO are one in the same in any sense.

[toughmommy]

Now I am offended. It takes common sense to really listen to what I am saying and hence the lack thereof.

CBP and BP are underneath an agency that is defending our country from terrorists and drugs. That is what I was trying to get across from my earlier posts! As far as the similarities as being stationary and mobile, LE's have done both! LE's have stood on the gates of our military bases and did their job just the same as an SP standing and guarding a plane. One is mobile and one is not. Don't preach to me about the jobs being different. I am not trying to defend my hubby's job, my future job, or any other CBP. I am just simply stating a fact in that CBP and BP are both law enforcement agencies in that protecting our country is our upmost concern.

Now back to HokieBird...I hope you have any understanding of the differences between the two agencies. BP has a 6c rating, they are mobile, and a very good agency to work for if that is what your goal is to become. CBP does not have a 6c rating, they are stationary at what they do unless you are a K-9 in which case you will mobile while checking boxes and cargo, etc. for drugs, and a very good agency to work for if that is what your goal is to become.

Good luck to you in your endeavors!!

[GB0610]

Great. You told us they are under the same department. That's all you've now contributed to the conversation. Everything else in your last post came from someone else. Nothing you said answered any questions for the orginal poster.

Thanks. We are all now more the wiser.

[toughmommy]

LOL Anywho...

HokieBird if you need anymore information other than what is on the board, just ask! I have a BP friend who is unfortunately stationed on a sector where he doesn't move around and complains and my husband does move around with his K-9 and is happy. Someone is always going to not be happy with their job and move, good for them! If they don't, well I guess they're not unhappy enough!

I can go on all day and night GB0610...

[formerNOPD]

That's not going to happen. It's been made to go away, year after year, no matter who is in charge of Congress or the WH....

If they do it for CBP....then they will have to do it for the rest of the Gov....and they aren't going to do that....way too much money.....

Sucks..? Yeap....but thats how things work...

Did you get the memo?

http://forums.officer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64379


It's going to happen.

[Bearcat357]

Did you get the memo?

http://forums.officer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64379


It's going to happen.


Saw it....It's been stuck in the Senate since May having been read twice before the DHS Committe with no further actions taken.... and Bush has publically stated he will veto it.....

[formerNOPD]

Ok, ok, calm down. Nothing that was said is "just sad". No one is saying that CBP is worthless. As you said, they are simply different types of LE. But as I said, one is much more LE in your typical sense of the term.

Explain to me how CBPO's do the same things as the Patrol if they are stationary? You are making no sense. They are different job descriptions. That's like saying a jail deputy sheriff is the same as a road deputy. They do different jobs! I will also tell you that there are MANY people that work for CBP that do NOT view themselves as LEOs. They are auditors with guns on, by their own choice. MANY would NEVER make is as PA's.

From experience, Patrol work is much more difficult with many more nuances(sp?) than working at a stationary post. I have done both. One takes a lot more common sense and inate ability........hence the reason why the standars for employment are different and why one type of training is that much more in depth.

I know you only want to defend your husbands, my former and your future line of work. But you need to face the reality and not suggest to a poster that the job of a PA and CBPO are one in the same in any sense.


That's a mighty broad brush you paint CBP with considering that you state you've "done both" jobs. You're comparing apples to oranges. Each has its good and bad extremes. To suggest that it's easier to be a CBP Officer on a primary line versus a PA is an unfair comparison, as they do differant jobs. I worked with both CBP officers and PAs in Iraq, and let me tell you that it was not the PAs getting things done over there. They were running around playing soldier and sucking up to the military in typical fashion. Anyone can get in a car and sit on a red X in the middle of the desert, chase down illegals and cuff them...lol. Many CBP officers are prior LE as well, myself included, and I can tell you that my observations of BP is that they are no more "LE" than CBP is. 6c is going to happen, so we'll see come this summer.
The "auditer" mentality is there with some officers, however there are more CBP officers than PAs so that is no surprise. CBP is Inspections that started out unarmed, gradually went armed and now is what it is. A gradual change to a more "Officer" role. Neither is better than the other, they are differant.
If you want "Police excitement" you need to be the police - City, County, State - Not in any position within CBP - BP or CBP.

The only thing I've found a surplus of with Border Patrol is attitudes and egos. Hell I alone outperformed 3 SRT guys on the range and would have beat the last one too had I not been worn out from the training during our Iraq training. This BP versus OFO attitude does the agency no good. If the BP is doing such a steller job, why the hell is the country over run with illegals? lol! Sucks being sucker punched like that eh?

[formerNOPD]

Saw it....It's been stuck in the Senate since May having been read twice before the DHS Committe with no further actions taken.... and Bush has publically stated he will veto it.....

We'll see this summer won't we? ;)

[Bearcat357]

We'll see this summer won't we? ;)

Don't get me wrong...I hope you'all get it....but it's going to cost a ton of money to do it.....and he's said he will veto the entire bill if that's still attached to it....

So, that's why I won't count on anything till it gets signed into law.....

[deyosurf19]

So,,,,, are all you guys saying that if I am assigned at the port of Long Beach as a CBPO, that I will not be inspecting containers and boarding ships and such???

If that is true, I think I applied for a very different position than originally thought...

[qixfeet]

From what we were told, the union expects Bush to veto. They're banking on having enough votes in the senate to over ride the veto.

[Bearcat357]

From what we were told, the union expects Bush to veto. They're banking on having enough votes in the senate to over ride the veto.

Good luck to them....as it will be something the Dems support....not the Repubs....as Dems tend to support Unions.....and that's where this is going to head.....

[madchiken]

Maybe they'll pass that journeyman 13's for BP bill while they're at it...

[toughmommy]

Thanks "formerNOPD", "qixfeet" for the info!!!!

[ArmouredSainT]

Can't we all just...get along??? :cool:

[toughmommy]

Can't we all just...get along??? :cool:

That is funny you mention that!!! For some reason CBP and BP do not mesh well together. Why???!!! Beats me!!!

My husband went to through the IFI course back in June and was there until August. He told me while he was in the school, the BP swarmed around each other but never intermingled with the CBP and vice versa. He told me that it's always been that way. Once again...why? Couldn't tell ya!

[qixfeet]

I've met a couple of BP guys and they seem pretty cool to me. We do different jobs. They know it, we know it. People naturally tend to hang with their own. I wouldn't say that BPA's and CBPO's don't mesh.

[toughmommy]

True...I know a few BP guys too!

[FmrHammerMonkey]

All that hoorah bs of the academy will run off eventually. BP and CBP are actually kissing cousins after you get some years on the job and realize that your both in the same DHS.

I have yet to have a bad interaction with a BPA ever, and that is coming from having worked both the southern and northern borders. I think most of you are touching on the FLETC warrior syndrome, where niether side has done squat in the real world yet, but think one is better than the other.
Out in the field, that is a mute point really. Go to work, do your job, and come home. End of story.

[formerNOPD]

FYI - Just received this today:


December 17, 2007

MEMORANDUM


TO: CBP Chapter Presidents and CBP Legislative Coordinators

RE: LEO Provisions in FY 2008 Omnibus Spending Bill

SUMMARY: The House and Senate have negotiated an omnibus spending bill that includes LEO provisions for CBPOs. Prospects for passage and the President’s signature are still uncertain.


The omnibus spending bill to be acted on this week in the House and Senate includes a new Section 535 that provides a modified Law Enforcement Officer (LEO) retirement benefit to all Customs and Border Protection Officers (CBPOs) prospectively beginning July 2008. If enacted, Section 535 will grant a retirement enhancement for those current CBPOs who will not be able to serve 20 years under the standard LEO system and be at an age to retire early.

If enacted, Section 535 ensures that:

• Premium and overtime pay coverage is not affected. Half of yearly overtime pay will continue to be included in calculating the CBPO’s high-three salary.

• All current CBPOs who elect the new coverage will find their contribution to retirement increased by .5% and will receive a more generous LEO pension from July 2008 forward.

• Mandatory LEO retirement age of 57 years would be waived for all current CBPOs. All CBPOs hired after July 2008 would be subject to mandatory retirement at 57 years.

• The current Federal Employees Retirement System’s and Civil Service Retirement System’s age and service requirements would apply for those who meet those requirements before serving 20 years post July 2008. CBPOs will be eligible to retire after 20 years of post-July 2008 service at age 50 or 25 years of post-July 2008 service at any age.

The omnibus spending bill provides funding for the hiring of an additional 400 CBPOs in FY 2008. This past year, CBP developed a Workload Staffing Model (WSM) to generate estimates of staffing needed at the ports of entry to meet workload and mission requirements. CBP is directed to brief the Committees on Appropriations not later than January 31, 2008, on how it is using “the WSM to improve staffing resources to reduce airport and land port wait times, and to enhance performance in meeting customs revenue collection responsibilities.”

The omnibus spending bill also includes funding for the Office of Chief Human Capital Officer, but “[N]o funding is provided for MaxHR or any follow-on personnel system. Instead, $10,000,000 is provided to address the Department’s dismal results in the 2006 Federal Human Capital Survey.”

Also, as part of the omnibus spending bill, the Transportation Security Administration (TSA) is directed to submit a report to Congress on the implementation of the Performance Accountability and Standards System (PASS). The report must include: the number of employees who achieved each level of performance; a comparison between managers and nonmanagers relating to performance and pay increases; the type and amount of all pay increases that have taken effect for each level of performance; and, the attrition rate of employees covered by PASS. The bill also directs TSA to start a pilot program at seven airports which will require the screening of all airport employees for a 90-day trial period, after which the program will be assessed.

I will keep you posted on action on the FY 2008 omnibus spending bill as it moves through Congress this week. If you have any questions, please contact Jean Hutter in the Legislation Department at 202.572.5500, ext. 7021.




Colleen M. Kelley
National President

[GB0610]

So,,,,, are all you guys saying that if I am assigned at the port of Long Beach as a CBPO, that I will not be inspecting containers and boarding ships and such???

If that is true, I think I applied for a very different position than originally thought...

It all depends on which team you are ultimately assigned to. You will spend the first few months roatating through most sections in an FTO (very liberal term for what it is) of sorts. After that you will "likely" be assigned to the Radiation Portal Monitors where you will sit and wait for an alarm to go off (opsec which I won't go into here) but still, a job a monkey could do, or CET, x-raying containers out on the terminal and opening boxes in the warehouse (almost as bad as the RPM's).

There are other units.....in the Marina Section you will do vessal boardings. You may ultimately get the MET team where you will be opening boxes looking for counterfeit merch or you may get assigned to a targeting team (there are a couple, some worse than others).

I will tell you that it is a place where you will be out in the fresh air, as aposed to working in an airport enviornment. But its nothing like working at a land border where you will get your hands dirty, for lack of a better term.

[GB0610]

That's a mighty broad brush you paint CBP with considering that you state you've "done both" jobs. You're comparing apples to oranges. Each has its good and bad extremes. To suggest that it's easier to be a CBP Officer on a primary line versus a PA is an unfair comparison, as they do differant jobs.



If you want "Police excitement" you need to be the police - City, County, State - Not in any position within CBP - BP or CBP.




To address your points...

I have said in all of my prior posts that they are different jobs. You didn't tell me anything I didn't already know and state. But a comparison can still be made using a little logic. All I will say is that it takes a different skill or ability to perform a traffic stop than it does to operate an VACIS or interview someone at an airport coming in from overseas. (Land border is another animal which I feel is open to debate)

I agree completely with your second point quoted above. But you will find more of it with the BP.

And lastly, I am in no way saying you weren't/aren't high speed (prior job, Iraq) or that all PA's are your all American heros. SO i'm not really sure how stating the points you did made any impact on your posts about the differences between the two agencies.
(And if you are who I think you are (" NOPD Doors open crew"), I am going to come down Harbor Freeway one day and tickle you to death ;) )

[DOAcop38]

Good luck to them....as it will be something the Dems support....not the Repubs....as Dems tend to support Unions.....and that's where this is going to head.....

funny that- the repubs claim to be soo tough on "crime" and superior on their view of national security,YET they conveniently don't want to support the working guys who do the job( in terms of pay raises,benefit support,authority and statsu support):rolleyes; I personally don't think it should be a question of which party supports or doesn't support it,but rather a logically push forward for whats "fair and right". on the local level my dept went thru something similar with LAPD . LAPD falsely and hypocritically did everything it could to stop negotiations for broader authority and blocked certain retirement and benefits rights we had gotten local gov't to endorse( they even went to other state L.E. legislators and police associations); the sad part for us is that we do the same work as they do and face the same issues.As far as CPB and BP are concerned ,i see the CPB all day in somewhat less hazardous locales,but when they strap on a gun and go out to check on something locally they run into potential threats just like anyone else...

[Bearcat357]

funny that- the repubs claim to be soo tough on "crime" and superior on their view of national security,YET they conveniently don't want to support the working guys who do the job( in terms of pay raises,benefit support,authority and statsu support):rolleyes; I personally don't think it should be a question of which party supports or doesn't support it,but rather a logically push forward for whats "fair and right". on the local level my dept went thru something similar with LAPD . LAPD falsely and hypocritically did everything it could to stop negotiations for broader authority and blocked certain retirement and benefits rights we had gotten local gov't to endorse( they even went to other state L.E. legislators and police associations); the sad part for us is that we do the same work as they do and face the same issues.As far as CPB and BP are concerned ,i see the CPB all day in somewhat less hazardous locales,but when they strap on a gun and go out to check on something locally they run into potential threats just like anyone else...

A. I've never, ever worked under a Union. MO doesn't allow them.... If you join the FOP....it's for cheap liability insurance and a place to drink.....so when it comes to the whole Union thing....I don't get it as I have never been in one....nor have I had one represent me.

B. I've never said that they (or any other Uniformed Federal LE Agency) shouldn't get coverage......I have said, however, due to costs, it isn't going to happen anytime soon....if ever. Both parties have not signed anything into law...so it's not just the Repubs. Not sure what the "wait til summer" thing means as W will still be in office til Jan 09 and he has flatout said he's not going to sign it......It wont' be till Mid 09 before it gets looked at again..... Hell, the damn thing has been stuck in committe since May of this year and hasn't moved......

Not trying to argue with you....just clarifying things....

[GoldBadge]

FYI - Just received this today:


December 17, 2007

MEMORANDUM


TO: CBP Chapter Presidents and CBP Legislative Coordinators

RE: LEO Provisions in FY 2008 Omnibus Spending Bill

SUMMARY: The House and Senate have negotiated an omnibus spending bill that includes LEO provisions for CBPOs. Prospects for passage and the President’s signature are still uncertain.


The omnibus spending bill to be acted on this week in the House and Senate includes a new Section 535 that provides a modified Law Enforcement Officer (LEO) retirement benefit to all Customs and Border Protection Officers (CBPOs) prospectively beginning July 2008. If enacted, Section 535 will grant a retirement enhancement for those current CBPOs who will not be able to serve 20 years under the standard LEO system and be at an age to retire early.

If enacted, Section 535 ensures that:

• Premium and overtime pay coverage is not affected. Half of yearly overtime pay will continue to be included in calculating the CBPO’s high-three salary.

• All current CBPOs who elect the new coverage will find their contribution to retirement increased by .5% and will receive a more generous LEO pension from July 2008 forward.

• Mandatory LEO retirement age of 57 years would be waived for all current CBPOs. All CBPOs hired after July 2008 would be subject to mandatory retirement at 57 years.

• The current Federal Employees Retirement System’s and Civil Service Retirement System’s age and service requirements would apply for those who meet those requirements before serving 20 years post July 2008. CBPOs will be eligible to retire after 20 years of post-July 2008 service at age 50 or 25 years of post-July 2008 service at any age.

The omnibus spending bill provides funding for the hiring of an additional 400 CBPOs in FY 2008. This past year, CBP developed a Workload Staffing Model (WSM) to generate estimates of staffing needed at the ports of entry to meet workload and mission requirements. CBP is directed to brief the Committees on Appropriations not later than January 31, 2008, on how it is using “the WSM to improve staffing resources to reduce airport and land port wait times, and to enhance performance in meeting customs revenue collection responsibilities.”

The omnibus spending bill also includes funding for the Office of Chief Human Capital Officer, but “[N]o funding is provided for MaxHR or any follow-on personnel system. Instead, $10,000,000 is provided to address the Department’s dismal results in the 2006 Federal Human Capital Survey.”

Also, as part of the omnibus spending bill, the Transportation Security Administration (TSA) is directed to submit a report to Congress on the implementation of the Performance Accountability and Standards System (PASS). The report must include: the number of employees who achieved each level of performance; a comparison between managers and nonmanagers relating to performance and pay increases; the type and amount of all pay increases that have taken effect for each level of performance; and, the attrition rate of employees covered by PASS. The bill also directs TSA to start a pilot program at seven airports which will require the screening of all airport employees for a 90-day trial period, after which the program will be assessed.

I will keep you posted on action on the FY 2008 omnibus spending bill as it moves through Congress this week. If you have any questions, please contact Jean Hutter in the Legislation Department at 202.572.5500, ext. 7021.




Colleen M. Kelley
National President



Guys/Gals, this is BIG news. This means that CBP officers will finally be covered under 6c. I hear the spending bill stands an excellent chance at passage.

[formerNOPD]

To address your points...

I have said in all of my prior posts that they are different jobs. You didn't tell me anything I didn't already know and state. But a comparison can still be made using a little logic. All I will say is that it takes a different skill or ability to perform a traffic stop than it does to operate an VACIS or interview someone at an airport coming in from overseas. (Land border is another animal which I feel is open to debate)

I agree completely with your second point quoted above. But you will find more of it with the BP.

And lastly, I am in no way saying you weren't/aren't high speed (prior job, Iraq) or that all PA's are your all American heros. SO i'm not really sure how stating the points you did made any impact on your posts about the differences between the two agencies.
(And if you are who I think you are (" NOPD Doors open crew"), I am going to come down Harbor Freeway one day and tickle you to death ;) )


What I was pointing out is that both agencies are full of people with all kinds of backgrounds, and I fail to see how sitting on a X in the middle of the desert is any more "LE" than boarding a ship and searching for drugs, finding them and making an arrest because of it.

I simply used my background as an example. At our port we have a lot of prior LE, a navy seal, lots of army/marines etc. CBP now has several SRT teams, something that 2 years ago people said would never happen either. They're here and there are going to be more teams like this coming.

6c is going to happen too. I just get tired of the same old people poo poo'ing the idea everytime it gets on the table. I call and write my senators and representative EVERY MONTH to push 6c. If it means anything to you, you should do the same.

As for your last sentence, not sure what you mean by it. I worked for NOPD for 3.5 years and moved on to another department before taking the job with customs.

[formerNOPD]

A. I've never, ever worked under a Union. MO doesn't allow them.... If you join the FOP....it's for cheap liability insurance and a place to drink.....so when it comes to the whole Union thing....I don't get it as I have never been in one....nor have I had one represent me.

B. I've never said that they (or any other Uniformed Federal LE Agency) shouldn't get coverage......I have said, however, due to costs, it isn't going to happen anytime soon....if ever. Both parties have not signed anything into law...so it's not just the Repubs. Not sure what the "wait til summer" thing means as W will still be in office til Jan 09 and he has flatout said he's not going to sign it......It wont' be till Mid 09 before it gets looked at again..... Hell, the damn thing has been stuck in committe since May of this year and hasn't moved......

Not trying to argue with you....just clarifying things....


Did you get the memo?
;)
Summer session of congress, W will sign it.

[GoldBadge]

6c is going to happen too. I just get tired of the same old people poo poo'ing the idea everytime it gets on the table.

To be honest with you, promises of Customs Inspectors/CBP officers being covered under 6c has been talked about for many years, with any legislation drifting into oblivion. It's only this year does it appear that 6c coverage will really happen.

[formerNOPD]

To be honest with you, promises of Customs Inspectors/CBP officers being covered under 6c has been talked about for many years, with any legislation drifting into oblivion. It's only this year does it appear that 6c coverage will really happen.


True, but before there were other factors -
No "Officers", no DHS, no war on terror etc.

Have you called your senators and congresscritters to fight for this as well?
Regards,
fmr

[Bearcat357]

Did you get the memo?
;)
Summer session of congress, W will sign it.

Saw the memo.....didn't see anywhere in it that W. will sign it.....as he's stated publicly several times that he won't....

Could that change...? Perhaps....but as I've said before....I won't believe it till I see it......

[Luko]

http://appropriations.house.gov/pdf/HomelandOmnibus.pdf

As it stands, there is $50 Million in the budget to bring CBPO into 6c. The President stated that he would sign the budget as it was sent back to the House. That is what was sent back to the House so they will get 6c coming July 2008. Congress put funding for the war in with the budgets so he'll have to back it if he wants the funds.

But, I wonder how this will affect the money that CBPO's make currently. Wouldn't they now be held under Act 45 like IEA's? Won't they also fall under AUO? Could mean no more straight double time anymore....

[formerNOPD]

http://appropriations.house.gov/pdf/HomelandOmnibus.pdf

As it stands, there is $50 Million in the budget to bring CBPO into 6c. The President stated that he would sign the budget as it was sent back to the House. That is what was sent back to the House so they will get 6c coming July 2008. Congress put funding for the war in with the budgets so he'll have to back it if he wants the funds.

But, I wonder how this will affect the money that CBPO's make currently. Wouldn't they now be held under Act 45 like IEA's? Won't they also fall under AUO? Could mean no more straight double time anymore....


No, won't affect CBP - they fall under COPRA still, only the retirement portions will affect CBP - we'll go from 1% per year to 1.7% per year, and get the 25 year retirement, as well as the age regulations. 37/57.

[Convo]

Saw the memo.....didn't see anywhere in it that W. will sign it.....as he's stated publicly several times that he won't....

Could that change...? Perhaps....but as I've said before....I won't believe it till I see it......

Done deal! At least that's what my DFO said today.

[formerNOPD]

latest scoop: http://www.nteu.org/PressKits/PressRelease/PressRelease.aspx?ID=1194

[Bearcat357]

Done deal! At least that's what my DFO said today.

Not until W. signs it.....;)

BUT......it looks like he will now since it was tacked on to the entire spending bill....

Congrats.....as if that had been on it's own, it would have never passed.......

[Convo]

Personally I think it's sad it took this long.

[Bearcat357]

Rest of the Federal Uniformed LE Agencies that don't have it should sue now to get it........

[Firebug]

Rest of the Federal Uniformed LE Agencies that don't have it should sue now to get it........

I believe those other Federal Uniformed LE Agencies that aren't covered should be but why should Uniformed CBP officers getting coverage be the trigger for them to sue. CBP officers are not the first Federal Uniformed LE Agencies to receive coverage. Their are several that already have 6C coverage, US Secret Service Uniformed division, US Park Police, US Capital Police, Dept of Interior Law Enforcement Rangers, Fish and Wildlife Law Enforcement Rangers. Heck, every employee of the Bureau of Prisons is covered including the Nurses, Gardeners and Mechanics.

FB

[Bearcat357]

I believe those other Federal Uniformed LE Agencies that aren't covered should be but why should Uniformed CBP officers getting coverage be the trigger for them to sue.

Because it (the new law) sets a new presidence.....

Folks have always argued that CBP weren't real LEOs....and that's why they have never gotten 6c coverage....

They (CBP) have it now....if one tries to say that the Pentagon Cops, Military Base Cops, FBI Cops, etc....are lessor LEOs based on job descriptions (that's always been the hold up) than they are full of it.....

Don't get me wrong....CBP folks do a great job protecting the country from terrorism......but their duties are far from Street Cop duties......

If you are going to give one group coverage....man up and give it to them all.....

Just my opinion......

[qixfeet]

Most federal uniformed officers are not doing work as street cops. That's not what we do and that does not make us less than anyone else. I also believe that all federal uniformed officers should get 6c too.

[Convo]

Because it (the new law) sets a new presidence.....

Folks have always argued that CBP weren't real LEOs....and that's why they have never gotten 6c coverage....

They (CBP) have it now....if one tries to say that the Pentagon Cops, Military Base Cops, FBI Cops, etc....are lessor LEOs based on job descriptions (that's always been the hold up) than they are full of it.....

Don't get me wrong....CBP folks do a great job protecting the country from terrorism......but their duties are far from Street Cop duties......

If you are going to give one group coverage....man up and give it to them all.....

Just my opinion......

Bear do you think CBP deserves 6c? Just curious b/c reading into your words makes me wonder.

The minute you are issued a gun and vest imo you should get 6c. CBP has a lot of dangers just like any other agency. Just b/c they don't actually "patrol" makes it no less dangerous. I could easily argue 6c for CBP.

[Bearcat357]

Bear do you think CBP deserves 6c?

Yes I do....I have never said to the contrary........


The minute you are issued a gun and vest imo you should get 6c. CBP has a lot of dangers just like any other agency. Just b/c they don't actually "patrol" makes it no less dangerous. I could easily argue 6c for CBP.

Yeap......thats why I made the statement that if CBP gets it.....then ALL Federal LEOs should get it....VA, Fed Reserve, Military, FBI, etc.......

[madchiken]

The minute you are issued a gun and vest imo you should get 6c. CBP has a lot of dangers just like any other agency. Just b/c they don't actually "patrol" makes it no less dangerous. I could easily argue 6c for CBP.

So should all the federal security guards get it as well? I'm sure the SRT & SRF security units (yes they have them) deserve 6c more than the mint police or smithsonian police or the many FLEO's that do nothing more than building access control and static security...

[ford123]

I guess they do...

Do they have statuatory arrest authority?

[FmrHammerMonkey]

I still don't see this as a deterrent for the massive losses we have in manpower. CBP needs to wake up and try and keep thier people. Turnover is still way too high for the agency.

Talking with people at work about our impending 6c status has surprised me. Lot's of them still are putting thier pokers out to find different employment despite this coming down the pipe. Me included.

[formerNOPD]

It's a done deal - President signed the bill today - CBP HAS 6c Coverage (LEO Retirement!) Congrats to all who hammered the politicians!

[Bearcat357]

It's a done deal - President signed the bill today - CBP HAS 6c Coverage (LEO Retirement!) Congrats to all who hammered the politicians!

Actually, it should be a congrats to whomever had the nutz to stick it with the entire spending bill....as he would have never signed it alone....

[qixfeet]

The point is that the bill got signed. Does it really matter that it had to be stuck into the entire spending bill. Congrats to CBP and thanks to everyone who supported and pushed for this bill.

[Bearcat357]

Does it really matter that it had to be stuck into the entire spending bill.

To me it does.....as it shows how some folks (like your local Congress folks and the current Administration) think of your job.....and the job of other US Gov Uniformed LEOs that are not covered and should be.......

[qixfeet]

To me it does.....as it shows how some folks (like your local Congress folks and the current Administration) think of your job.....and the job of other US Gov Uniformed LEOs that are not covered and should be.......


We already know how many people think of us, but you gotta take your victories where you can get them.

[formerNOPD]

The bottom line is the squeaky wheel gets the oil. Guess those other services should squeak more.

Like I've said all along, what have you done lately to help it happen?

....

[Bearcat357]

Like I've said all along, what have you done lately to help it happen?

I'm not Uniformed Federal....so it doesn't bother me per say.....BUT....I do address this matter and several others with my Congressman everytime I see him out here or back in the District.....and chat with his staff about it....as I know several of them personally...

What do you do ....???

[formerNOPD]

I'm not Uniformed Federal....so it doesn't bother me per say.....BUT....I do address this matter and several others with my Congressman everytime I see him out here or back in the District.....and chat with his staff about it....as I know several of them personally...

What do you do ....???

Go search my posts and you'll find out what I do, have done and will continue to do.

What's with all the negative waves?

Your profile says you're Federal LEO, so uniformed or non uniformed what's your point?

This consistent negativity leads me to believe you're upset about something...


Date of Birth:
May 7
Are You Employed in the Law Enforcement Industry:
Yes
Law Enforcement Agency:
DHS HQ
Are You a Sworn Police Officer:
Yes
Interests:
College Sports, Military History, target shooting
Years Experience:
20
Occupation:
FLEO
Location:
38° 52′ 15.56″ N /77° 3′ 21.46″ W
How did you find Officer.com?:
google
Biography:
Former Local LEO, Currently a Federal LEO

[Bearcat357]

Sigh....

I posted it to mean....."What do you do to make things right....???" :rolleyes:

I know what you do for a living....Geez.....

I am talking about going to your Congressman....writting letters.....working with your Union...etc.......

Just like you asked me what I had done lately about things....

:rolleyes:

[ford123]

Thanks for your support bear...

Now we can work on the other officers that deserve it.

And of course this will change the "face," of CBP in the future. No more retirees and so forth. But if you give a guy, or gal, a badge and a gun, and tell them to go enforce the law, and be put in harms way, then they deserve to be compensated.

[formerNOPD]

Sigh....

I posted it to mean....."What do you do to make things right....???" :rolleyes:

I know what you do for a living....Geez.....

I am talking about going to your Congressman....writting letters.....working with your Union...etc.......

Just like you asked me what I had done lately about things....

:rolleyes:

Like I said, that has been written numerous times in my posts. I've been writing, calling, emailing and encouraging others to support this since I've learned about the bill in 2005. I repeatedly encourage others here to continue such actions.

Also I was posting what you state you do for a living, not what I do.

That part in bold is from your profile.

Are you uniformed? Non-uniformed? What's your stake in this and why so negative towards this LEO coverage for CBP?

[Bearcat357]

Are you uniformed? Non-uniformed? What's your stake in this and why so negative towards this LEO coverage for CBP?

Non-Uniformed.....1801 series.....and have no stake in this what so ever.....

It just irrites me that you are "Yippee we got it"....and not conerned about other Uniformed, Federal LEOs that should be covered as well.....thats all....

If that bothers you, then that's on you....as there are other folks out there that do more LE related stuff than your agency....

And before you spout, I know plenty of CBP folks that continue to tell me how jacked up your agency is and how the agency is hemoraging folks....even with this happening....and were shocked to get it because even though they wear uniforms/badges/ and all that....don't feel like they are really LE.....

I think everyone in Federal LE should be covered....but that's just me.....

And no....I have never applied for....tested for....or tried to get hired by your agency.....

[formerNOPD]

Non-Uniformed.....1801 series.....and have no stake in this what so ever.....

It just irrites me that you are "Yippee we got it"....and not conerned about other Uniformed, Federal LEOs that should be covered as well.....thats all....

If that bothers you, then that's on you....as there are other folks out there that do more LE related stuff than your agency....

And before you spout, I know plenty of CBP folks that continue to tell me how jacked up your agency is and how the agency is hemoraging folks....even with this happening....and were shocked to get it because even though they wear uniforms/badges/ and all that....don't feel like they are really LE.....

I think everyone in Federal LE should be covered....but that's just me.....

And no....I have never applied for....tested for....or tried to get hired by your agency.....

Ok, I see your point, however it's pretty crass if you ask me. Yes, I'm excited for us. Just like the postal service people were excited for themselves when they got it as well. If I were in your agency and did not have it, I'd be fighting for it as well. Sure the agency has it's problems, however it's not unique, it's just one of the largest if not THE largest agency in the federal government.

And yes, for the record, I think all uniform law enforcement officers for the federal goverment as well as non uniformed people should get coverage. BTW - our agency is one of a very few agencies that make more money than the government spends on us, so if it's warranted (6c) by any agency, it definately should be those that make the government money!


You say you've never worked this job so who are you to say it is or it is not LE? What agency do you work for? Well, let me see... Gun, Badge, Cuffs, Arrest powers, LEO retirement.... We board ships, search, seize, arrest people coming into the US with contraband, terrorist connections, ATF violations or any other violations of federal law, state felony arrest warrants, federal warrants....
No, I guess it's not LE. Oh, we have 24hour carry too, imagine that. Must be some sort of special security. Tell one of these CBPO's at el paso or laredo or San Ysidro that and I think they'd beg to differ. You think you're the only person here with LE experiance and somehow that qualifies you over other people to determine who is and who is not LE? Please. Give it a rest. If you don't like the fact that we're happy about something that has been a long time warranted, well that is sir, your problem. Have a good rest of the holidays.
Regards,
Fmr.

[Bearcat357]

See...the problem with your agency is that one area could be highspeed....while others are digging through bags and sitting on their collective asses at Airports not doing a thing......

Are all "real LEOs"....? Yeah....but I know enough older guys that work for your agency that really don't like the fact that they are made to carry on duty.....

As for me...I am a 1801 (for now) and don't have status...nor do I want it. I will be retired and back home in the next few years......if not sooner.

No...I am not bitter...and have never wanted your job (as suggested by several PMs from foks) as I have worked Military Customs abroad, I have no desire to do so full-time. It's not my bag....

I do applaud the fact that you'all got it....but think that ANY Federal LEO should be getting it as well....and it irrates me that you are on your "Yippie we got it" kick and not still wanting to get with your Union or Reps in Congress to make others get it as well......

I work for you HQ....and have had numerous arguements over this....and will so until EVERYONE is covered.... Not just CBP......

And if you think you will be able to transfer from one 6c Agency to another....especially if you are over 37.....good luck... BP guys can't do it....and I don't see it happening to you'all......

[qixfeet]

See...the problem with your agency is that one area could be highspeed....while others are digging through bags and sitting on their collective asses at Airports not doing a thing......

Are all "real LEOs"....? Yeah....but I know enough older guys that work for your agency that really don't like the fact that they are made to carry on duty.....

As for me...I am a 1801 (for now) and don't have status...nor do I want it. I will be retired and back home in the next few years......if not sooner.

No...I am not bitter...and have never wanted your job (as suggested by several PMs from foks) as I have worked Military Customs abroad, I have no desire to do so full-time. It's not my bag....

I do applaud the fact that you'all got it....but think that ANY Federal LEO should be getting it as well....and it irrates me that you are on your "Yippie we got it" kick and not still wanting to get with your Union or Reps in Congress to make others get it as well......

I work for you HQ....and have had numerous arguements over this....and will so until EVERYONE is covered.... Not just CBP......

And if you think you will be able to transfer from one 6c Agency to another....especially if you are over 37.....good luck... BP guys can't do it....and I don't see it happening to you'all......

Dude the bill just passed. Why shouldn't officers be excited. Everyone agrees that all uniformed officers should get 6c... well at lest most on this board. Don't you think this is a step in the right direction? I could be wrong but you do seem upset at the fact that the bill passed. No one said the fight stops here. I just don't see why you are so upset that CBP officers are happy about getting 6C. When the next agency gets it are they not supposed to be happy either?

[Daywalker78]

Does any of this 6C stuff have anything to do with the GS vs. GL thing? Are Border Patrol Agents on the GL scale and are CBPOs on the GS scale? My background investigator told me that I'd be better suited as a CBPO than BPA because it's a "better" job? I guess I'm wondering which way I should go, like the thread starter is...

[toughmommy]

It truly amazes me the negativity that some people like to offer.

1. Why would anyone put another person down in their moment of happiness?

2. I did not see anywhere that certain people would not like to help another agency out in getting 6c (as a matter of fact, just about everyone on this post is all for helping another agency out to get 6c or at least pointing them in the right direction to obtain 6c)

3. Sounds to me like some individuals that are about to retire, the "I don't give a damn or I'm leaving so it's doesn't matter syndrome" starts to leak through the veins. (Why is that a constant with some people who are about to leave? What we can't still chip in and help the ones that are being left behind and who are still working their tails off)

Yes, CBP getting 6c is a fantastic victory and one that has been deserving since CBP came about. As has been said numerous of times on these boards, anyone carrying a weapon, who have arrest authority, etc. should be given 6c status. That by far is a positive way to let employees know that they will be taken care of upon retirement with the benefits that it gives.

I stress anyone carrying a weapon, have arrest authority, etc. should be given 6c no matter if someone else feels they are not performing LE duties. I say this because all forms of LE employment are going to be sitting on their butts at some point in time and not fully performing LE duties. No one agency can say they do more LE duties than another because all agencies have desks (at least I think that's what our supervisors sit behind). Whether you are stationary (CBP on the border/airports or BP on their checkpoints or FBI/ICE doing paperwork in their offices) or mobile (CBP working cargo, seaports, etc. or BP on their ATV's or FBI/ICE in their Tahoe's and Suburbans or Air Marshall in their airplanes) it just doesn't matter, as pointed out in prior posts, everyone deserves 6c. Now, what people do in order to get 6c if they don't already have it, that is up to them. But believe me, coming on here and downing people for obtaining 6c and being thrilled about it isn't going to help another agency.

4. Daywalker78, it's surprising that the background investigator would tell you one was better than the other? I would like to know what his background is. It all depends on what agency you want to go with. There are differences and then there are similarities. That is just something you will have to decide. The best place I can suggest to go to is cbp.gov and then click on "Careers" and go from there. Do some research on there and then you can google as well. Obviously, from some of the posts, your answer might not be here but if you just do some research you might just find a step in the right direction.

[Bearcat357]

Why shouldn't officers be excited.

Apparently the only ones excited are the ones on here and the ones trying to get on with them....as all my friends that work for them aren't....and are still trying to find ways to escape their ports....

Don't you think this is a step in the right direction?

Have I said any different...?

I could be wrong but you do seem upset at the fact that the bill passed.

Only thing I am upset with....is that it's not including everyone..... I guess you haven't got the point even though I have said it several times.... :rolleyes:


No one said the fight stops here.

Pffft....Most CBP folks aren't going to give a crap about anyone but themselves....it's apparent from seeing some of the responses.... Next time you see your Congressman/women you going to bring the subject up....? I do...along with a host of other things when I get him cornered....

Once again...not upset that they got it....just upset others aren't......

[finaljustice]

Let me jump in the fire, To my brother in blue FormerNOPD, I am on your side, and qixfeet's too. Even ToughMommy who isn't an officer is cool too! So Bearcat, just leave man if you can't support a victory that was well deserved for US. It should have been this way from the beginning and it is well deserved for US! Period. I like my port and my job so take your negativity elseware man.

[ford123]

I really can't find anything negative in Bearcats posts.

He just said others deserve it as well.

I agree, and I am CBP.

Shake it easy, where all on the same side.

[Convo]

I am CBP and I too think all LEO should get 6c. I have np fighting for it. Bear people in the Airport have danger too. There is always things going on. Officers getting attacked, fights etc.. Since you are not in this agency you might not know of some of the people we catch. What's to stop a terrorist or other crazy person to go for an officers gun? There are also several airports that get a ridiculous amount of drug seizures a year. We also transport our own prisoners. To be honest Bear I think your information on our agency is lacking a bit.

[Bearcat357]

I am CBP and I too think all LEO should get 6c. I have np fighting for it. Bear people in the Airport have danger too. There is always things going on. Officers getting attacked, fights etc.. Since you are not in this agency you might not know of some of the people we catch. What's to stop a terrorist or other crazy person to go for an officers gun? There are also several airports that get a ridiculous amount of drug seizures a year. We also transport our own prisoners. To be honest Bear I think your information on our agency is lacking a bit.

I work for DHS @ HQ....so...surprisingly enough... I know all about the CBP Mission....... ;)

[Convo]

I work for DHS @ HQ....so...surprisingly enough... I know all about the CBP Mission....... ;)

If you know all this then why make the comment about the airport? You must hear about the things that go on.

[Firebug]

I work for DHS @ HQ....so...surprisingly enough... I know all about the CBP Mission....... ;)


This may come as a surprise to you but their are many in DHS HQ that don't have a clue what a CBP officer does. Hell, their are quite a few in CBP HQ that don't know what a CBP officer does.

This 6c coverage is no different than any other 6c coverage. Officers will be able to transfer to any other 6c covered position provided they qualify. The only exception to this will be for those of us who are over 37 when we were covered but again this will not affect those under 37 when covered.

Bear, You made the comparison to BP. BP has actually raised their age to 40. This does affect their ability to transfer to other 6c covered agencies if they were hired at 37, 38 or 39 only.

Will this 6c coverage stop people from leaving the agency? Personally, No I don't think so. There has to be a big change in the way the agency treats its employee's. Management has to start acting like a enforcement agency. Enforcement is a mind set. Management currently does not make policy with any enforcement mind set. The legacy agencies that make up the majority of the current CBP agency were in the process of changing into a more enforcement based agencies. The merge slowed this process down. Like any Federal Government agency change comes very slowly and by slowly I am talking 5 to 10 years. So right now you have the agency hiring people that want to be law enforcement officers, get the job, and get frustrated by conflicting messages and policies from management and move on.

As for airport vs land border, I have worked airport, seaport and land border. The amount of enforcement you do at any port is very port dependant. The previous airport I was worked at was much more enforcement minded then the land border port I am currently assigned. The only place I got injured with a time-loss injury (a broken arm) was at an airport in an altercation with an alien. The sterile areas of an airport are far from sterile I can assure you.
There are many good officers working the airport and they are not just sitting on their butts and deserve the 6c coverage as much as the land border guys. Just as their are many officers in the Land Border that are retired on duty and are not doing anything but marking time.

Sorry for the long winded post
FB

[1895FED]

Does any of this 6C stuff have anything to do with the GS vs. GL thing? Are Border Patrol Agents on the GL scale and are CBPOs on the GS scale? My background investigator told me that I'd be better suited as a CBPO than BPA because it's a "better" job? I guess I'm wondering which way I should go, like the thread starter is...

Daywalker,
Not sure of your situation?
But if you are a younger guy which you have to be at least below 40 to get on with BP. Now CBP and BP are both covered positions. BP has mandatory OT hence the AUO. CBP does not have AUO we are paid double time when when we do OT. Lets say that you were stationed at San Ysidro, I can see that you might be "FORCED" to work OT if you are the "LOW EARNER" on the shift. I am not in San Ysidro CA and unaware of the situation there but if it is like anywhere else in CBP land they are short staffed so you may be FORCED alot more?
Since you live in CALI and are used to the SUN and dryness the BP wouldn't be a bad choice. I wouldn't want to be CBPO at San Ysidro. A CBPO on the Northern Border isn't too bad! If you want more enforcement as a CBPO then Southern border is for you. Not too much enforcement is done on the Northern Border as a CBPO which sucks.
Hope this helps!

[Bearcat357]

This may come as a surprise to you but their are many in DHS HQ that don't have a clue what a CBP officer does.

True.....but there are a few of us that hangout/drink/work with CBP guys/gals and know what they do. There are also a few of us that were trained to do CPB stuff back when we were in the military (by legacy Customs folks)....so......

Hell, their are quite a few in CBP HQ that don't know what a CBP officer does.

Heard that as well.....

The only exception to this will be for those of us who are over 37 when we were covered but again this will not affect those under 37 when covered.

That is correct...

Bear, You made the comparison to BP. BP has actually raised their age to 40. This does affect their ability to transfer to other 6c covered agencies if they were hired at 37, 38 or 39 only.

Yes they have.... From what I have heard, if you one gets hired by BP at 38....they won't be able to go over to another 6c agency. Exceptions are on a case by case basis.....and are very, very low from the folks I know....that are in the positions to know......

Will this 6c coverage stop people from leaving the agency? Personally, No I don't think so. There has to be a big change in the way the agency treats its employee's. Management has to start acting like a enforcement agency. Enforcement is a mind set. Management currently does not make policy with any enforcement mind set. The legacy agencies that make up the majority of the current CBP agency were in the process of changing into a more enforcement based agencies. The merge slowed this process down. Like any Federal Government agency change comes very slowly and by slowly I am talking 5 to 10 years. So right now you have the agency hiring people that want to be law enforcement officers, get the job, and get frustrated by conflicting messages and policies from management and move on.

I do hope EVERYONE that is in the CBP hiring process reads this.... and realizes that it is coming from someone that works for CBP.....and this is what I have been hearing for years....

[1895FED]

I too work with CBP and as stated by Bearcat357 about EVERYONE reading the last statement by Firebug is 100% true!

[irisorio]

Seeing the original post of Border Patrol listed as a GL series (I was unaware that entry level was changed to GL-1896 instead of GS-1896) made me look at the new annoucement and noticed the following:

Federal Law Enforcement Retirement Coverage (12(d)) - Border Patrol Agents are covered under the provisions of both the Federal Employees Retirement System (FERS) and the "12 (d) law enforcement retirement benefit. Law enforcement employees may voluntarily retire at any age after completing 25 years of service or at age 50 or older with 20 years of service. The mandatory retirement age is 57 with 20 years of service, however, employees could work beyond 57 until they meet the combination of age and service requirements to retire under law enforcement provisions.

Cut and pasted from USA Jobs. Notice that BPA's are now listed as 12d retirement coverage.

Not sure what that means for the new guys, it looks the same as 6c to me. Promotional annoucements still list BPA's as GS-1896 with 6c Coverage.

[madchiken]

That's because 6c was replaced by 12d a few years ago.

[Bearcat357]

That's because 6c was replaced by 12d a few years ago.

Yeap...and everyone still calls it 6c...as if you say 12d coverage, you will get the deer in the headlight look....and most folks won't know what you're talking about.......

[merlin436]

Pffft....Most CBP folks aren't going to give a crap about anyone but themselves....it's apparent from seeing some of the responses....

CBP...and just about every other FLEO agency, IMHO.

My experience over the last few years has it that almost all currently 12D covered folk cared little for coverage for CBPO's, and that the uncovered folks outside of CBP were only pushing for coverage as it related their own interests as well.

I'm all for coverage for all, but I've seen damn little cooperation from just about everybody towards that common good.

[Daywalker78]

What are the advantages and disadvantages of each?

Have any of you worked for both groups? If so, I'd be curious to hear your experiences.

Can anyone actually answer the thread starter's question? I've read this entire thread more than once, and I haven't read a single thread that truly addresses the original question. People have responded saying "there are advantages and disadvantages." OK, so what are they? Now that they're both to be covered under 6C or 12D or whatever, can anyone actually provide some of these pros and cons? I also know, from reading this thread, that CBPOs are mostly stationary, and BPAs patrol, but is that it, are there no other differences than that? Hopefully someone with something relevant will chime in soon, thanks...

[madchiken]

Can anyone actually answer the thread starter's question? I've read this entire thread more than once, and I haven't read a single thread that truly addresses the original question. People have responded saying "there are advantages and disadvantages." OK, so what are they? Now that they're both to be covered under 6C or 12D or whatever, can anyone actually provide some of these pros and cons? I also know, from reading this thread, that CBPOs are mostly stationary, and BPAs patrol, but is that it, are there no other differences than that? Hopefully someone with something relevant will chime in soon, thanks...

Who ****ed in your cornflakes?

You can either be out on your own, in the middle of no where, patrolling, sneaking around in the dark, out on foot chasing groups of 5 to 100, pursuing and spiking vehicles...

Or stand in a booth or at a counter and check docs all day and maybe catch something...

Your choice... But Im hoping you pick CBP

[Daywalker78]

Who ****ed in your cornflakes?

You can either be out on your own, in the middle of no where, patrolling, sneaking around in the dark, out on foot chasing groups of 5 to 100, pursuing and spiking vehicles...

Or stand in a booth or at a counter and check docs all day and maybe catch something...

Your choice... But Im hoping you pick CBP

Thanks for the honest answer, and I eat raisin bran, not cornflakes.;) Anyways, why would you suggest CBP over BP? From what I've been reading, BPAs seem to be more fullfilled than CBPOs? It also seems as if even though they're both under the DHS, BPAs seem to get better treatment? Any truth to any of this? Thanks again...

[Convo]

Thanks for the honest answer, and I eat raisin bran, not cornflakes.;) Anyways, why would you suggest CBP over BP? From what I've been reading, BPAs seem to be more fullfilled than CBPOs? It also seems as if even though they're both under the DHS, BPAs seem to get better treatment? Any truth to any of this? Thanks again...

I don't think you can go wrong either way. CBPO have more authority than BPA but with out the backing of upper management it means nothing. I think that is where a lot of people get upset with the agency. We don't just sit in booths lol. I work with plenty of people who have been with CBP less then 5 years and have not touched a stamp in 4 of them. It depends where you work for the most part. Some ports are heavy in one area while others have multiple things you can get into. My port has a big Airport operation but also does a ton of seaport and warehouse stuff. I think the job depends on the person. I know people who left CBP to go to BP and vise versa. Mixed reviews on both. I know people who left CBP to go to ICE and wish they never made the jump. It really is up to the person. Find out what you want to do more. Right now I am just happy to be working and being apart of something that does make a difference.

[matyoka]

That's not going to happen. It's been made to go away, year after year, no matter who is in charge of Congress or the WH....

If they do it for CBP....then they will have to do it for the rest of the Gov....and they aren't going to do that....way too much money.....

Sucks..? Yeap....but thats how things work...

Hello all,

It's been a while since this was posted but I will reply. I am sure people touched on this subject on the following pages but here is my 2 cents:

It took Customs, INS and the 2 Unions more than 20 years to get the 6C coverage. Well, it finally arrived !!! Prez Bush signed it (had no choice due to the way it was attached to the FED bill) and CBP Officers will enjoy the long overdue status of Federal Law Enforcement Officers. The whole deal is not yet clear, it seems that we will be under the AUO system. This is the best thing that could have happened to DHS and CBP... we were losing more people than the Ebola outbrake in Kenya. I can surely predict a large number of transfers from the Border Patrol section and other agencies as well... Let's face it, the pay is good and CBPOs get 1 GS grade increase every year plus automatic steps for 3 years when they reach GS11. In four years one can make a base of $58k plus $30k in overtime which I am sure it will change with the 6C.

[matyoka]

Non-Uniformed.....1801 series.....

Are you a program manager at HQ ? Or CI ?

[Bearcat357]

Are you a program manager at HQ ? Or CI ?

I am a 1801 LE Investigative Analyst......

Though.....it won't be for long as I am about to go to another agency and leave the DC area......like within the next 3 weeks or so.....

[GoldBadge]

I am a 1801 LE Investigative Analyst......

Though.....it won't be for long as I am about to go to another agency and leave the DC area......like within the next 3 weeks or so.....

You got a little gypsy in you, don't ya! ;)

[Firebug]

Hello all,

It's been a while since this was posted but I will reply. I am sure people touched on this subject on the following pages but here is my 2 cents:

It took Customs, INS and the 2 Unions more than 20 years to get the 6C coverage. Well, it finally arrived !!! Prez Bush signed it (had no choice due to the way it was attached to the FED bill) and CBP Officers will enjoy the long overdue status of Federal Law Enforcement Officers. The whole deal is not yet clear, it seems that we will be under the AUO system. This is the best thing that could have happened to DHS and CBP... we were losing more people than the Ebola outbrake in Kenya. I can surely predict a large number of transfers from the Border Patrol section and other agencies as well... Let's face it, the pay is good and CBPOs get 1 GS grade increase every year plus automatic steps for 3 years when they reach GS11. In four years one can make a base of $58k plus $30k in overtime which I am sure it will change with the 6C.

CBPO's will NOT be under an AUO system. They are staying under COPRA and continue to get double time for overtime. I will also say it again 6C will not keep people in the agency and you will not see lots of transfers into the agency from BP and other agencies because it is not going to force management to treat us like law enforcement.

FB

[Bearcat357]

You got a little gypsy in you, don't ya! ;)

Yeap....but as long as I am moving up in grade......I'm good to go....

Now, if I could only find a job in Hawaii or Germany..... :D

[matyoka]

15 minutes ago 2 BP guys came in to use our facilities... The talk is out, BP Agents stranded in unwanted locations and South Border will look into transfering to CBP. This came straight from Supervisory BP Agent's mouth.

On the COPRA statement, yes we are under COPRA but for how long? Wit 6C will come the 50 hrs work week. Question is when? It is in the Govt's interest to make us work more with less pay... think of all the OT money they will save. AUO will come just like 6C came....

[anMP5sits]

I am a 1801 LE Investigative Analyst......

Though.....it won't be for long as I am about to go to another agency and leave the DC area......like within the next 3 weeks or so.....


An Analyst... Jesus, Mary and Joseph..........:eek:

[Bearcat357]

An Analyst... Jesus, Mary and Joseph..........:eek:

Yeah...I forgot you are a real Cop....CPL at that..... :rolleyes:

Some of us played LEO for 20 years before we opted to do other things there slick......

Futher.....you've posted about 10 things....and all of them have attacked me....so..... Guess what happens next....??

[anMP5sits]

Uh what??? You complain about me or beg to have an administrator close a thread. Besides, Im not doing anything too hardcore. No more hardcore and no different, than some of the sassy, sarcastic and disrespectful posts you've thrown at many members. Relax chief as I'm being just that, sarcastic.. I think you've become too sensitive in your advanced age

[Bearcat357]

Uh what??? You complain about me or beg to have an administrator close a thread. Besides, Im not doing anything too hardcore. No more hardcore and no different, than some of the sassy, sarcastic and disrespectful posts you've thrown at many members. Relax chief as I'm being just that, sarcastic.. I think you've become too sensitive in your advanced age

Nah....I'd never do anything like that....

Just trying to figure who you are....

[ford123]

15 minutes ago 2 BP guys came in to use our facilities... The talk is out, BP Agents stranded in unwanted locations and South Border will look into transfering to CBP. This came straight from Supervisory BP Agent's mouth.

On the COPRA statement, yes we are under COPRA but for how long? Wit 6C will come the 50 hrs work week. Question is when? It is in the Govt's interest to make us work more with less pay... think of all the OT money they will save. AUO will come just like 6C came....

Might be hard to do.

Since it was included in the bill, that CBP officers will continue to be covered by COPRA.

Might take another bill to undue it now.

And I will be retired by then...

[ford123]

"CBP Officers will enjoy the long overdue status of Federal Law Enforcement Officers."

CBPO's, or the legacy agencies, always had the status of LEO's.

Only difference now is a .7% increase per year, for retirement purposes.

Thats it.

[matyoka]

Might be hard to do.

Since it was included in the bill, that CBP officers will continue to be covered by COPRA.

Might take another bill to undue it now.

And I will be retired by then...

I hope you are right Ford, nobody wants AUO... but rumors eventually become reality. Thanks for your input.

[merlin436]

I hope you are right Ford, nobody wants AUO... but rumors eventually become reality. Thanks for your input.

I wouldn't say that. I'd make out noticeably better financially with AUO, as would just about everybody I work around. I'll bet there's a fair sized chuck of people who'd either benefit or "push" if AUO came about. The only drawback would be the extra 10 hours of work each week.

I can't see AUO happening easily though. It would be a major pain to implement in the smaller, non-24 hour ports, IMO.

[SHU]

You will be getting ripped off under AUO. It is regular pay. They are beating you out of 1.5 In the BP it is often needed due to remote locations agents work but at a POE, AUO is BS.
But it will help out the retirement because AUO counts towards your high 3. That is the good news. Working 10 hours a week extra for regular pay is the bad news.

[ford123]

I am glad we are sticking to COPRA.

COPRA, is the best. I love COPRA!

15% night diff for the whole shift.

20% night diff for "overnighters."

Time and a half for Sundays.

17,500 of OT counts for retirement.

Double time for overtime! Its the best thing about this job...lol.

[jay_c]

Just spent the last 30 min or so reading the post apparently for no reason at all since it was nothing but sarcastic fighting ..anyways I live in the southern border and have lots of friends whom are BP agents and to me the bad thing about BP is that u are most likely to end up in some small town, which isn't all that bad if u live by urself ....but with a family it can get really old since there is a lack of everything..lol....and if u go with CBP that would mean there is at least a need for a bridge,airport,or seaprt which most likely means a bigger city ...

[matyoka]

Well depends. I am with CBP and in the middle of nowhere... The closest town is 40 miles away from me and my family. Landborder crossings can be very lonely.

[jay_c]

I guess i was just thinking of my situation here in South Texas ...anyways Green just isn't me...I think i look better in blue ....lol...

[Bearcat357]

Easy enough to deal with....

All three of you work for DHS (according to your profiles).....PM each other your names....and look each other up in world-wide.......

Then you can figure out who is stroking whom off.....if someone refuses to do so.....

[SUP]

Since you still insist that you are a former BPA and current ICE Agent, I think you must be confused. CBP doesn't have to call BP Agents to perform arrests on anyone. Perhaps you have transported for the POE's in the past, but, that isn't exactally making the arrest. Anyway, we do our own transporting now. So that point is moot...

Most of my encounters with BP at the POE was to check the validity of a document for them or for them to utilize our Border Search Authority. As far as ICE Agents, they do come take custody of some suspects in drug seizures that we have already interdicted.

Perhaps you should think of a career in politics if you are comfortable claiming to be the hero in something that has already been processed by someone else.