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93COBRA
09-16-2009, 02:07 PM
I have received three conditional offers of employment in the past year and have completed the psychological examination and the polygraph test for all three. I have not been hired by any of the departments.

I always receive an extremely vague letter starting out “Although it was a difficult decision”; “Unfortunately, after careful consideration” etc. There is never a definite reason why I was not hired.

How do I find out why I was not hired?

I have heard that since it was a conditional offer of employment because they administered a medical test (psychological exam), they must tell you a specific reason why they did not hire you, or they must hire you. If they do not, then it would violate the EEO or some other law that I cannot find.

Any information on this would be much appreciated.

RoadKingTrooper
09-16-2009, 02:26 PM
I have received three conditional offers of employment in the past year and have completed the psychological examination and the polygraph test for all three. I have not been hired by any of the departments.

I always receive an extremely vague letter starting out “Although it was a difficult decision”; “Unfortunately, after careful consideration” etc. There is never a definite reason why I was not hired.

How do I find out why I was not hired?

I have heard that since it was a conditional offer of employment because they administered a medical test (psychological exam), they must tell you a specific reason why they did not hire you, or they must hire you. If they do not, then it would violate the EEO or some other law that I cannot find.

Any information on this would be much appreciated.

Think you just answered your own question

ChiTownDet
09-16-2009, 03:07 PM
Certified letter to the Police-Fire Commission of whatever town you tested for. If you don't like the answer, hiring a lawyer is your next step, but remember that you can be fired for any reason while on probation, without any recourse.

mjw5678
09-16-2009, 05:41 PM
in most application packets it will state right in there that they DO NOT HAVE TO GIVE YOU A REASON

ChgoPaintball
09-16-2009, 06:29 PM
Because they hired the intern over you. j/k

Ask for the reason. But like mjw stated, they dont have to give you a reason. It could be a number of reasons.

Edge06128
09-16-2009, 09:24 PM
Just send them a letter like this

Hi,

I would like to know why I didnt get hired. Please let me know, Thank you.

ccsd0601
09-16-2009, 11:06 PM
Just send them a letter like this

Hi,

I would like to know why I didnt get hired. Please let me know, Thank you.

LMAO... Don't start.
Please let me know, thank you.

L-1
09-17-2009, 12:25 AM
Your can probably answer your own question with a little deductive reasoning.

The Americans with Disabilities Act prohibits an employer from subjecting an applicant to a medical (including a psych) except in connection with a bona fide offer of employment. That's where the conditional offer of employment comes in. It usually reads, "You are officered employment subject to you successfully passing medical and psychological examinations for the position you have applied for."

If after completing those exams they declined to hire you, its a good bet that you failed one or both of them. You might consider writing them a letter pointing out that you received a conditional offer of employment that was withdrawn for no apparent reason and ask why. Be forewarned, if it is a medical or psych issue, they will simply tell you that you failed that portion of the exam and will not discuss the fine points of those medical issues or debate the matter with you. Police officers are not doctors and lack the expertise necessary to discuss medicine with you. They are simply relying on their outside physician's evaluation of you in relation to whatever the department and state standards are. Similarly, they are not going to pay their outside physician his $300 per hour fee to chat with you about the matter.

If they decline to give a reason and it is a civil service department, you may retain counsel and file an appeal before the city/county civil service board. Traditionally, civil service agencies do not have the discretion to arbitrarily remove you from the process without just cause and during the appeal process, they will have to state and substantiate a reason that falls within civil service rules for disqualification. If it is a medical issue, you will be able to provide a second opinion from your own physician as to whether you meet the required standards.

SeVere
09-17-2009, 06:28 PM
Your can probably answer your own question with a little deductive reasoning.

The Americans with Disabilities Act prohibits an employer from subjecting an applicant to a medical (including a psych) except in connection with a bona fide offer of employment. That's where the conditional offer of employment comes in. It usually reads, "You are officered employment subject to you successfully passing medical and psychological examinations for the position you have applied for."

If after completing those exams they declined to hire you, its a good bet that you failed one or both of them. You might consider writing them a letter pointing out that you received a conditional offer of employment that was withdrawn for no apparent reason and ask why. Be forewarned, if it is a medical or psych issue, they will simply tell you that you failed that portion of the exam and will not discuss the fine points of those medical issues or debate the matter with you. Police officers are not doctors and lack the expertise necessary to discuss medicine with you. They are simply relying on their outside physician's evaluation of you in relation to whatever the department and state standards are. Similarly, they are not going to pay their outside physician his $300 per hour fee to chat with you about the matter.

If they decline to give a reason and it is a civil service department, you may retain counsel and file an appeal before the city/county civil service board. Traditionally, civil service agencies do not have the discretion to arbitrarily remove you from the process without just cause and during the appeal process, they will have to state and substantiate a reason that falls within civil service rules for disqualification. If it is a medical issue, you will be able to provide a second opinion from your own physician as to whether you meet the required standards.

And for the love of God, It's not FAILED the psychological examination, It is that testing individual merely did not match the desired psychological profile of the department. ;)

ChgoPaintball
09-17-2009, 08:30 PM
And for the love of God, It's not FAILED the psychological examination, It is that testing individual merely did not match the desired psychological profile of the department. ;)

so what if im "coco" for coacoa puffs? McGruff is a dog and he got the job. why cant i. Shut up voice in my head. I know he is a cartoon, but its the principal. No im not hungry. Pizza sounds good.

LOL....Eh been up since 5am. Need Mt dew.....scratch that. need to work out.

skigoggles
09-17-2009, 10:13 PM
Because someone else was a better match for the position, that is why you wern't hired

93COBRA
09-18-2009, 12:49 AM
"better match"

Someone else had a better haircut or they knew someone.......

I am hearing too many rumors that the collar counties are getting more and more political. I don't take rumors like the Gospel, but there have been many matching rumors from reputable sources. Too bad I don't know anyone to "lube the deal" for me anywhere.

I paid the money to get my Poly results, and surprise, I'm not a liar. If I could get my psychological examination results, I would bet big money I was good to go. It probably all comes down to the haircut.

I'd feel better if the letter read, "After careful consideration, we did not like your haircut. Good luck in the future, and try a new haircut."

This is what I get from all of your great opinions; they can choose not to hire you at any point in the process, simply because they do not like your face and not have to tell you any of the details about it. You can fight it, but there isn't anything to gain. You can't force them to hire you.

I'm not going to hire a lawyer or do anything else. It is really their loss.

I'm going to keep testing and my number will come up.

Thanks guys, good luck out there.

L-1
09-18-2009, 01:17 AM
Just out of curiosity, did you apply with a civil service agency or with an "at will" agency that is exempt from civil service and where you serve at the pleasure of the appointing authority?

StudChris
09-18-2009, 01:20 AM
There's a million agencies in Il and the surrounding areas. If you want the job that much, quit complaining and trying to find out what THEY did wrong, and instead figure out what YOU'RE doing wrong and put in more application for other places.

fairgame
09-18-2009, 12:21 PM
I feel your pain cobra. I'm in the process of filing a lawsuit soon but I'm looking at which lawyer to represent me. The lawsuit will include, harrassment, intimidation, discrimination etc during a polygraph. If I'm applying for a law enforcement position with no criminal record, a degree in criminal justice, I shouldnt be harrassed and treated like crap. Its not even about monetary gain, its about being treating fairly and unbiased. Do they understand what Equal Opportunity Employer means? Harrassing me that I'm a gang member because I'm hispanic and have short hair is just plain wrong(thats racial profiling/discrimination), and trying to get a confession out of me and that isnt even true. What? They rather that I lie to satisfy their wild accusations, then tell the truth? Im not backing down, I will see them in court.

StudChris
09-18-2009, 03:15 PM
I feel your pain cobra. I'm in the process of filing a lawsuit soon but I'm looking at which lawyer to represent me. The lawsuit will include, harrassment, intimidation, discrimination etc during a polygraph. If I'm applying for a law enforcement position with no criminal record, a degree in criminal justice, I shouldnt be harrassed and treated like crap. Its not even about monetary gain, its about being treating fairly and unbiased. Do they understand what Equal Opportunity Employer means? Harrassing me that I'm a gang member because I'm hispanic and have short hair is just plain wrong(thats racial profiling/discrimination), and trying to get a confession out of me and that isnt even true. What? They rather that I lie to satisfy their wild accusations, then tell the truth? Im not backing down, I will see them in court.

Haha... have fun with that one. I seriously laughed to myself when I read your post. "What!?!?!? You won't hire me!?!?!? You used psychological interview techniques during my poly!?!?!?!? I obviously have no clue what EEO is (by the way... it's Equal Employment Opportunity), but I'm going to SUE YOU!!! I'll see you in court mwhahahahaha!!!"

Actually, I really hope that they were planning on hiring you after the poly because you stuck to your guns, then decided that they found "a better match". Good luck finding a lawyer that won't charge you prior to taking the case.

fairgame
09-18-2009, 03:32 PM
yeah I also laughed when I read your post, since you cant even write a complete sentence. bwahaha lmao. Umm, and you should check how many people are winning lawsuits against county. There are many. So if you dont have anything intelligent to say **** off.

StudChris
09-18-2009, 03:46 PM
yeah I also laughed when I read your post, since you cant even write a complete sentence. bwahaha lmao. Umm, and you should check how many people are winning lawsuits against county. There are many. So if you dont have anything intelligent to say **** off.

I actually don't know what you just said. Anyway, good luck with your future endeavors, whatever they may be.

NEC1234
09-18-2009, 06:31 PM
"better match"

Someone else had a better haircut or they knew someone.......

I am hearing too many rumors that the collar counties are getting more and more political. I don't take rumors like the Gospel, but there have been many matching rumors from reputable sources. Too bad I don't know anyone to "lube the deal" for me anywhere.

I paid the money to get my Poly results, and surprise, I'm not a liar. If I could get my psychological examination results, I would bet big money I was good to go. It probably all comes down to the haircut.

I'd feel better if the letter read, "After careful consideration, we did not like your haircut. Good luck in the future, and try a new haircut."

This is what I get from all of your great opinions; they can choose not to hire you at any point in the process, simply because they do not like your face and not have to tell you any of the details about it. You can fight it, but there isn't anything to gain. You can't force them to hire you.

I'm not going to hire a lawyer or do anything else. It is really their loss.

I'm going to keep testing and my number will come up.

Thanks guys, good luck out there.

You have the right attitude, here. I've been given two "thanks but not thanks" letters without justification and, while it certainly hurts, you have to understand the position these people are in. Suburban departments (assuming that's where you applied) have HUGE applicant pools to cherry pick their prospective officers from. When it's coming down to a ratio of interviews per position offered, I'm guessing it's 5:1 for most suburbs. They can afford to have ridiculous standards and (perhaps subconsciously) select those that fit their image of a cop they'd like to have working for them.

Whenever people ask me where I want to be a police officer I tell them Chicago. Not because it's an ideal place (read Second City Cop to confirm that), but because it's the best opportunity I have to be hired. Don't be discouraged, Cobra. If you're qualified enough, you'll get on somewhere eventually. Just stay out of trouble.

Illinois Edmond
09-20-2009, 06:48 PM
I think there are very few people who get hired at the first/only department they apply to.

Times are difficult right now, everyone wants to be the police. Hey, it's a steady job, right? When there are more applicants, depts. can be more picky in who they hire and who fits into their dept.

But when times get better, there will be less applicants and when you are still applying/testing, and gaining knowledge after every test/interview, you will get onto a dept. Keep faith and stay strong.

fairgame,

I could imagine you suing a criminal when he yells at you or treats you unfairly with psychological and emotional stress. You sound like you're straight from the freakin' entitlement generation.:rolleyes:

skigoggles
09-20-2009, 11:40 PM
I feel your pain cobra. I'm in the process of filing a lawsuit soon but I'm looking at which lawyer to represent me. The lawsuit will include, harrassment, intimidation, discrimination etc during a polygraph. If I'm applying for a law enforcement position with no criminal record, a degree in criminal justice, I shouldnt be harrassed and treated like crap. Its not even about monetary gain, its about being treating fairly and unbiased. Do they understand what Equal Opportunity Employer means? Harrassing me that I'm a gang member because I'm hispanic and have short hair is just plain wrong(thats racial profiling/discrimination), and trying to get a confession out of me and that isnt even true. What? They rather that I lie to satisfy their wild accusations, then tell the truth? Im not backing down, I will see them in court.

If it doesnt fit you must acquit!

But yeah, you are right, with criminal record I don't see why the county didn't come to your house and ask to hire you instead of waiting for you to take the test. With a degree in criminal justice I'd surprised they even let you take the test and didn't just give you a paycheck.

Posting about your "pending legal action" is very impressive. I know if I worked for the county I'd be intimidated.
Or I'd probably just laugh about it. Seriously, if you had such a winning case you wouldn't need to "look for a lawyer" they'd find you. That and you wouldn't need to post about it.