Run times

[Bing_Oh]

Alright, I'm looking for an honest opinion from all of you serious runners...

Here's the deal. I'm looking to switch departments and have a physical agility test for a new PD in about three weeks. One of the parts of the test is a timed run...1.5 miles in 12:25. Now, while that 8-minute mile might be a cakewalk for your health fanatics, it's not for me. I havn't done any serious exercise in probably 5 years, and even before that, very little cardio.

I've been out running 5 days a week for a little over a month now trying to prepare, but I still like to describe myself as OF&S (old, fat, and slow). I'm at about 15+ minutes for the 1.5 mile right now (not bad for a guy who was running it in 17+ just a month ago, but not exactly Olympic pace, either).

So, here's the question...realistically, what's the chances of me shaving almost three minutes off of my time in the three weeks till the test? Personally, I think it's somewhere in the realm of impossible, but, as I said, I'm not a runner.

And, no, even if it is impossible, I'm not gonna stop running. I absolutely loath doing it, but I actually feel better after I've run. It's been so long since I've gotten into an exercise routine, I'd forgotten how good you can feel when you're doing something besides sitting on your butt all the time.

[CincyCop]

So, here's the question...realistically, what's the chances of me shaving almost three minutes off of my time in the three weeks till the test? Personally, I think it's somewhere in the realm of impossible, but, as I said, I'm not a runner.


Bing, to be honest it's going to be pretty tough for you to make 12:25 in three weeks by looking at your progress. Are you doing any sprint work like multiple 100 yard sprints? Sprint work builds leg speed which equates to faster long distance times.

[Iowa pd hopeful]

I am not a LEO yet, but I am in the same boat as you. Iowa requirement is mile and a half in 12:51, I have been running it anywhere from 14:41 to 15:20. I just recently took a test and on that day ran it in 13:31, so i cut a 1:10 off my time, and was only 40 seconds out from qualifying, keep at it and the day of the test it will be close, that adrenaline rush will push you to qualify. good luck!

[Grizzly]

...keep at it and the day of the test it will be close, that adrenaline rush will push you to qualify. good luck!


He's got a point. A healthy dose of fear of failure will help...:) Seriously though I normally run the 1.5 mile in about 11:30 but when I would test for the PAT my fear of failure would push me to just above the 11:00 mark. A little adrenaline never hurt nobody...:D

[bigcop97]

Adrenaline may push you through but you are going to pay for it... trust me I know...

Good Luck... I usually jog 2 miles when I am training in just under 20 minutes. I ran my 1.5 last year in 12:04.... but it hurt...

[Bing_Oh]

Hey, Grizzly, whatcha doing the first weekend in June? Wanna pretend you're me for a couple hours? You run around in circles and I'll buy the beer afterwards. I'll even give ya a tour of all the sights in beautiful Ohio (whatever the sights are...I havn't found em yet, and I've lived here my whole life).

Bing, to be honest it's going to be pretty tough for you to make 12:25 in three weeks by looking at your progress. Are you doing any sprint work like multiple 100 yard sprints? Sprint work builds leg speed which equates to faster long distance times.
I'm doing straight distance running at this point. Since I got over some pretty serious shin and ankle pain (I look like RoboCop from the waist down, I've got so many braces on), my biggest problem is endurance. I simply can't do the 1.5 at full speed...I sound like a steam engine going uphill.

Anyway, thanks for the advice and encouragement, guys. I might fail, but it sure won't be for lack of trying. Heck, maybe that fear of failure and a little adrenalin WILL get me to the passing time...stranger things have happened, I guess.

[CincyCop]

Hey, Grizzly, whatcha doing the first weekend in June? Wanna pretend you're me for a couple hours? You run around in circles and I'll buy the beer afterwards. I'll even give ya a tour of all the sights in beautiful Ohio (whatever the sights are...I havn't found em yet, and I've lived here my whole life).

Hey Bing...I'm a lot geographically closer than Grizzly...right down the road here in Cincinnati. I can get you a 9:25 for some Miller Lite. :D

Seriously, I hope you make it! :)

What department are you applying to?

[RabbitMPD]

I can run the 1.5 in about 13:30 but I usually run for 3 streight miles at about 30 minutes.

[Grizzly]

Hey, Grizzly, whatcha doing the first weekend in June? Wanna pretend you're me for a couple hours? You run around in circles and I'll buy the beer afterwards. I'll even give ya a tour of all the sights in beautiful Ohio (whatever the sights are...I havn't found em yet, and I've lived here my whole life).

Hmmmm, let's see I run around in circles all day at work and I can drink beer when I get home. So while your offer is generous and from the heart I regretfully must decline.... :D You can do it, just don't hurt yourself!!!


Hey Bing...I'm a lot geographically closer than Grizzly...right down the road here in Cincinnati. I can get you a 9:25 for some Miller Lite. :D
Seriously, I hope you make it! :)
What department are you applying to?


Holy smokes!!!!! Literally...that's cruising!!!! I would love to be able to do that. I seemed to have hit the 11:00 minute brick wall. No matter what I do I can't seem to push my self past that....yet. I am working on it though.

[JRT6]

With only three weeks to go don't start running sprints or doing all out runs now, you'll only burn your legs out before the test. I'm going to try to put this as positive as I can: You are not going to take 2:30 off you run time in three weeks especially if you are gaining a new level of fitness and not just getting back something you were able to do in the recent past. Keep running and building at a slow pace so that next time you have an agitily test you will be prepared before hand and will do well no matter what.

I can run a 12min 1.5 mile at a five degree incline on the treadmill almost on demand. This insures that no matter how tired I am, over trained, or what terrain I have to run on, I will easily get 12min when called to do so.

[LPI]

What helped me cut run times the most was loosing some weight. Also, running longer distances, work your way up to three miles, etc. makes running the 1.5 much easier. Good luck!

[Bing_Oh]

Hey Bing...I'm a lot geographically closer than Grizzly...right down the road here in Cincinnati. I can get you a 9:25 for some Miller Lite. :D
Ice cold Miller Light, coming right up! Would you like a snack with that, sir? Perhaps some wings? Nachos? Everybody loves nachos! :D

What helped me cut run times the most was loosing some weight. Also, running longer distances, work your way up to three miles, etc. makes running the 1.5 much easier. Good luck!
That's one of the other reasons I'm planning on continuing to run no matter how the physical agility test goes...I'm packing too many pounds around the gut. I'm developing the early stages of "crusier gut," and I don't like it. At about 6'01 and 208 lbs, I'm not happy. My first goal is 195...we'll see where I want to go from there.

I am trying to push past my 1.5 miles on my daily runs. It's a tough thing, motivationally, for me at this point.

[IB1032]

I run the 1.5 run in 10:24.....anyone know what my time would be for a mile? how would i calculate it? stupid question! :)

[jdub1242]

Ive been off for 7 weeks with a broken collarbone (did it racing) and just did a 5k with my wife. Finished in a little under 30 mins. Didnt think that was too bad.

[lewy15]

i run it in 10:24 too... I usaully do a mile in right around 7 minutes??

[JRT6]

6:56 pace and 8.6mph. 10:30 is my average too.

[AgentFox]

Be careful with equating treadmill and road running. Treadmill running is much easier. The treadmill just doesn't train you like the road, though it is better than nothing.

And already you have defeated yourself by saying, "no I can't, no I won't", You have about one month to train your body and to retrain you mind. I suggest doing so immediately, if not sooner.

Good luck.

[Soon2Be]

Interesting.

It is easier for me to run a good pace on the road than on a treadmill.

I have to modify my stride on a treadmill, and I'm not nearly as efficient.

I can use my long legs properly on the road...

[JRT6]

Actually a long stride is inefficeint. It takes more energy to stride long and the angle of the leg landing causes a braking action with each step.

Just crank the treadmill up to 5-8 degress and make sure you're getting 85 or more strides a minute and you'll have no problem on the road.

[AgentFox]

Actually a long stride is inefficeint. It takes more energy to stride long and the angle of the leg landing causes a braking action with each step.

Just crank the treadmill up to 5-8 degress and make sure you're getting 85 or more strides a minute and you'll have no problem on the road.


Very true. Read this in a running magazine recently. I cannot at this time recall the number of paces per minute a professional runner achieves but it is rather high. The idea is your feet are on the ground less, less friction, you keep the legs moving (rather than braking like mentioned above).

On a treadmill, the treadmill takes alot of the activity away as the surface is moving; just plant a foot and let the belt carry it away. On the road, you have to propel yourself forward. I would be interested in knowing if you are really comparing apples to apples with your idea that you run "better" on a treadmill. Perhaps I am being too bold in saying that treadmill running is easier, others please chime in if so.

[nrneuha]

To me a lot of it depends on what type of fatigue you are having, lung or muscle failure. If it is a lung issue, can't get enough breath, then to me it is something tht will take more time to compensate for. However if it is a muscular endurance thing, then if you work on the strength of your lower body and core, your runs will be easier, just running sometimes is not enough, hit the weights and the scales.

[Bing_Oh]

AgentFox, I'm not in a self-defeating attitude...I fully plan on running until I puke or pass out on the day of the test...but I'm a realist about my physical condition. I can get my head in The Zone, I just have trouble getting my legs to follow.

I do appreciate the advice about stride legnth from you and JRT6, though. I'm relatively tall (6'01), and have long legs, and assumed that I should be doing a longer stride because of it. When I try, however, I get tired much quicker...and it doesn't help my times any. Seems I can keep my pace longer if I have shorter strides.

To me a lot of it depends on what type of fatigue you are having, lung or muscle failure. If it is a lung issue, can't get enough breath, then to me it is something tht will take more time to compensate for. However if it is a muscular endurance thing, then if you work on the strength of your lower body and core, your runs will be easier, just running sometimes is not enough, hit the weights and the scales.
Is the answer "All of the Above" an option? ;) I think it's primarily an breathing issue right now. My recovery times have improved significantly, but I still run out of breath before I can complete a mile. I'm pushing my limits on muscle endurance toward the end, but it's something that I'm teaching myself to work through.

[SlowDownThere]

Perhaps I am being too bold in saying that treadmill running is easier, others please chime in if so.

Treadmill running is indeed easier. I run indors on a treadmill all winter. When spring finally breaks (usually around July 4th here) I run outside. It feels like I never ran a step before in my life the first few times.

Running outdoors is much harder work and better exercize.

[LPI]

Have you tried the eliptical Bing? It helped me quite a bit with endurance. You can burn between 550-600 calories in 30 minutes.

Try twenty minutes on the eliptical at a good pace and then run at a good clip on the treadmill. It may help get your endurance up. When I started on the eliptical, I would get about fifteen minutes in and get really tired. I stuck with it and now can get in forty minutes at level 14-16.

Eliptical and running is an excellent combo IMO.

[TPO]

join the club. i ran a lot a couple of years ago, and just got back into it. i start out jogging. once i've got the jogging thing down and can go for a couple miles like that, i change. i start sprinting as hard as i can, as far as i can. once i'm tired, i walk until i've caught my breath, then i do it over. i keep this up for about 1.5 to 2 miles. believe me, you will think you've never ran in your life, even after jogging, when you sprint like that the first few times. but eventually, i'm able to slowly close the distance in all those walks, and make it one long run. while i don't sprint a mile and a half, it does increase my leg strength and endurance, and i can keep a quicker pace in the mile and a half.

i'm know very little about weight training and all that stuff, but that's what has always worked for me when i need to lower my times.

[JRT6]

Yes running on a treadmill is easier. It absorbs a lot of shock rather than send it back up you legs like on the road and for all the other reasons listed. But I'm telling you guys try running on a 5-8 degree incline for a while then go back on the road. The treadmill incline makes the run a lot harder because you are hauling your body weight up the incline. Try it for two months, getting to the point of running the same speed on the treadmill at 5-8 degrees that you normally run on the road for an average workout, go back outside, then tell me it doesn't work.

[Bing_Oh]

...faster...stronger...better.

Figured I'd do an update...

I went on my daily run this morning and, as I won't have time to run tomorrow, I decided to push myself. I succeeded in cutting a full minute off of my time from yesterday. Now, admittedly, I'm still a little over two minutes off of my goal time, and I'm in quite a bit of pain at the moment, but I'm really starting to understand that my pain and endurance thresholds can be significantly exceeded. Plus, I didn't pass out, puke, or require the assistance of a squad today, which seems to indicate that I can push myself more.

Test is exactly two weeks from yesterday. Here's hoping that the adrenalin rush on test day gives me just enough to hit that 12.25.

[Iowa pd hopeful]

...faster...stronger...better.

Test is exactly two weeks from yesterday. Here's hoping that the adrenalin rush on test day gives me just enough to hit that 12.25.


You will make it, when you are running with other guys, you will push harder and be faster. As I said earlier, I took 1:10 off of my time on test day, and only missed it by 40 seconds. you will be fine :) Just keep training

[sunshinegal]

[QUOTE=AgentFox]Very true. Read this in a running magazine recently. I cannot at this time recall the number of paces per minute a professional runner achieves but it is rather high. The idea is your feet are on the ground less, less friction, you keep the legs moving (rather than braking like mentioned above).

I think I heard it was somewhere around 160 or 180 paces per minute. Which for a 5'5" girl is rather natural, but the guy I run with is 6'5" and he looks like he is almost skipping trying to get all of those steps in a minute, but it has really increased his speed. He used to run with me, but now with more steps, he is way ahead and we dont really run "together" any longer. I just pace off behind him, and draft him! :)


You will do fine w/your run at the test. Adrenaline is a wonderful thing. You will be there with all of those other people and you will be running in a pack or even running behind someone and before you know it, you are DONE. I cut off 3 minutes during my run. Obviously I wasnt pushing myself in practice like I could when I did my test.

Good Luck.

[americanoutdrsm]

what I do to acheive my run time in the desired time. I pick the time I want to run in my case it has always been 3 miles in 18 minutes, old habits die hard. but I will run 1/4 mile until I get to the time I want which in my case is 1.5 min, them I move to 1/2 mile when I can do that in 3 min I move on to 3/4 mile and so forth. I keep increasing my run distance by 1/4 mile when I can reliably make under the time I select. It takes some time to get there but you will get there without hurting yourself. For 3 miles I got there in 6 months. I was coming back from a serious injury and can run now better than most. Good luck.

[JRT6]

Several people posted about the wonders of adrenaline and how it can help their run time. Problem is it's becoming a myth that fools a lot of people. A lot of people are counting on adrenaline to make up for lack of ability to complete the academy run in the specified time and I have to tell them that they have failed the academy. The problem is adrenaline is only one variable that is minor compared to others. Adrenaline will not overcome tired legs from last minute or long term over training. Adrenaline will not overcome latic acid overload do to having to run in the anaerobic range too long due to insufficient areobic conditioning(VO2 max).

The only thing a person can count on to pass the test is to train enough for it

[dfp837]

I run after work 1.5 in 13-14 6-7 days a week, then I walk for a bit as a resting period. Sometimes I walk with the dog for 2-3 miles in the early morning as a warm up, work then come home. After that, I do a jog for about 2.5 miles back home. My goal is to run 1.5 miles in 10 minutes. When I first started over a month ago I was at 18 minutes so I'm feeling pretty good about doing these tests that are coming up. AZ temps now are over 100 days, 70-75 mornings and nice at night.

[kirch]

With under 2 weeks remaining, I don't know how much help some of this will be. But I'm no defeatist -- if you want it bad enough, you can do it.

Here are some tips based upon my experience:

1. Work with a trainer. There may not be a lot a trainer can do for you in under 2 weeks, but there's a chance. Around here, we have a gym that specializes in performance enhancement (that sounds like a Viagra ad, doesn't it?). They specifically advertise themselves as being able to improve athletic performance in situations just like this. The money you spend is probably small in comparison to the pleasure of accomplishing your goal.

2. Run longer than 1.5 miles. If you run 2 miles when you train, a 1.5-mile run will seem like a cakewalk on test day.

3. Pace yourself. If your test is going to be given at a track, find out the length of the track. Figure out what your lap time needs to be to hit your goal, then nail that time for each lap -- no matter how hard it hurts. Even better, see if you can gain access to the track where the test is held prior to testing day to get comfortable with it.

4. Lose weight. This seems pretty obvious; the less weight your legs have to propel, the easier it will be for them. This is where a dietician or a trainer with a nutritional background can help. It's possible to lose a good 10-15 lbs. in the time you have without starving yourself or compromising muscle performance. You just have to be smart about it.

5. Rest before test day. Prior to your test, take a couple days off from running. I always find that I run best after a 2-3 day hiatus.

6. Don't discount test day performance increases. It's been mentioned, but just about everyone I know says they did better on the PT test on test day than previously. I don't know if it's the adrenaline dump or the competition with other runners or what, but it IS a factor. I was running about 1.5 in about 12:30 on a regular basis and my best time ever was 12:07 (14:30 was the cutoff for my age group) -- on test day I ran it in 10:56. In my case, I simply focused on the runner ahead of me and was determined to catch him/her. With 2 laps to go, I kicked in the afterburners, even though I normally would only sprint the last lap of my practice runs. It's a help, but you also have to be realisitic. I think a lot of people that showed up on test day expected the adrenaline to magically make them fit -- it don't quite work that way.

Good luck to you -- let us know what happens.

[greenberet3382]

So you want to run faster on the 1.5 mile. I used to be on the fort lewis army 10miler team. What you want to do is 5 miles 3 times a week like m, w, f. Then on tuesday and thursday do sprints. But make sure you do sprints till you feel like your going to hurl. You can do interval training on t and t as well. Instead of doing lines pick a 3 mile stretch of road. You run a super slow like 12-15 minute mile pace for two lightpoles then sprint like your life depended on it for 1 polelength. Then you you jog slow 2 more. Run the whole 3 miles like this. You will feel worse on these two days then on your long distance days. You can always try doing stairs on tuesday and thursday. If you do this it will help your run like you cant believe. Also a little caffeine before you run cant hurt. They have this mix of stuff I used to use before my PT test for the military. My 2 mile time would go from 13:58 to 12:30 or 12:00. Its NO2 and caffeine. Its made by dymatize. Most supplement shops will have it. You'll be able to push it much harder. You will have more fluid going to your muscles. Dont start using it till 1 week before you test. But I promise if you do 5 miles or at least 4 3 times a week and intervals, sprints, or stairs 2 times a week you'll be right there where you need to be.

[spydereleven]

How did you do on test day Bing_Oh?

[AMKL68]

Best advice I could offer since I'm in same boat now when it comes to running (getting back to it after NOT running for nearly three years)..

Day 1: walk (fast paced) for 20-30 mins
Day 2: jog for 20-30 mins
Day 3: run for 20-30 mins
Day 4: no running or anything, or if you want take walk around the block (walk the dog etc).

Day 5: repeat day 1 etc. :p

It helped me shed my time. I was running mile and half in 19 mins and needed 13 for testing. Hope that makes some sense.

[Jumper]

Hey CincyCop,

Had our midterm PT test about a week ago. I'll see your 9:25 and raise you a 9:14! :)

I may be late but good luck Bing_OH. I hope you make your goal.

[Bing_Oh]

Thanks for all the help, interest, and encouragement, guys. Unfortunately, things...didn't go as planned...on test day. So, I'll be staying at my current PD for a little while as I continue on my job hunt.

And, yea, I'm still running. I know that I started out WAY too late in my conditioning for the last test. No slacking for me anymore.