Professional Courtesy

[RyanP]

If an off-duty officer is pulled over on a traffic stop, what is the unofficial protocol of informing that officer that you too are a police officer. It seems like there is the potential to offend a fellow officer there by conveying the attitude "here's my badge, guess you can't give me a ticket now". I was just wondering if there was an unofficial respectful manner of conveying this for consideration in whatever cause the officer had for making the stop.

[chris]

Ryan,
Try putting your licence in with your badge. But you have to set it up so the badge is seen accidently, not purposely. Then, when you go to get your licence, your badge will be seen by the LEO who stopped you.
This works for me.

http://www.officer.com/ubb/wink.gif

[This message has been edited by chris (edited 06-30-2000).]

[DesertRat]

It's not the approach as much as the attitude that comes with it. If one is ever going to display humility in their life, this would be an appropriate time. Just don't be a jerk. Be straight forward about who you are and apologetic about your actions if appropriate. Working in Vegas with 2000 of our own running around and who knows how many tourist, I seem to stop at least one every week.

[GDenman]

DesertRat is right. It's the attitude. I've seen some who think that professional courtesy is a given & boy are they upset when they get tagged. Be courteous & respectful & humble.

If you don't have the opportunity to "accidentally expose the badge", allow the conversation to open an opportunity to casually mention that you understand because of your work. You'll know how to phrase it & what to say.

[retired]

After 31 years in LE, I have to agree, be careful with your attitude, it can and has caused cops to get tickets. Quite frankly, there are some who are well deserving of the ticket.

Retired

[EV]

The two big things that will either help you out or slam you is your attitude and what you say.
A Sgt with the WHP pulled over a speeding motorist, who was a officer with the Chicago PD, Could tell right away by the CPD ball cap stuck in the rear windshield and the CPD union sticker on the bumper. First words out of his mouth was " I'm a cop from Chicago and cops don't give other cops tickets". While pushing his star in the SGT'S face.Needless to say, old serg had diptach call Chicago to verify if the officer realy was/ who he claimed to be and to make his stay along side the highway even longer. Especially on a nice hot Wyoming summer. The SGT told the vacationing CPD officer and his family to have a nice trip and stay, along with a PINK SLIP and a payment envelope.

[Badgeman]

I agree attitude is everything... I always say yes sir no sir...oh by the way sir... I know it doesn't make any difference but I thought you ought to know sir... I am a cop .. OK sir... I got some warning tickets from Texas DPS but besides that never had a problem.

[KenM]

Most of us are always armed or have weapons in the car. I make it a habit of letting the officer know that when I open my console to get my license and insurance that there is a pistol there. That lets them know about the weapon and when I don't give them a CHL they ask if I'm LE or not. Not much question when I hand my DL out, I got it renewed at my intoxilizer refresher and am in uniform. That said---I do not ask for any special consideration, though I do practice professional courtesy. If you have screwed up and got stopped you probably deserve what you get.

[Niteshift]

My approach is similar to Ken's.

I keep my hands on the wheel, dome light on if it's night. Before I reach anywhere I tell them "Before I reach anywhere, I just want to let you know, I am a police officer and I am carrying a gun." Most of the time they then ask to see my ID and I'm out of there. Once in a while, they'll ask where the gun is, then ask for the ID.

Working on a highway in a heavy tourist area, I stop a lot of cops, both from in and out of state. Most are pretty cool. I've come close to stroking a couple just on attitude, but still haven't. Where I have more attitude problems is from retired cops, often from NY/NJ. When they tell you they EXPECT some courtesy, they usually get a lesson in word choice. Expectations get disappointed, requests get honored.

I think the worst one I saw was an active NYPD cop doing 85 in a 45 construction zone (fines are doubled here in construction zones). A HP sgt. bluelighted the guy and I followed. The guy pulled into a gas station, got out and started pumping gas. The trooper asked him for his DL and the guy just threw his badge on the trunk and said "That's all you need to see." The trooper picked it up, looked at it, then tossed it into the grass "Doesn't look like a drivers license to me." I know NYPD gets paid more than we do, but a $534 ticket has to hurt no matter who you are. Press hard officer, you're making 5 copies.

[Sparky]

"Expectations get dissappointed. Requests get honored."

Ooooo. I like that line! I'll have to remember that one. http://www.officer.com/ubb/smile.gif

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-Sparky
Fiat justina.

[jaybeetee]

Yeah, what those guys said... http://www.officer.com/ubb/smile.gif "officer/trooper, for my safety, I gotta let you know that I'm an armed federal officer." Usually works. Unless I'm in Wyoming!! "Okay federal officer, the speed limit here is 65. That's a FEDERAL law!" Hah, couldn't argue w/that! I always plan on paying the ticket if I get stopped. After all, it is a violation of the law, and only drugcops are allowed to break laws at will...

[Tackleberry]

I too also let the Officer know that I am a LEO and that I am carrying a firearm. As stated earlier I either get asked where it's at or my I.D. gets checked out and everytime for me its been try and watch your speed and have a nice day. Your attitude is everything! I belive the biggest thing is letting the officer know of any weapons before he finds out! If this happens he will find out your identity the hard way! I will say a fellow officer did do this and let the officer know of his status and being armed and all the officer heard was "Gun!" and immediately pulled his gun and called backup. They then pulled him out felony style and he was hooked up till his cred's were verified. They called our department to verify this. The Sgt. of this officer was very considerate and apologetic but the officer in question was a real arse and with no apology given. But after all of this there was no ticket given either. The bottom line is try not to break the law and you won't have to be faced with this situation. If you do your attitude is everything!


Tac

[Niteshift]

Anytime Sparky.......I've worked traffic too long (When you start playing name that tune with the doppler tone, you've been doing it too long). Snappy comebacks are a requirement (besides, I have a smart mouth to begin with).

[kd5hqd]

Hey Jaybeetee, what branch of Federal LE are you in?? Just curious

Kyle

[movista]

These have worked wel for me and for cops that I have stopped:
"I'm such an idiot. One would think I should know better, with me being a cop".
When he asks for your DL: "It is in my back pocket, but before I start reaching, I want you to know that I have a weapon...I don't want any surprises." (that's the opener)
The accidental badge flash works best for me personally.

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Peace is not the absence of conflict, it is the presence of justice.

[ME AGAIN]

You can bet your bottom dollar that if I get stopped, I'm definitely going to let him know that I'm a police officer!!! But, I do it tactfully and I'm ALWAYS friendly. I've had two state troopers YELL at me during their tirade/lecture, but I've never been ticketed. One must always be humble in that situation. To get cocky is stupid.

If I pull over an officer, I won't ticket him, even if he is rude and obnoxious. I've only encountered one jerk in all my years.

[CaptSchmooze]

I have never been stopped, must be the slow family wagon I drive.
My plan is to let them know I am a cop right away so they don't stroke over my fanny pack etc. If they ticket me, oh well such is life.
I haven't stopped a cop either, I guess that shows how much time I have to put into traffic issues.

Schmooze

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Tights and a cape, the true uniform of a crime fighter.

[DARECOP]

Remeber we are cops. We shouldn't be doing anything that gets us pulled over including speeding. I have a hang up on that. Yes, occassionaly I am in a hurry. If I get caught then I get what I deserve. I'm not going to ask for "favors".

[Traffic Dog]

I just pulled over an LEO the other day and thought it was extremly slick the way he presented himself as an LEO.
After going through my usual speech I asked for his DL. He presents it, is polite and never lets on he is an LEO. As I look at his DL to verify some information I look at his photo. I observe a Motorola collar mike, a badge on what appears to be an LEO shirt. We get to talking find out he is an out-of-state trooper.
Talking to other guys on my shift we decided thats the way to do it.

[FinCop]

Originally posted by RyanP:
If an off-duty officer is pulled over on a traffic stop, what is the unofficial protocol of informing that officer that you too are a police officer. It seems like there is the potential to offend a fellow officer there by conveying the attitude "here's my badge, guess you can't give me a ticket now". I was just wondering if there was an unofficial respectful manner of conveying this for consideration in whatever cause the officer had for making the stop.

I keep my batch (it is like a credit card) and my driving licence so in my wallet, that I cannot show my car driving licence without showing my "batch" at the same time.

[Niteshift]

"I'm not going to ask for "favors"."

I don't ask, but I don't refuse them either. I extend the same courtesy to fire/EMS, dispatchers, corrections, Coast Guard and most of their immediate families too.

Personally, since I'm always armed. I keep my hands on the wheel and tell them I'm an LEO and carrying a gun before I move for anything.

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Niteshift-
Perseverate In Pugna

[Guard Dog]

As a LEO for 27 years I've stopped many other LEO's, especially since I work suburban Chicago. Yea some of you are right that cops can be jerks but what is the one thing we can give our own? It's the courtesy pass. Unless the LEO is really a total jerk (Like the NYPD example) I give them a pass. I've been stopped and say very humbly that I should known better, I've been a cop for XX years etc etc. I have always been asked for a ID and always given a pass. The Chicago PD will let you out of most jams when the out of towner needs it, We reciprocate.

Word of warning. If your in Wisconsin, forget it. Wisconsin State patol will write you,, end of story. They even write cops on duty in police cars.

[Mitzi]

I have a friend that is a Highway Patrol trooper. He was telling a story about stopping a fellow cop.
He clocked a car going 100 miles an hour and stopped it (speed limit was 60).
The man driving was a young cop from a small county downstate. The young cop got out of his car and showed Bill his badge and said, "Professional courtesy?"
Bill said he looked at him and said, "Son, as a cop, you definitely should know better." And he wrote him a ticket. The young cop got really angry and asked Bill to call his supervisor. The supervisor sided with Bill. The cop told them, "So, fellow cops are gonna make me lose my job?" To which Bill answered, "You did that to yourself."
Bill told me later he did not think the cop would lose his job but he certainly would suffer some repurssions from the incident. He said it was an oppurtunity to teach a young man a lesson.

[Niteshift]

Depending on his record, it might cost him his job, but it's still his fault.

We recently let an (part-time) officer resign because of his off duty driving. He got 2 speeding tickets in a year, including a triple digit speed. In his defense, he didn't badge his way out of them, instead trying his full-time employment as a CO (at a Wackenhut prison). However, after both tickets, a suspension from running radar and a article in the local paper about his driving habits, he got caught and did badge himself out of it. The troopers sgt. called me and we talked about it. He was doing 30+ over. We asked for his resignation.

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Niteshift-
Perseverate In Pugna

[Dave T]

Working in a City with two Interstates (I40 and I85) I often pull over officers both from within my State and those passing through. The way they are treated by me depends soley upon their ability to show me the respect that being in "my house" dictates. Fortunately, I have only had a single individual that required a friendly reminder as to his proper place.

Remember that it is the Officers discretion as to whether we writes you or not. Be courteous and chances are you will be on your way. Be an ***** and you will be enlightened. Or your wallet will be lightened about $340 in the I85 workzone. A financial attitude adjustment.

Be nice - Be gone
Attitude $uck$ - Costs Bucks

Personally, I use the gun in the console scenario. Never had a problem - I spend most of my time in two cities - and my wife is a PO in the other one.

Stay Safe
Dave

[Mitzi]

My neice and her husband ae both police officers. Her brother (my nephew) is a rookie. We were all sitting around talking at Thanksgiving and my neice saw my other nephew open the car door. She got really mad at her brother because he was supposed to have it locked because his gun was in there. Both she and her husband registered their concern over it with him. She was right when she said, "You just can't forget that, Larry."

[Glockarmorer]

I am a firm believer in professional courtesy. However, I have observed that different regions of the country have different perspectives about this.

This is seems especially true in the northeast. I have had some social interactions with some cops from the NY area and it seemed to me that to them a badge was a license to do just about anything you wanted. Professional courtesy wasn't just expected, it was demanded, and by the way, how dare you detain me by stopping me for speeding?

One of these officers, who vactations in this area quite frequently, was stopped by the Highway Patrol one night and thought that by merely hanging his badge out the window, the blue lights would get turned off and he'd be on his way. Instead, he got a trip to the county jail AFTER a stop at the station for a breath test first.

On the flip side, one of the Sgts who works for me got stopped in GA by a GSP trooper. He didn't want to seem too pushy about being a cop, so he hesitated to tell the trooper that he was. Problem is, he waited TOO long, until after the trooper had written him the ticket. Apparently GSP tickets are closely monitored by their powers that be and the trooper could not rescind the ticket once it had been written. Trooper told him he should have said something sooner. He ended up paying the ticket.

BTW, for all of those wives and girlfriends out there...here's one my wife came up with all by herself.

COP: "Ma'am, I stopped you for going 70 in a 55"

WIFE: (Batting eyelashes)"Gosh, I'm awful sorry officer. I didn't realize I was going that fast, but I know those radars don't lie because my husband's a deputy sheriff." http://www.officer.com/ubb/smile.gif

Worked like a charm!

G.A.

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No cops, know anarchy.

[Blue23]

>>Where I have more attitude problems is from retired cops, often from NY/NJ.<<

I would except better from you shifty. Such a sweeping statement, and from a guy who hates sweeping statements? http://www.officer.com/ubb/confused.gif

>>This is seems especially true in the northeast. I have had some social interactions with some cops from the NY area and it seemed to me that to them a badge was a license to do just about anything you wanted. Professional courtesy wasn't just expected, it was demanded, and by the way, how dare you detain me by stopping me for speeding?<<

ROTFL. Are you attempting to say something? Or jumping on the bubba bandwagon? Put alot of thought into that comment huh http://www.officer.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif

[Monty Ealerman]

Guard Dog:

Judging from your profile, and your comments, I'm assuming you work for the Cook County Sheriff's Police.

There's a certain amount of rivalry, along with the deeper consanguinity, between the CPD police and the CCS police, but the Wisconsin thing is ludicruous.

Other than by displaying a presumptuous or otherwise objectionable attitude, just about the only way for a police officer from anywhere to get a ticket from a Chicago police officer is by being from Wisconsin.

They write CPD officers regularly, so they're the only officers that regularly don't get a break in Chicago.

It's not too difficult to understand it, despite how absurd it is. I think it started from CPD officers presuming they could drive in Wisconsin the way they do in Chicago, and getting impatient when the Wisconsin State Police weren't putting up with it.

Once the Chicago Police started retaliating by not extending courtesy to Wisconsin officers, the relationship cemented to what it is now.

There was one case where Wisconsin officers arrested a uniformed CPD officer, who was driving a marked Chicago patrol unit, for carrying a firearm in Wisconsin. He was legitimately there to pick someone up on an extradition, and had the papers to prove it. After a short time, he was released, firearm and all, but it was guilty until proven innocent.

It seems to me that the Wisconsin police should come to the Taste of Chicago, and the Chicago police should go to Summerfest in Wisconsin, and everyone should make nice and rub shoulders like nice police officers and agree to let all the petty fueding fade into the past. It was probably started by a few obnoxious guys, and now all the others seem stuck with it.

It sure wouldn't hurt if nobody did any presuming.

Regards,

Monty

[This message has been edited by Monty Ealerman (edited 11-29-2000).]

[Glockarmorer]

Originally posted by Blue23:
ROTFL. Are you attempting to say something? Or jumping on the bubba bandwagon? Put alot of thought into that comment huh http://www.officer.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif



I thought it was pretty clear what I was saying. Which part didn't you understand? Maybe I should type more slowly.

COPS....FROM....DIFFERENT.....REGIONS.....ACT..... DIFFERENTLY.....JUST......LIKE.....ANY....OTHER... .. PEOPLE....FROM.....DIFFERENT...REGIONS.

This is based on personal, firsthand observations. Put a lot of thought in it? Yeah, about 10 years as a cop.

I see you've retired to NC, but not FROM NC, I'll wager. Thanks for validating my theory, BUBBA!

(SIGH) Yet another carpetbagger! LMAO


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No cops, know anarchy.

[This message has been edited by Rebecca (edited 12-14-2000).]

[David]

Glock,

In reference to your remark about the Georgia State Trooper, Their tickets are closly monitored. Back in the late 70's or early 80's the GSP Commissioner lost his job over a ticket.

As for the thread's inquiry. If I'm ever stopped, my hands would be on the steering wheel, interior light on if after dark and a warning that I'm armed.

If they should ask where the weapon is located, my answer would be, "Which one?"

It's going to be an automatic inquiry as to if you have a right to be armed. At that time the answer will be yes because of being a LEO.

What happens afterward is going to be his call. I will treat him as I would want to be treated... on knees groveling humbly with head bowed?

Don't discredit the proffession by copping an attitude. There are enough people standing in line out there to do it already...

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I'm lost...I've gone to look for myself. If I should return before I get back, please ask me to wait. Thanks, David!

[This message has been edited by David (edited 11-30-2000).]

[Blue23]

Originally posted by Glockarmorer:
I thought it was pretty clear what I was saying. Which part didn't you understand? Maybe I should type more slowly.

COPS....FROM....DIFFERENT.....REGIONS..... ACT.....DIFFERENTLY.....JUST......LIKE..... ANY....OTHER.....PEOPLE....FROM..... DIFFERENT...REGIONS.

This is based on personal, firsthand observations. Put a lot of thought in it? Yeah, about 10 years as a cop.

I see you've retired to NC, but not FROM NC, I'll wager. Thanks for validating my theory, BUBBA!

(SIGH) Yet another carpetbagger! LMAO




Ok, you seem like pretty much of a wiseas*. Tell me Resort Cop, how is that validating your point hammerhead? You made a foolish comment based on a few "northern Cops" you met.

Now you said this with your "punky wiseas* mode button on".:


>>COPS....FROM....DIFFERENT.....REGIONS.....ACT... .. DIFFERENTLY.....JUST......LIKE.....ANY.... OTHER.....PEOPLE....FROM..... DIFFERENT...REGIONS.<<


That IS....NOT...WHAT...YOU...SAID...BUBBA!!!! You made a stupid comment. You sound like a real punk http://www.officer.com/ubb/wink.gif

[This message has been edited by Rebecca (edited 12-14-2000).]

[ME AGAIN]

Originally posted by Guard Dog:
Word of warning. If your in Wisconsin, forget it. Wisconsin State patol will write you,, end of story. They even write cops on duty in police cars.

In my state, one of our officers was enroute to a routine bank alarm (at midnight-- not open for business). He was going about 65 mph in a 45 mph zone on a deserted 7 lane highway. He was not running his lights or siren because there was nobody else on the road. A state trooper attempted to pull him over (believe it or not!). She had her lights and siren going, but the officer kept going to his call. I can't imagine what was going through his head.

He gets to the call and the trooper attempts to stop him from going up to the alarm and she demanded to see his license. He said, "Get away from me bitc*! I'm on duty at a bank alarm!" They got into an argument-- a BIG argument.

The end of the story: They both got suspended for a couple of days by their respective agencies.

Sad sad sad. In my opinion, the trooper was derelict for trying to stop a marked police car, and naturally, the officer was wrong for cursing at the trooper. He never did surrender his license and he "handled his bank alarm."

[Niteshift]

"Such a sweeping statement, and from a guy who hates sweeping statements?"

I do hate sweeping statements, which is why I didn't make one.

I said: Where I have more attitude problems is from retired cops, often from NY/NJ.

If I had said: Every retired NY/NJ cop has an attitude problem.....then I'd be guilty as charge.

But "I" qualifies it as my personal experience. "More" shows a greater number, but not the total number. "Often" shows a frequency greater than other, but not the total.

Come on Blue, find something good to bust my chops over http://www.officer.com/ubb/tongue.gif



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Niteshift-
Perseverate In Pugna

[Glockarmorer]

Well Blue,

If I did have my "punky wiseas" mode on, you initiated it by pushing the "on" button with your juvenile name calling, BUBBA.

I have to assume you were probably a big city cop in the Northeast, which is why I'm just a "resort cop". Tell me, how many years of skimming and protection payoffs did it take before you saved up enough money to retire in Dixie?

I'll be passing right through NC next Monday on my way to the DEA Drug Unit Commander's Academy in Quantico, VA. I'd be more than happy to stop in on my way and discuss this with you in person. Pick an exit.

G.A.

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No cops, know anarchy.

[This message has been edited by Glockarmorer (edited 11-30-2000).]

[David Mudd]

Originally posted by ME AGAIN:

Sad sad sad. In my opinion, the trooper was derelict for trying to stop a marked police car, and naturally, the officer was wrong for cursing at the trooper. He never did surrender his license and he "handled his bank alarm."


IMHO..the trooper is lucky she did not get arrested on the spot. I would have also probably had a few choice words like, "Are you out of your ******* mind????"
I've known officers to give out of state, or even out of jurisdiction, officers who were exceeding the speed limit in a marked vehicle a warning (which I feel is chicken****). I mean, if they want to run the risk of a complaint, so be it. I'm certainly not going to complicate matters. Speeding is just not that big of a deal to me...no matter who is doing it. However, I would never presume to stop a marked cruiser operating within it's jurisdiction for ANY type of traffic violation short of it appearing to be out of control or there being an BOLO for a stolen cruiser.
If this idiot trooper wanted to check on what the officer was doing, I'm sure she could have done so very easily by using her radio. She should have been more interested in offering back-up than filling out one more citation.

[ME AGAIN]

Originally posted by David Mudd:
If this idiot trooper wanted to check on what the officer was doing...she should have been more interested in offering back-up than filling out one more citation.


You got that right! After the trooper's major chewed her out and told her to never stop another police car, she had another weird incident. She stopped a speeding civilian car with a uniformed officer in it driving home. The trooper said, "I'm gonna cut you a break for speeding, but I'm gonna have to write you for something, so I'll just write you for not wearing a seatbelt (he was wearing a seatbelt!!!). The officer took the ticket to the trooper's main headquarters and told her major, "If she wants to write me a ticket for speeding, 'ok', but when she starts falsefying documents (for writing him a ticket for wearing his seatbelt), then its wrong!" The trooper got in trouble again. She is still out & about, as we speak.

Even law enforcements has its idiots. We try to "hide" them, due to embarresment.

[ME AGAIN]

Originally posted by Glockarmorer:
you initiated it by pushing the "on" button with your juvenile name calling, BUBBA.

Tell me, how many years of skimming and protection payoffs did it take before you saved up enough money to retire in Dixie?

I'll be passing right through NC next Monday . I'd be more than happy to stop in on my way and discuss this with you in person. Pick an exit.

Lighten up. This is only the internet. We are a brotherhood and we forgive eachother & stick up for eachother, after we get over our madness. Let it go, brothers...

[Blue23]

>>Well Blue,
If I did have my "punky wiseas" mode on, you initiated it by pushing the "on" button with your juvenile name calling, BUBBA.<<

Bubba is a term of endearment, or so I have been told. Can

[Blue23]

Brother Me Again

The bottom line is even though GA is acting like a blockhead. If he was alone with his back to the wall facing an angry mob, I'd bull my way in to stand at his side.

Keep the faith brother, that is ALL we have!

[Dave T]

Blue,

Do me a favor, don't tell me who you are when I pull you over in NC. It is attitudes like yours that I can't tolerate. Since you probably live in the triangle area (most likely someplace like Cary - Containment Area for Relocating Yankees) chances are one day you will look in the mirror and I'll be there.

Oh and yes, I am also from the NE. In fact I have two brothers - One is a Narcotics Detective (NYPD) and the other is a Trooper in Westchester. And when I visit, as I often do, I make sure that if I am pulled I treat the Officer with the respect his position demands.

Make fun of Cops in the south? Let me tell you something pal => I wouldn't trade the worst Officer in my Department for the best you ever worked with.

Glock,

If ever you are in NC feel free to drop in. I am sure Bronze, Radar, or myself would be glad to have a visit from a "brother". Perhaps you can take a look at the 19 for me.

[Blue23]

>>I do hate sweeping statements, which is why I didn't make one.
I said: Where I have more attitude problems is from retired cops, often from NY/NJ.
If I had said: Every retired NY/NJ cop has an attitude problem.....then I'd be guilty as charge.
But "I" qualifies it as my personal experience. "More" shows a greater number, but not the total number. "Often" shows a frequency greater than other, but not the total. <<


Come on Nite, you know full well what it is implying. I

[Blue23]

>>Do me a favor, don't tell me who you are when I pull you over in NC. It is attitudes like yours that I can't tolerate. Since you probably live in the triangle area (most likely someplace like Cary - Containment Area for Relocating Yankees) chances are one day you will look in the mirror and I'll be there.
Oh and yes, I am also from the NE. In fact I have two brothers - One is a Narcotics Detective (NYPD) and the other is a Trooper in Westchester. And when I visit, as I often do, I make sure that if I am pulled I treat the Officer with the respect his position demands. <<


What in the Good Lord

[nightcop]

I live in Missouri along the Kansas/Missouri state line. I have personally given KHP Troopers breaks on speeding. These troopers were also always armed like the rest of us. I was at a training seminar the other and was amazed when I was informed that KHP will write you ticket no matter who you are. And they will also arrest you for carrying concealed because Kansas does not allow off duty LEO's to carry concealed. On duty you are fine though.

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It's not how a man dies that is remembered. It's how he lived.

[Don]

Professional Courtesy. . .

Act like a professional, you will get courtesy from me. Act like a jerk, I will respond in kind. I extended PC to firemen and medics as well as LE.

That is the way I always handled it when I was on the job.

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"Don't pee on my leg and tell me it's raining". . . Judge Judy
6P1 (retired)

[Niteshift]

"you know full well what it is implying."

I DO know full well what I meant. You are the one guessing. I'm not IMPLYING anything. I made a simple statement of fact based on my experience. Say what you want about your guess at my "real" meaning, but before you do, consider that 4 members of my family and some of the closest friends I have are cops in the NE. Not to mention several of my co-workers who are ex-NY/NJ cops and several friends who are retired from the NY/NJ area.

"have read through all the shots at the northeast."

And how many of those were from me? If you would open your eyes a little, you'd know that few people on here defend cops from all over the country more vigorously than I do.

"Just as many attitude problem Cops in Florida as northeast."

And I never said there wasn't.

"Do we need to take cheap shots at eachother."

The "cheap shots" started out as good natured ribbing, until some got a burr under their saddle blanket over it.

"In this case the both of you are out of line."

If I had any of the motives you're stating, I would be out of line. However, since I didn't, I don't think I'm out of line. I can't speak for any other members intent, but I do know what mine was.

"Now, are you gonna want to meet me at an exit too?"

No, that's not me. First, I don't feel insulted. Second, I'm not insulting anyone (although you seem to think that I am). Third, I don't think that meeting you at an exit would solve anything, unless you were in need of a cup of coffee. I'd be happy to buy you one. http://www.officer.com/ubb/smile.gif

I guess my bottom line here is that I had no intent to insult anyone. If you took it that way, I hope that I've explained my position enough. I don't have a fight with you and I'd think by now you'd know me well enough to know that cop-bashing is pretty low on my list of things to do.


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Niteshift-
Perseverate In Pugna

[NYFLATFOOT]

Whew, well in NY its an unwritten rule, YOU NEVER WRITE ANOTHER COP! it just does not happen or you will open a huge can of worms with a department war on each other. If I pull over another LEO (and I get a lot! I cover 3 counties) and they try the attitude, (which is usually the rookies) ask them one question, "Does you Lt know your an *******? NO? well hes about to find out if you dont stop where you are" That usually works. I only had one instance where I had a problem.
A Trooper here was pulled over for cutting across a dirt parking lot to beat the light and lets say he was not going slow. Of course there was a long line at the light and he did this in front of a marked car.
Well to make a long story short, I let him go with the usual "Hey give me a break when you do a dumbass move like that what do you think Im gonna do,not pull you over? Well he had the attitude and as he was driving away he said "thanks for wasting my ****ing time"!
Of course I pulled him over again down the road and made his zone Sgt come out and give him a Attitiude adjustment. (figures, he had 2 years on the job 2.)
If you write another cop your being a real *** in my opinion, and if you are the one being pulled over and you give him a hard time your even the bigger ***!Remember one thing we have the greatest tool in the world! officers discretion, oh yeah and a secret weapo! its called his supervisor! If hes a real ballbreaker a phonecall to a Shift Sgt goes a long way to correct the attitude!

[Ksfuzz]

Well, I just had to get in on this one.....

NYFLAT and BLUE, having been from the NE and being a police officer, before moving on to the much warmer and snowless Midwest, I have to agree with Glock and Nightshift. I cannot count on both hands and toes, the amount of times I stopped NYPD officers (on the job, or retired)who had their badges out the window before we even got stopped. I've even had numerous officer think by flashing badges they could get out of a DUI, because they were "on the job".

Now I believe in extending professional courtesy, but first off the officer expecting it better be professional when he's stopped, and there are just some offences that courtesy will not be extended on, DUI being one of them.

Sorry you may think I'm downing NYPD, but don't forget, not everybody is NYPD (CPD, LAPD, etc), and you need to treat the officer who stopped you like he's your best friend if you want the courtesy!

The majority of police officers in large cities spend thier time running call to call, and traffic is something for "whimps". Well unfortunately, there are a whole lot more smaller departments, who make just as many arrests off of traffic stops. Being a beat officer you may not like or care about how people drive, but the rest of us generally do, expecially when we are also accident investigators, DUI investigators, Drug Interdiction officers, etc...

Restpect goes a long ways....respect the job I do, as I respect the job you do....Kudos to officers who work multiple shootings ect, all day long.....Not something I want to do, just as I'm sure you don't want to work multi-car and injury accidents.

Treat me like a professional and I will do the same for you.

Hang your badge out the window before we even get stopped, or cop an "I'm better than you" attitude and you'll be signing my ticket, plus answering to your supervisor, because I do make phone calls!

Stay Safe!

[JWilson]

I agree that attitude is a deciding factor. I have heard of and personally seen many of the aforementioned methods. Let me add another. Both methods allow for the officer stopping you to make his/her own decision whether to cite you. Trying to take away an officers discretion is not cool (ie, "Professional courtesty. You have to let me go.").

- Give your police ID card with your driver's license. The officer will look at both and the decision will be his/hers. Relying on a "badge flash" is not always reliable.

- A more direct approach: Ask the officer, "Would it do any good to tell you that I'm a cop?" Puts the ball in his/her court. Totally the officers discretion. If they still want to cite me, so be it. I'll pay it; no problem, no hard feelings.

Having been a cop's kid growing up, I was pulled over twice. Both times I didn't say my father was a cop (for the same agency) until it was too late. Both times when the officer found out, he said that I should have said something. I realize now that it is better to just be up front with the whole thing. Besides, it's just a ticket. It's not like I get a bonus (or a toaster prize) if write over 100 tickets a month. If I can't give a warning now and then, then I need to remove the stick from my as*.

[DesertRat]

Can't we all just get along?


If not, let's just pick on the Wyoming Highway Patrol. There's none of them here to defend themselves http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

[ME AGAIN]

Originally posted by NYFLATFOOT:
its an unwritten rule, YOU NEVER WRITE ANOTHER COP!

If you write another cop your being a real *** in my opinion, and if you are the one being pulled over and you give him a hard time your even the bigger ***!

Remember one thing we have the greatest tool in the world! officers discretion
You hit the nail on the head. I couldn't have said it better. For the reasons you stated, I refuse to write another cop (even if he is a jerk).

[Guard Dog]

Originally posted by Monty Ealerman:
Guard Dog:

Judging from your profile, and your comments, I'm assuming you work for the Cook County Sheriff's Police.

There's a certain amount of rivalry, along with the deeper consanguinity, between the CPD police and the CCS police, but the Wisconsin thing is ludicruous.

Other than by displaying a presumptuous or otherwise objectionable attitude, just about the only way for a police officer from anywhere to get a ticket from a Chicago police officer is by being from Wisconsin.

They write CPD officers regularly, so they're the only officers that regularly don't get a break in Chicago.

It's not too difficult to understand it, despite how absurd it is. I think it started from CPD officers presuming they could drive in Wisconsin the way they do in Chicago, and getting impatient when the Wisconsin State Police weren't putting up with it.

Once the Chicago Police started retaliating by not extending courtesy to Wisconsin officers, the relationship cemented to what it is now.

There was one case where Wisconsin officers arrested a uniformed CPD officer, who was driving a marked Chicago patrol unit, for carrying a firearm in Wisconsin. He was legitimately there to pick someone up on an extradition, and had the papers to prove it. After a short time, he was released, firearm and all, but it was guilty until proven innocent.

It seems to me that the Wisconsin police should come to the Taste of Chicago, and the Chicago police should go to Summerfest in Wisconsin, and everyone should make nice and rub shoulders like nice police officers and agree to let all the petty fueding fade into the past. It was probably started by a few obnoxious guys, and now all the others seem stuck with it.

It sure wouldn't hurt if nobody did any presuming.

Regards,

Monty

[This message has been edited by Monty Ealerman (edited 11-29-2000).]


To Monty,
Re read my post and you'll see that we agree. Chicago PD and just about all suburban departments realize that we are a fraternity and do not profit from writing each other when a pass will suffice. As for Wisconsin..... I stand by my statement. We were working a homicide and one of our det's was bringing back evidence from the perp's house in Wisc. Wisc State patrol stopped him for speeding and damn near took him to jail becasue he was armed. He made our guy unload and disassemble his weapon and lock it in the trunk. We border Wisc and even the Wisconsin Deputies tell us that they get tickets from the Wisc State Patrol.

I agree that it is foolishness for them to not join hands and end it. As for Chicago..you guys are great. I can not remember any MCHENRY CO deputy ever writing a cop. (but some deserved it) Like I said it's the only thing we can give each other. It's not unprofessional it called discretion. http://www.officer.com/ubb/smile.gif

[Saurus]

Just came here after a visitor to my website emailed me asking for my impressions of this professional courtesy discussion.

By way of intro, I am retired from the NYPD since 1994 after serving 25 years, the last 17 in one of the toughest precincts in the city. Member of the NYPD Honor Legion and recipient of numerous awards for service and bravery. Not bragging - just FYI. In other words, I've "been there - done that."

So here I am and reading this stuff and I'm disgusted. What do I see but cops flaming other jobs, bragging about burning other cops, and generally acting like a bunch of macho posturing nitwits.

Hey fellas - aren't there enough ******* out there who HATE COPS to screw with without giving one of our own a hard time? I've had a few bad experiences with other cops myself - including, unfortunately, cops from my own job - but in 25 years in the street I never burned another cop. For a *traffic ticket* you'd let most civilians slide on you'd burn a fellow cop? What the hell is wrong with some of you? I stop you, I ask for your ID card (shields don't count). Show me your card and "Please be careful, see ya around" and you're on your way. You want to pull an attitude? So I call your PBA delegate when I go into the stationhouse and he takes it to you personally. If you're REAL nasty I call a senior patrol sergeant and let him chat with you. But burn you? Nope.

Somebody mentioned a guy waving his shield out the window. I've seen it and had it happen to me also. Yeah - it ****es me off too. So tell the guy what I do - that what we as cops do to or for each other is OUR business and to keep his ID inside the car where it belongs. Then tell him goodbye.

Personally, I have had nothing but good contacts with cops wherever I travel to, but then I don't speed or screw around and don't get stopped much. On the one occasion I did, I do what I tell civilians to do and others have said - hands on the wheel, domelight on, window down, inform I am PO and armed and ask what he wants me to do. I have never gotten burned by another cop because I know that when I'm off duty or now retired - the guy in uniform on the clock is BOSS and I treat him respectfully.

I've also stopped to assist on duty cops all over the northeast both whiole working and now in retirement, and always got a thank you for it.

People - there are scumbags out there who will cap a cop for no other reason than they ARE cops. There are people who will burn a cop in a heartbeat. Do we really need petty differences and jealousies getting between us? We are, or should be, brothers. There are only something like 600,000 of us in the country. STICK TOGETHER!

For more on my feelings about this crap see my websites law enforcement area.

Bruce
NYPD, Retired http://www.geocities.com/bemmott

[ME AGAIN]

http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif Amen! http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

[Pnutt]

I agree with Saurus. http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

As a non LEO member of Officer.Com, I was appalled at what was said to Blue 23 by a couple of our officers. http://www.officer.com/ubb/frown.gif It was uncalled for and, imho, he deserves an apology.

Connie http://www.officer.com/ubb/frown.gif



[This message has been edited by Pnutt (edited 12-11-2000).]

[David Mudd]

There is a whole lot of truth to what Saurus has said. One thing to remember though..if we stop a cop from out of state and he/she becomes an a**, we most likely won't have a PBA rep or supervisor to call. I've never bumped another cop either (FBI doesn't count! http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif) but there have been stories related to me where, had I stopped them, I probably would have cited them. Professional courtesy needs to run both ways on a traffic stop.
I agree with Saurus when he says that it's ridiculous for us to quabble among ourselves when we've got sh**heads waiting to take us on. However, cops are people too and there are going to be cases where one cop just flat out doesn't like another cop...for whatever reason. Especially in an area like mine where you have a lot of smaller departments.
Another factor in all this is that law enforcement is just not the brotherhood it used to be. There are many things that contribute to this, the first being that most new officers, upon being hired...are already looking for a larger, better paying department. There is no longevity that allows for relationships to grow, both with officers on the same department and surrounding agencies.
Another chink in the armor is, and I am right smack dab in this category, cops don't associate with each other as much in their off duty time. My reasons are simple...I would much rather be hanging out with my son than swapping war stories at a bar. That's also the reason why I don't work off duty jobs. I have to get away from work and by extension...people associated with it. There are a few fellow officers that I will do dinner with, or grill out or whatever...but they also like to be "off" when they are "off".
The last reason we aren't the "thin blue line" anymore is because of everything you see in the news. We are becoming so afraid of civil liability and losing all we have that we strive to maintain a distance from others so that, if they go down, we won't go with them. I'm not implying that we are doing anything wrong because, as we have seen, you can do everything right and still be crucified. I'll give you a for instance..I have a friend who is the chaplain for a PD in Kentucky. He was riding with a third shift officer and a shots fired call came out near a projects area. They were dispatched and upon arrival, they found no one around and cleared the call. However, they were the ONLY unit that responded. 5-10 years ago...it would have been raining police on that call! The officers in that department want no contact with anyone, suspects, complainants, victims...even other officers. It's just too risky nowadays!!
Well..that's certainly more than my .02 worth. http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

[Guard Dog]

Saurus said....
"Hey fellas - aren't there enough ******* out there who HATE COPS to screw with without giving one of our own a hard time? "


Bravo and well said! As I said before cops should not write other cops. It's our discretion. Cops should not abuse the professional courtesy by making an *** of themselves and placing a brother or sister officer with a tough decision of whether to write or not. We have to stick together. North/South East or West, Getto or resort town. It's not a race to write tickets. Save the ink for the real ********! http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif


[This message has been edited by Guard Dog (edited 12-11-2000).]

[Blue23]

Connie thanks for you

[Saurus]

Originally posted by David Mudd:
There is a whole lot of truth to what Saurus has said. One thing to remember though..if we stop a cop from out of state and he/she becomes an a**, we most likely won't have a PBA rep or supervisor to call.

That may be true, but what does that mean? We throw out the rules because of "what ifs?" It's up to us to maintain the standards we've always used. Things change because we LET them change. Rookies should be taught by seasoned officers how to act. We sacrifice too much "introduction to police work" to the damned movies.

I've never bumped another cop either (FBI doesn't count! http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif) but there have been stories related to me where, had I stopped them, I probably would have cited them. Professional courtesy needs to run both ways on a traffic stop.


Of course it does, and I said that much. The working cop is Boss on the street. New cops have to put their macho posturing aside when off duty and understand getting a pass from another cop is a "courtesy" - not a right.

I agree with Saurus when he says that it's ridiculous for us to quabble among ourselves when we've got sh**heads waiting to take us on. However, cops are people too and there are going to be cases where one cop just flat out doesn't like another cop...for whatever reason. Especially in an area like mine where you have a lot of smaller departments.

As I said - we have to get over the jelousies and squabbles. We are all *cops first*. Have any of you really liked every single cop on your own department? I doubt it. Do you go all out when an assist comes over the radio - knowing full well the cop needing help is a guy you don't especially like? Why do you ... because before anything else - he is a brother officer. The same has to apply to inter-department contacts.

Another factor in all this is that law enforcement is just not the brotherhood it used to be. There are many things that contribute to this, the first being that most new officers, upon being hired...are already
<snip>

If we are not the brotherhood we used to be - and anyone who was on the job in the 60's know how tight we used to be - we *should* be now and it's our own fault if it isn't. Cops have always been their own worst enemy.

The last reason we aren't the "thin blue line" anymore is because of everything you see in the news. We are becoming so afraid of civil liability and losing all we have that we strive to maintain a distance from others so that, if they go down, we won't go with them. I'm not implying that we are doing anything wrong because, as we have seen, you can do everything right and still be crucified. I'll give you a for instance.I have a friend who is the chaplain for a PD in Kentucky. He was riding with a third shift officer and a shots fired call came out near a projects area. They were dispatched and upon arrival, they found no one around and cleared the call. However, they were the ONLY unit that responded. 5-10 years ago...it would have been raining police on that call! The officers in that department want no contact with anyone, suspects, complainants, victims...even other officers. It's just too risky nowadays!! Well..that's certainly more than my .02 worth.

It's not my intention to come in here and flame anybody, but all I can say to this last is any cop who thinks like that should saddle up and find a new career. Police work is dangerous in more ways than one, but it's also about the most personally rewarding career one can choose. You have to be made for the job to be good at it, and you have to have the cujones to take it for what it is. Anyone who doesn't just doesn't belong. Guys like this make it more difficult to do the job properly in the first place. If you do your job properly, don't step on peoples right with impunity, treat people right and respectfully until the circumstances demand otherwise ... you have no problem. For my own part, I was in the top 5% of my command in felony arrests, moving violations and officer initiated contacts. In 25 years of this I got *ONE* civilian complaint and that was tossed out when I appeared at CCRB and the complainant said I was not the officer who abused him and was in fact the only officer who took the time to explain why he was stopped and tossed. Is anyone here going to tell me you have to act like a goon to be an effective officer? Part of the problems between big city cops and town cops is a big city cop handles more calls for service and has more contact with the public than most local cops handle in months if not a year. That's just the way it is and doesn't imply one is better than the other. I saw enough NYC cops who couldn't make a pimple on a good cops butt, and a few local cops who would have been stars on a big city job. The two are not mutually exclusive. We have to get past that and remember the important things, such as .... if you find yourself rolling around in the street some night with no backup available for who knows how long ... just who the hell do you think is gonna help you if not another cop/ex-cop/off-duty cop? Remember that the next time you're inclined to burn another cop for bull***, or challenge another cop to a fight.



------------------
Bruce
NYPD, retired
http://www.geocities.com/bemmott

[Saurus]

Originally posted by Ksfuzz:
Well, I just had to get in on this one.....

NYFLAT and BLUE, having been from the NE and being a police officer, before moving on to the much warmer and snowless Midwest, I have to agree with Glock and Nightshift. I cannot count on both hands and toes, the amount of times I stopped NYPD officers (on the job, or retired)who had their badges out the window before we even got stopped. I've even had numerous officer think by flashing badges they could get out of a DUI, because they were "on the job".


Well - I have to weigh in on this one ...
I don't know how long many of you have been on the job, but I can't begin to tell you how many people - cops included - I've driven home after a routine stop gave me PC for a DUI. It's not because I'd like ther same courtesy - I don't drink - it's that as mentioned in othe threads we have a lot of discretion. People make mistakes. They may blow an impaired after having a few glasses of wine after dinner, depending on their body weight. Does that necessarily make them a hazard? I don't think so. If you're talking an accident scene or similar, that's another thing - but a routine stop and smell booze? Nope. If a guy lived reasonably close I'd take them home and keep his car keys and tell his wife or whatever he could pick them up at the stationhouse the next day. I've also put guys in their back seat and taken the keys and told them to sleep it off and I'd see them in the morning after I went EOT.

We don't HAVE to collar everyone we contact.
I guess maybe I'm more of a dinosaur than I thought....


------------------
Bruce
NYPD, retired
http://www.geocities.com/bemmott

[David Mudd]

Originally posted by Saurus:
If you do your job properly, don't step on peoples right with impunity, treat people right and respectfully until the circumstances demand otherwise ... you have no problem. For my own part, I was in the top 5% of my command in felony arrests, moving violations and officer initiated contacts. In 25 years of this I got *ONE* civilian complaint and that was tossed out when I appeared at CCRB and the complainant said I was not the officer who abused him and was in fact the only officer who took the time to explain why he was stopped and tossed.
if you find yourself rolling around in the street some night with no backup available for who knows how long ... just who the hell do you think is gonna help you if not another cop/ex-cop/off-duty cop? Remember that the next time you're inclined to burn another cop for bull***, or challenge another cop to a fight.

First, please don't take what I posted previously as a statement of how I feel. They are only observations I have made over the last ten years. Another thing is, the incident that I cited occurred in a department where moral is very low because the chief will not back his officers should they be forced to defend themselves.
Now, as to what you have stated about doing your job properly, not stepping on peoples rights, etc....and therefore you will have no problems, I have to disagree. I know a great many officers that are model officers, high in activity, but generate complaints. I believe your experiences are different probably because of the way your department handles complaints. There are things that officers are complained on here that are incredibly stupid. I once took a complaint because I didn't cite everyone in the car for a violation, only the driver (seatbelt). The driver believed I was singling her out, even though they were her friends in the car. It actually went to our city council before it was resolved. Incredible!!
You also mentioned that veterans need to train the rookies how to act. This is very true. The problem is that there aren't that many "veteran" officers around anymore. Most of the cops that were cops in the 70's and early 80's are retired now. "Veteran" is a relative term...it can mean anyone with 5-20 years on. A lot of FTO's have only 5 years.
You mentioned that you have to have cajones to do this job and to take it for what it is. True, but it used to be that you needed them to take on the scum that you would deal with daily. Now, it's to do that AND to risk being this weeks media showcase. It's not the same job that it was 25 years ago. It's not the same job it was 15 years ago, and I have a feeling it's going to get worse before it get's better!

[falcon2]

I have to agree with David Mudd on the issue of complaints. The hole complaint system has spun out of control in the NYPD. I've recieved a CCRB on a day when I was actually on vacation. CCRB actually entertained the complaint even though I had documentation stating that I was not working. I don't even live in the city. Final disposition of the complaint UNSUBSTANTIATED! This complaint stays on my record and enough of them is a career killer.

Complaint's like this are common today. I've also been down to CCRB on cases where the complainant doesn't know the officers name, shield or anything else. CCRB's answer to this problem is to get the roll call for that day and call all the officers who were working patrol for that day. This includes SGT's and LT's. I've gone down there with 15 other officers who all have been listed as subject's for the investigation to answer questions about something that we have had nothing to do with. Final disposition UNSUBSTANTIATED.

This system also penalizes officers who work in the busy precints who tend to accumulate more CCRB's then officers who work in slow precints.

Another problem is the quality of the civilian investigators working for CCRB. The vast majority of them are fresh out of college and this is their first job. This leads to poor investigations of the complainants claims due to lack of investigatory experience, and also to being easily pressured by the CCRB board of directors to clear a certain amount of cases in a given amount of time.

Although I am critical of the whole complaint system I do agree that we need such a system. We just can't have inexperienced and politically motivated people running these complaint sytems at the expense of officer's careers.

[Saurus]

Originally posted by falcon2:
This system also penalizes officers who work in the busy precints who tend to accumulate more CCRB's then officers who work in slow precints.


Since you're NYPD I'll assume you know of the 73 Pct in Brooklyn North. I worked there 17 years, on the street. One complaint I previously mentioned - dismissed. I know the job has changed in the 6 years I'm out, but I would still maintain that you can do the job without fear if you do it right. Unsubed complaints, as far as I know from friends still in the job, are looked at with a jaundiced eye anyway these days. As always - if you want a detail you need to make some friends. Always been that way - always will be. "The hook is dead - long live the hook" is something I heard first the day I bought my pin 32 years ago.





------------------
Bruce
NYPD, retired
http://www.geocities.com/bemmott

[David Mudd]

Originally posted by Saurus:

but I would still maintain that you can do the job without fear if you do it right. Unsubed complaints, as far as I know from friends still in the job, are looked at with a jaundiced eye anyway these days.

Well, if that's the case in New York, you are better off than most places in the US. There are a lot of places that look at the unsubstantiated complaint in the context of "if there is smoke, there is fire"!
I've met a lot of NY and NJ officers while on mission in Bosnia, and many of them seem just as disenchanted with the conditions of law enforcement today as those who have posted here.

[Don]

Bruce,

The biggest problems with unsubstantiated complaints stems from the fact that if you do get sued and it winds up in court, the plaintiff

[David Mudd]

Originally posted by Don:
I have known supervisors who have made the statement to the troops that they like nothing better than busting an officer for something!


Don, is it just me, or are these supervisors usually the ones who, as officers, were the biggest policy and procedure violators the department had?

[Don]

Yep!

[jellybean40]

my ex-husband had the fold-over badge holder with license in one side. usually when he handed that to the ofcr, he got it back with a "have a nice day" or something close to that. he also was not stopped often. when i was stopped during the time we were married, an FOP member sticker was on the truck, and i was usually asked about it and gave his name. neither one of use abused the "privlege". i was once told by a young officer who stopped me that because i was married to a cop, that did not give me license to speed. which is true, there are speeding laws for a reason. especially in the lower residential zones.

[D. Ridley]

Hello all,

If you dont know already, I'm a cop in a small town in Alabama. I wanted to say that last year two Detectives from the NYPD came to my department to investigate a murder suspect who fled to my jurisdiction.

Before I met them I assumed that they would have a "better than you" attitude because of where they were from. I have to say that I was wrong! These guys were VERY professional and became "part of the team." I enjoyed the experience and I wish I could meet more cops from around the country.

Y'all be safe!

[Don]

D. Ridley
I wish I could meet more cops from around the country.

Give it time, you will!

------------------
"Don't pee on my leg and tell me it's raining". . . Judge Judy
6P1 (retired)

[This message has been edited by Don (edited 12-18-2000).]

[Bob Morris]

Ok, two things here:

1. After reading all the posts chastising me for constantly exceeding the speed limit, I see you, cops, ain't angels yourselves. Of course, I do not blame you. Everyone has a right to speed, especially you with your advanced training. But using your badge to avoid a ticket? Hello! Not that I don't like it, and not that I would ever write a speeding ticket to a fellow cop (unless a total jerk or intoxicated), but still!

2. And this one is just amazing, a total shocker--cops pulling over other cops in marked vehicles for speeding??? This is such nonsense, it's not even funny. This is beyond ridiculous. This gives the word "retardation" a brand-new meaning and takes it to previously unknown heights. I am simply speechless.

[Red5]

Ok I will accept all the "rookie" and "Robocop" replies after I post this, espically since I don't start the academy for a another couple of months.

I agree with DARECOP, we cite and arrest people for offenses of the law. Shouldn't we expect the same when we are on someone else's "turf"?
An infraction of the law is the same anywhere. Overtly trying to get out of the ticket just seems not quite right. Everyone (self included) is in a hurry from time to time.
I would say there is nothing much you can do what can you do besides having an "FOP" license plate, the rear window covered in Sheriff Assoc. and State Police Stickers, you driver's license photo taken of you in uniform, with your badge and radio on, and telling the citing officer you have a weapon because your a cop in another muncipality. Other than that leave it up to that magic phrase "Officer Descretion" http://www.officer.com/ubb/smile.gif http://www.officer.com/ubb/tongue.gif

Seriously, I still think "expecting" and overtly asking is a little bit underhanded.

Scott

[EPD209]

I guess I am also one of those wiseass cops from the Northeast...I am from NJ and damn proud of it...and yes we do have a thing called PROFESSIONAL COURTESEY UP here...It goes along with a thing called Unity and Respect....My father is on the job for 31 years My godfather retired from NYPD>..we are all city cops....The first thing I was taught was you never hurt anonther cop no matter what...Oh my god I should do 10 miles over the speed limit on my way home from midnights after having to tell a mother her 14 yr old boy got his brains blown out of his head....God forbid we should speed ..drink or have pre martial sex..all us cops are suppose to be all saints you know....And last time I looked in 2C the New Jersey Criminal law speeding was not a felony....I have been pulled over by other agencies and states and have given a license and stated by the way I am a police officer sorry for screwing up and never have gotten a hard time...Thank god up here we have very strong police unions....Were in some hick and small towns the have no unions ..so they have no sense for UNITY OR BROTHERHOOD....We have PBA days and we get together with cops and cops families from all over the state and I would hurt anonther brother and union member over a petty motor vehicle violation....I am disgusted about some stuff I read on this forum on how some states treat other officers especially down south I case you dont remember all we have is each other We are on the same side...US VS THEM...the bad guys....Oh yeah lets just give the cop or cops wife a ticket who cares if his insurance goes up or he gets jammed up at work or loses his career...I cannot ever comprehend that way of thinking..>We are all brothers and we need to stay strong and stick together especially in these times when everyone is against us...Thats how we feel up in the northeast..>Its US VS THEM>..WE STICK TOGETHER HERE BOTTOM LINE...If you write anonther cop you are not only hurting him you are going against your Union which up here you are probaly in the same one.....Maybe we some of us should go down south or whereever and set some unions up...Then you would have a better concept of UNITY and BROTHERHOOD....Remember all we have is each other ....You get no where by hurting anonther cop.....So lets stop looking at each other as Different and stick together ..As for those on this forum who mocked the NYPD probaly couldnt ever spend a day pushing around a radio car in Harlem Brooklyn or anywhere else...trust me if you had to do their job you would have an attitude too...try spending 15 hours in central booking on one arrest and then drive home...so how you feel and then some suburban cop stops you and breaks your balls for petty non sense...

[Guard Dog]

I don't care where the cop is from, I believe in professional courtesy. Show me a badge and ID or retired badge/and ID and go have a nice day.(unless the cop makes an total ***** of him/herself..and then they have to really step in it)

Maybe because I work an urban area and I know what it's like to be in the deep $h*t waiting for backup, I don't see giving a pass to a fellow cop as being a big deal.

Nobody is getting a bounty to write tickets. EVERYBODY NEEDS TO GET TOGETHER ON THIS!!!!! North, South, East or West, I don't care. We're all cops and the ONLY thing we can extend to each other is courtesy!!!



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"We herd sheep, we drive cattle, we lead people. Lead me, follow me, or get out of my way." General George S. Patton

[BRICKCOP]

AMEN TO THE LAST TWO POSTS!!!!!!

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"He was a bad lawyer, but he was the most sensible looking man talking nonsense I ever saw". -D.O.

[Niteshift]

Damn it. http://www.officer.com/ubb/frown.gif

I am so sick and F-ing tired of some cops getting all bent out of shape over an remark I made that was taken completely out of context.

I thought this thread was finally dead, but someone else had to bring it back up again. This entire thread was taken way out of context and the whole thing fell apart.

Comments like this "As for those on this forum who mocked the NYPD probaly couldnt ever spend a day pushing around a radio car in Harlem Brooklyn or anywhere else" are what helped it get so far out of hand. What does that prove? That being NYPD makes someone superior? Ever heard of Miami? Atlanta? Dallas? Not exactly Mayberry guys.

I'm personally sick of this thread. It caused a lot of hard feeling among a lot of people, most of which was undeserved. We're all cops. If we can't count on each other, then who can we count on. All people are asking is to be a little courteous and not have an attitude. That's all.



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Niteshift-
Perseverate In Pugna

[Don]

Yeah Nite, I agree with you. Did you notice which troll brought it back to life? Figures. . .

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Confession may be good for your soul but it may be bad for your career.
6P1 (retired)

[Rebecca]

Originally posted by Don:
Figures. . .

Don, I feel your "figures" is in great need of a roll eyes face. Here you go... Figures... http://www.officer.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif ..... http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

Niteshift... you're right about this thread causing hard feelings... and how unfortunate that really is/was/could be again. http://www.officer.com/ubb/frown.gif

Here, for those who haven't seen this... and even for those who have but may have forgotten... please go right down to numbers 49 and 50. Then, click the link and check those answers. If number 49's answer doesn't show you how this has been one of the roughest threads we've ever had here, then number 50's answer should remind you to turn it around and be kind in your replies to each other.

http://www.officer.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000823.html



[This message has been edited by Rebecca (edited 02-17-2001).]

[blondie72]

should remind you to turn it around and be kind in your replies to each other.

I'm not an LEO, but i thought what happened on this thread was a big shame.

Your last remark perfectly expresses my sentiments, Becca.

[Don]

Becca,

Ayup! http://www.officer.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif http://www.officer.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif http://www.officer.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif http://www.officer.com/ubb/redface.gif

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Confession may be good for your soul but it may be bad for your career.
6P1 (retired)

[Nokomis]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Saurus:
By way of intro, I am retired from the NYPD since 1994 after serving 25 years, the last 17 in one of the toughest precincts in the city. Member of the NYPD Honor Legion and recipient of numerous awards for service and bravery. Not bragging - just FYI. In other words, I've "been there - done that."


Hi Bruce,I remember your Web Site.You have information on Scotland.Would you happen to know the answers to the Clan Chattan and the the Sheild of "Cats" and the "Hogs or Swine -Gods" of Celts??I wrote a subject on Various Topics and I cannot get back into a program I have.So.If you could assist I would appreciate it.

[INDIANADICK]

I'm very disappointed in the attitudes of some of my fellow police officers. I'm disappointed that any of you would consider writing another officer a traffic ticket, and I'm disappointed in the hostility of those with a differing opinion. Someday we may need the assistance of an American hero such as one of these.

[Bob Morris]

Originally posted by INDIANADICK:
I'm very disappointed in the attitudes of some of my fellow police officers. I'm disappointed that any of you would consider writing another officer a traffic ticket, and I'm disappointed in the hostility of those with a differing opinion. Someday we may need the assistance of an American hero such as one of these.

Someday you may need the assistance of a civilian. Should you stop writing tickets at all then? I agree it's kind of odd for a cop to ticket another cop for speeding, but if the speeding cop is a complete jerk, are you just gonna say "Nice meeting you" and let him go?

[INDIANADICK]

Bob,
You are correct in stating that someday we may need the assistance of civilians. Civilians will certainly be more likely to help us if they believe in what we do, such as putting bad guys in jail where they belong. In most cases I don't think writing tickets to decent people is anything more than harassment. Who wants that? I think officers should spend a little more time targeting their stops toward those that are most likely involved in CRIMINAL activity. Speeding is not a crime, at least not my state. However, anything can go too far, such as your previous escapade at 110MPH. Reckless driving is a crime!

Please don't misunderstand me. If an officer sees a person that fits the profile, then speeding, even at 5MPH over the limit, is as good a reason to stop them as anything else. I just think we can all recognize Grandma coming home from the grocery and the like.

[Bob Morris]

I like your approach. Does your department do racial profiling, or have you been sufficiently harassed by the feds?

[Guard Dog]

Originally posted by Bob Morris:
I like your approach. Does your department do racial profiling, or have you been sufficiently harassed by the feds?

Bob,
On each one of your posts the flame seems to get a little higher. http://www.officer.com/ubb/frown.gif Too bad someone doesn't blow it out http://www.officer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif.

You last was definitely a flame post. Racial Profiling/Harassed by the Fed's. Go back under your bridge.



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"We herd sheep, we drive cattle, we lead people. Lead me, follow me, or get out of my way." General George S. Patton

[Niteshift]

Guard Dog, ask and ye shall recieve.........

Notice the unregistered under bob's name http://www.officer.com/ubb/smile.gif

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Niteshift-
Perseverate In Pugna

[INDIANADICK]

Bob,
Your response seems to indicate that racial profiling is a good thing and something we do until the federal government chages our ways. I hope you don't really believe that. Profiling simply means to make a quick determination of whether someone requires more of your attention based upon your previous experience. I would be surprised to learn that there is an officer in this country that doesn't do that. Some officers have been accused of using race upon which to base their decision to act. If they are doing this then they are wrong. So, are we off topic yet? http://www.officer.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif