Niteshift
12-03-2002, 02:45 AM
In the other thread currently going on about gun control, there were a couple of issues that are sort of buried in the mix I'd like to address.
First: MikeTX, correctly made the statement that "Criminals are afraid of armed citizens Dave, they have even said so"
Artie challanged this with: "Come on, Mike. I want names."
Other than the fact that this should seem like common sense, I did provide Artie with a name of a particular criminal. Artie dismissed it by saying that he was only one guy and that he wasn't asking me, rather that he was asking Mike.
Well, I couldn't remember the exact name of the survey, so I had to look it up.
In 1986, a govt. funded survey of 1874 convicted felons was conducted by Peter Rossi and James Wright. The study was titled: Armed and Considered Dangerous: A Survey of Felons and their Firearms (Hawthorne, NY; Aldine de Gruyter Publishers, 1986).
The survey showed 40% of the felons surveyed said they had decided not to commit a crime because they feared the intended victim was armed. Further, 34% said they'd been "scared off, shot at, wounded or captured by an armed citizen"
Another potential indicator is the comparison of burglaries in the UK and Canada versus ones in the US. "Hot burglaries", ones where the victim is home, make up nearly 50% of the UK/Canada burglaries, but only 13% of the ones in the US.
In the Rossi-Wright survey, the felons were asked why they avoided night time home burglaries. The most common answer: "that's the way to get shot".
Another issue addressed was Dr. John Lott's alleged bias. Artie wanted something to "unbiased" to support Lott. You'll have to draw your own conclusions about the bias or lack of bias on these sources:
"Armed with reams of statistics, John Lott documented many suprising linkages between guns and crime. More Guns, Less Crime demonstrates that what is at stake is not just the right to carry arms but rather our performance in controlling a diverse array of criminal behaviors. Perhaps most disturbing is Lott's documentation of the media and academic commentators in distorting research findings that they regard as politically incorrect." - W. Kip Viscusi, Cogan Professor of Law and director of the Program on Empirical Legal Studies, Harvard Law School. (note: Harvard Law is certainly not considered a right wing school)
"Until John Lott came along, the standard research paper on firearms and violence consisted of a longitudinal or cross-sectional study on a small and artfully selected data set with few meaningful statistical controls. Lott's work, embracing all the data that are relevant to his analysis, has created a new standard, which future scholarship in this area, in order to be credible, will have to live up to."- Dan Polsby, Kirkland & Ellis Professor of Law, Northwestern University.
"This book (More Guns, Less Crime) will- or should- cause those who almost reflexively support the limitations of guns in the name of reducing crime to rethink their positions." - Steve Shavell, Professor of Law, Harvard Law School
"John Lott has done the most extensive, thorough, and sophisticated study we have on the effects of loosening gun control laws. Regardless of whether one agrees with his conclusions, his work is mandatory reading for anyone who is open-minded and serious about the gun control issue. Especially fascinating is his account of the often unscrupulous reactions to his research by gon control advocates, academic critics, and the news media." - Gary Kleck, Professor of Criminology and Criminal Justice, Florida State University.
So Artie, there you have a few people to try to pick apart and see if you can show them as "biased".
Odd that 2 of them note the, in their opinion, incorrect criticism of the study.
First: MikeTX, correctly made the statement that "Criminals are afraid of armed citizens Dave, they have even said so"
Artie challanged this with: "Come on, Mike. I want names."
Other than the fact that this should seem like common sense, I did provide Artie with a name of a particular criminal. Artie dismissed it by saying that he was only one guy and that he wasn't asking me, rather that he was asking Mike.
Well, I couldn't remember the exact name of the survey, so I had to look it up.
In 1986, a govt. funded survey of 1874 convicted felons was conducted by Peter Rossi and James Wright. The study was titled: Armed and Considered Dangerous: A Survey of Felons and their Firearms (Hawthorne, NY; Aldine de Gruyter Publishers, 1986).
The survey showed 40% of the felons surveyed said they had decided not to commit a crime because they feared the intended victim was armed. Further, 34% said they'd been "scared off, shot at, wounded or captured by an armed citizen"
Another potential indicator is the comparison of burglaries in the UK and Canada versus ones in the US. "Hot burglaries", ones where the victim is home, make up nearly 50% of the UK/Canada burglaries, but only 13% of the ones in the US.
In the Rossi-Wright survey, the felons were asked why they avoided night time home burglaries. The most common answer: "that's the way to get shot".
Another issue addressed was Dr. John Lott's alleged bias. Artie wanted something to "unbiased" to support Lott. You'll have to draw your own conclusions about the bias or lack of bias on these sources:
"Armed with reams of statistics, John Lott documented many suprising linkages between guns and crime. More Guns, Less Crime demonstrates that what is at stake is not just the right to carry arms but rather our performance in controlling a diverse array of criminal behaviors. Perhaps most disturbing is Lott's documentation of the media and academic commentators in distorting research findings that they regard as politically incorrect." - W. Kip Viscusi, Cogan Professor of Law and director of the Program on Empirical Legal Studies, Harvard Law School. (note: Harvard Law is certainly not considered a right wing school)
"Until John Lott came along, the standard research paper on firearms and violence consisted of a longitudinal or cross-sectional study on a small and artfully selected data set with few meaningful statistical controls. Lott's work, embracing all the data that are relevant to his analysis, has created a new standard, which future scholarship in this area, in order to be credible, will have to live up to."- Dan Polsby, Kirkland & Ellis Professor of Law, Northwestern University.
"This book (More Guns, Less Crime) will- or should- cause those who almost reflexively support the limitations of guns in the name of reducing crime to rethink their positions." - Steve Shavell, Professor of Law, Harvard Law School
"John Lott has done the most extensive, thorough, and sophisticated study we have on the effects of loosening gun control laws. Regardless of whether one agrees with his conclusions, his work is mandatory reading for anyone who is open-minded and serious about the gun control issue. Especially fascinating is his account of the often unscrupulous reactions to his research by gon control advocates, academic critics, and the news media." - Gary Kleck, Professor of Criminology and Criminal Justice, Florida State University.
So Artie, there you have a few people to try to pick apart and see if you can show them as "biased".
Odd that 2 of them note the, in their opinion, incorrect criticism of the study.