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23queen5
04-14-2006, 07:25 AM
Are there any agencies in the LA area, including Orange County and West San Bernardino county that I should avoid looking at?

If so please say why, whether it be financial situation or any other reason...

An example would be LAPD which I heard makes new hires sign a 5 year contract because theyre having problems retaining officers.

23queen5
04-14-2006, 07:27 AM
Also, any info on good (cheap) places to live would be nice.

Five-0fromSoCal
04-14-2006, 02:15 PM
Try San Bernardino County area. Rancho Cucamonga, North Fontana, Chino Hills to name a few. All are new and growing cities. Very nice communities and the housing is still cheaper than LA County/Orange County. You can still work in LA County. Alot of coppers from LA County live in these cities.

CPhil555
04-15-2006, 02:25 PM
An example would be LAPD which I heard makes new hires sign a 5 year contract because theyre having problems retaining officers.

I think this is a fair deal. I personally do not think it's fair for a recruit to use the LAPD's resources (approx $60,000 for the Academy) PLUS earn a salary of $55,000 only to walk away to a smaller dept upon graduation.

An officer that leaves the dept. due to stress or personal issues does not violate the contract. An officer who leaves and joins another dept. within 12 months is liable. So there's the loophole. If you decide to leave the LAPD...wait 12 months, and you'll be fine.

23queen5
04-15-2006, 03:51 PM
That actually sounds reasonable. Thanks for the info

nobody33
04-15-2006, 09:51 PM
The bad departments are the ones that pay horrible. There are some departments in the region that still pay less than 5k a month, which is redicously low already for the region. Nor do some have 3 at 50. The low pay is like a domino effect, they hire knucleheads and the whole department is a lower quality than others.

I have also heard isolated complaints about other agencies, like the amount of time in the jails at LASD/OCSD. But you know you are getting that when you sign up.

I would stay away from the agencies in San Bernardino county. I used to work there, a few are decent, but they all seem to have their issues. Riverside county and orange county seem to be overall much more squared away.

23queen5
04-15-2006, 10:26 PM
nobody33,

what specifically was bad about San Bernardino County agencies? admin? people? or just the job out there itself?

also, was it the county SO that wasn't too great or city cops?

LA Copper
04-16-2006, 12:45 AM
Every agency in Southern California that I am aware of are all very professional orginizations. Most pay very well and do the job they are supposed to do.

The only possible "bad" thing has been mentioned, if you work a local sheriff's department, you would be "stuck" working the jails for at least five years. To me, that's pretty "stuck." Also, some of the smaller agencies aren't quite as busy as the bigger ones... i.e. Burbank PD is not nearly as busy as LAPD or LASD for obvious reasons.

And I agree, just because LAPD has you sign a contract doesn't make it a "bad" agency. I proud of my department.

beachcop05
04-16-2006, 04:43 AM
San Diego PD is going through a pretty bad time right now, with a recent pay-cut, a lot of guys are leaving for other agencies, and as a result, morale is pretty low. It is one of the lowest paid dept's in southern CA.

Five-0fromSoCal
04-16-2006, 11:20 AM
RE: being "stuck" in Custody (or courts). For my department, how long your "wait" will be between academy graduation and Patrol is going to depend on such factors as how fast we're hiring, which stations you pick, if we have any new large assignments opening up, and if you have any special skills/abilities in critical demand, etal.

In the last Patrol school I recognized a couple of deputies who graduated the academy relatively recently - 14-16 Months ago. That's pretty fast (north county stations). OTOH, I know a few guys who finally made it to stations like East LA and Industry - after 7-8 Years...

Sam good point. Custody is a good place to start out as a cop. Makes you a better cop, IMO. Not to mention all the o/t. Your're right, though. Your time in custody all depends on which station you pick, hiring, and other factors, which we are doing alot of right now. I only spent 2 yrs in custody.

Fuzz
04-16-2006, 01:58 PM
Each department has it's own good things and bad things depending on your point of view. Low pay and political problems in San Diego PD may be bad for the cops working there, but it might be a good situation for someone to get hired because the competition may not be as high with the bad publicity. Some people may not ever want to work in the jails and a department that has to work corrections before patrol may be a horrible department for them.

You need to look at each department, research their benefits, talk with some of the front line cops (not the recruiters) and find out which department meets what you are looking for.

For example....I am very happy with my department, the pay is in the top three of the county, good equipment, good people, brand new station, lots of growth right now.....but we have had people leave because the work load is too high (yes we are very busy).

pkagel
04-23-2006, 04:24 PM
I have a list of most of the LA/OC agencies along with many other counties that you can look at on my site. I also have all my academy notes on there if you're intetested. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CABasicPolice/

As far as bad agencies, it really depends on what you are looking for as to what you would consider bad. I think all the SoCal agencies have a leg up on the rest of the country due to the training alone.

nobody33
04-23-2006, 08:55 PM
nobody33,

what specifically was bad about San Bernardino County agencies? admin? people? or just the job out there itself?

also, was it the county SO that wasn't too great or city cops?


SBSO has jail time and low pay. The admins are crummy in some agencies, corruption issues (Rialto, SBPD, etc). Pay issues at some places. A lot of micromanagement gonig on there.

I'd look at RSO and Riverside city. Riverside PD is paid extremely well. Better than some OC agencies even.

ateamer
04-25-2006, 12:35 AM
In the last Patrol school I recognized a couple of deputies who graduated the academy relatively recently - 14-16 Months ago. That's pretty fast (north county stations). OTOH, I know a few guys who finally made it to stations like East LA and Industry - after 7-8 Years...
I think that if I worked for LASD, I'd want to work up around Lancaster and Palmdale - out of the LA Basin, nice desert weather and plenty of open space outside town. I would imagine that there is less traffic as well.

DOAcop38
05-02-2006, 01:41 AM
I think this is a fair deal. I personally do not think it's fair for a recruit to use the LAPD's resources (approx $60,000 for the Academy) PLUS earn a salary of $55,000 only to walk away to a smaller dept upon graduation.

An officer that leaves the dept. due to stress or personal issues does not violate the contract. An officer who leaves and joins another dept. within 12 months is liable. So there's the loophole. If you decide to leave the LAPD...wait 12 months, and you'll be fine.


Its called "SLAVERY" (illegal in this country last time I heard) and that contract doesn't mean you have a "job" for 5 yrs, or that your promotions or pay increases are locked in- you can be demoted as a form of discipline now with the city of L.A .Lots of officers seeking to lateral b4 5 yrs have fought that contract and won .After 5 yrs in LAPD you have to dodge pins and needles to keep out of the I.A. sights, and if you want to really work as a patrol officer for an APPRECIATIVE community, its the local suburbs that make it worth while. And every other L.A. county agency ,even the sub police Depts that are deployed by the city of L.A(Port Pd,Airport Pd,GenServices PD ,School PD )-DON'T make you sign a contract !You come and go in this job like any other job,public or private .LAPD is a "meat grinder", and even the hard scrabble LASD has a better work environment- not much better pay or equip,but definitely higher MORALE. The city has become a vicious 3rd world city, with houses in the 'hood costing $500K PLUS, just so you can live near the people you will most likely have to ARREST.

CPhil555
05-02-2006, 02:28 AM
and if you want to really work as a patrol officer for an APPRECIATIVE community, its the local suburbs that make it worth while. And every other L.A. county agency ,even the sub police Depts that are deployed by the city of L.A(Port Pd,Airport Pd,GenServices PD ,School PD )-DON'T make you sign a contract

why not just start out in an "appreciative" community from the start? i might be jaded here but please elaborate: why is the LAPD the stepping stone? don't these appreciative suburbs have their own training?

LA Copper
05-02-2006, 11:50 AM
why not just start out in an "appreciative" community from the start? i might be jaded here but please elaborate: why is the LAPD the stepping stone? don't these appreciative suburbs have their own training?

Very good point. If you want to work for a smaller city, then by all means, go and test with them. Attend whatever academy they send you to instead of taking up the spot of a person who would actually like to be on the LAPD and not just use us to go someplace else.

I have to disagree with you DOA, you don't have to dodge I.A. unless you've done something you shouldn't have. I have never had a problem with them, they are only doing the job that every major department has them do.

I also disagree that our morale is low. Our morale was low under our last chief and right after Rafael Perez screwed us over. Right now, morale is very good, with the probable exception of a few people who screwed themselves by doing something they shouldn't and are now dealing with I.A. (No, I don't work I.A.)

It would seem that you don't care for us very much. Most, if not all of your posts are anti-LAPD. Why burst other people's bubble if you don't even work for us?

By the way, we've recently had a number of sheriff's lateral over to our department so we can't be all bad. I sit on entry level interviews and have personally interviewed many of them. We have three sheriff laterals working in my current division. My point being that there are pros and cons in every department, yours included.

Five-0fromSoCal
05-02-2006, 09:53 PM
Very good point. If you want to work for a smaller city, then by all means, go and test with them. Attend whatever academy they send you to instead of taking up the spot of a person who would actually like to be on the LAPD and not just use us to go someplace else.

I have to disagree with you DOA, you don't have to dodge I.A. unless you've done something you shouldn't have. I have never had a problem with them, they are only doing the job that every major department has them do.

I also disagree that our morale is low. Our morale was low under our last chief and right after Rafael Perez screwed us over. Right now, morale is very good, with the probable exception of a few people who screwed themselves by doing something they shouldn't and are now dealing with I.A. (No, I don't work I.A.)

It would seem that you don't care for us very much. Most, if not all of your posts are anti-LAPD. Why burst other people's bubble if you don't even work for us?

By the way, we've recently had a number of sheriff's lateral over to our department so we can't be all bad. I sit on entry level interviews and have personally interviewed many of them. We have three sheriff laterals working in my current division. My point being that there are pros and cons in every department, yours included.

You're right, there are pros and cons with every dept. The grass is definitely not always greener though. Most of our guys that lateral are from custody and got tired of waiting to go to their station. From what backgrounds tell me, many are trying to come back. Hearing guys going to LAPD was something that never happened, so you know some guys have gotten frustrated in custody. Not that LAPD is bad, just something that was not common. There are highs and lows (especially LASD/LAPD) with every dept. From what some of your guys have told us, you're morale has gone up considerably. Good to hear.

LA Copper
05-03-2006, 12:19 AM
You're right, there are pros and cons with every dept. The grass is definitely not always greener though. Most of our guys that lateral are from custody and got tired of waiting to go to their station. From what backgrounds tell me, many are trying to come back. Hearing guys going to LAPD was something that never happened, so you know some guys have gotten frustrated in custody. Not that LAPD is bad, just something that was not common. There are highs and lows (especially LASD/LAPD) with every dept. From what some of your guys have told us, you're morale has gone up considerably. Good to hear.

You are so right, I never used to hear you guys coming over to us, it was always the other way around. The sheriffs laterals I've talked to all said exactly what you said, they didn't want to stay in custody any longer. I've heard several things from only 3 years in custody to 7 years.. And that's from your people I've heard this from so, who knows? As long as everyone has a job and everyone is happy at what they're doing.

DOAcop38
05-03-2006, 12:46 AM
Very good point. If you want to work for a smaller city, then by all means, go and test with them. Attend whatever academy they send you to instead of taking up the spot of a person who would actually like to be on the LAPD and not just use us to go someplace else.

I have to disagree with you DOA, you don't have to dodge I.A. unless you've done something you shouldn't have. I have never had a problem with them, they are only doing the job that every major department has them do.

I It would seem that you don't care for us very much. Most, if not all of your posts are anti-LAPD. Why burst other people's bubble if you don't even work for us?

.


First of all - I don't hate nor champion LAPD- they are the primary enforcement entity for the ctzns of the city of L.A. but I have confronted far too many instances of hypocritical and down right poor perfromance by LAPD personnel; i have also seen too many intances of LAPD "arrogance" in dealing with other Depts,mine included ( there are some recent "dirty " dealings against my Dept by the LAPPL and LAPD mgm't),as well as their criticism of others, and their abuse of officers under the "guise" of being an "elite" organization .there are quite a few agencies outside of L.A.P.D that actually give BETTER service to their respective communities than LAPD does to its own , so the image of being " the top notch"in crime fighting is not longer valid for LAPD. LAPD is still a "premier " Dept, but the "fantasy" that people just want LAPD training to go somewhere else is also wrong.Many officers leave LAPD due to the heavy work load you guys have and the internal politics- for some its a wise choice, for others its just being naive about police work.And with the rise of the "pre service " recruits at academies such as Rio hondo,Fullerton College,Goldenwest ,Ben Clark Trng facility , and San Bernardino College, smaller Depts have plenty of applicants,which causes a crisis in recruitment for bigger Depts such as LBPD,LAPD and LASD. And when you ask these pre service recruits,they'd rather go places like "Montebello",or financially shaky "South Gate PD", or join the "county OPS Police" BEFORE even applying for LAPD .


As for LASD deputies transferring? they figure just like I would if I left my Dept, I'd go to a big Dept instead of a small one. If your Pay at LAPD were better (which it will be -alittle- if the city okays that 10.25% raise- which my people will also get !) and that "bogus" Lateral program you had actually "respected" a veteran peace officers outside experience and POST certified AOT training( 1yr equals 6 mos LAPD time? when I was a "probie" I was arresting people with KILOS of coke when I'd watch LAPD classmates bringing in "nickel" bags of the stuff @ PAB !),you'd get MORE people transferring into LAPD.you realize that many Depts don't treat lateral officers like P-1s and they get along just fine - learning LAPD procedures isn't at all that hard .many guys that leave LAPD tend to end up in agencies that pay as much,or if less, have a BETTER work environment .as far as my opinions ,they have been shaped by the dealings with your personnel- many who bitterly complain,but won't leave ,or even the "few" I've seen ACTUALLY done wrong by your disciplainary system - I know of an acquaintance who was a medal of valor winner with LAPD that was fired ,only to be "offered" a conditional employment back as a P-2 instead of P-3 2 yrs later ( this without a court order or LAPPL pressure on the dept). I ACTUALLY RESPECT alot of people who work for LAPD, but I figure that someone should at least tell the "unknowing" the good and bad of each Dept as they understand it .ask me what is good and bad about where I work ,I'd tell an applicant in a minute- why try to "whitewash" reality? and ,"yes" there ARE options to working LAPD, LASD,or other Depts- an applicant should really look into what each agency ,small and large has to offer-why go work for a Dept in a city where you won't or can't live, and have little in common with the community you serve? LAPD need s to come back down to "earth-" it is an organization that SERVES its community ,but is NOT ABOVE it(you are slowly getting there). Genuine outreach to its community can lead to a partnership that is as good as any other agency has- and my personal take is that it should first concentrate on the amounts of young men and women in So.Cal that are of employment age instead of its efforts in places like Chicago, Steamboat Springs ,Colorado,and Des Moine ,Iowa for applicants ( Have an internet "buddy" who said she applied and is in the process for LAPD after attending a job fair for LAPD there).You have to win the hearts and minds of the "gen-X" generation.They are not like my generation and the generation that proceeded me in terms of "following" without question or accepting the conditions they work in . If it stinks ,you'll hear about it and they'll show you how they feel by leaving.although there are Deputies that are leaving due to that long custody work issue, don't think they don't have loyalty to LASD-its all about work environment-we have 5 LASD deputies now that were once working in custody,so the situation needs to be fixed by Baca or he'll be in big trouble . If you think it wrong that I comment on LAPD ( as an outsider) then i'll respectfully keep my opinions to myself,unless directly asked . I wish any applying for any Calif Dept, north or south , the best of luck ,and hope they are fully aware of what they are getting into........

DOAcop38
05-03-2006, 01:06 AM
why not just start out in an "appreciative" community from the start? i might be jaded here but please elaborate: why is the LAPD the stepping stone? don't these appreciative suburbs have their own training?

They do - there are several training academies in so.california ,including the Academies of the local sheriffs depts - L.A. Co,riverside Co,San Bernardino Co,Kern Co, Orange County, San Diego Co - that train smaller Dept PDs recruits too. LAPD is not actually a "stepping" stone, but you get SOME officers who just want to work somewhere else after a few yrs( due to perceptions of the "grass being greener" elsewhere) or because they want less violence ,less distance to commute, or just to try something "new"( many agencies have similar performance in So.Calif) and almost all of them follow the LAPD "proactive" policing model to some form or another. The push toward community "policing" is great when you have the TIME to actually make it happen- and many friends I have at LAPD seem to complain about chasing the radio (going call to call) every nite,or due to the negative history of LAPD with certain neighborhoods, officers would rather stick to radio chasing than get into daily "contacts" with some folks.but then thats them- i work for a District agency ,situated in a upper middle class suburb-we waive at people and they waive back (with all fingers ,mind you) .younger people coming into this line of work TRULY expect the billboard ads to be the reality of the job- high pay, smiling faces,satisfaction,little hard work ( you don't see middle aged ,dirty, tired coppers on these billboards or flyers, nor do you see bruised knuckles and torn uniforms)

Five-0fromSoCal
05-04-2006, 12:27 AM
You are so right, I never used to hear you guys coming over to us, it was always the other way around. The sheriffs laterals I've talked to all said exactly what you said, they didn't want to stay in custody any longer. I've heard several things from only 3 years in custody to 7 years.. And that's from your people I've heard this from so, who knows? As long as everyone has a job and everyone is happy at what they're doing.

It will be interesting to see if anything changes due to the contract we just ratified ( 18.5% for 2 yrs ). 5% last yr. 23.5 over 3 yrs isnt bad. Good luck with ur contract.

LA Copper
05-04-2006, 02:22 AM
It will be interesting to see if anything changes due to the contract we just ratified ( 18.5% for 2 yrs ). 5% last yr. 23.5 over 3 yrs isnt bad. Good luck with ur contract.

Thank you! Looks like we did ok but you guys did great! More power to you. You guys certainly deserve it after all this time. I remember when I first came on the job, you guys were always better paid then us. In recent years that turned around. Looks like we're back to where we started. Good luck to all of us!